What's up with all the chopping

[Guyon]

Well there's a line there between trolling and stimulating conversation and it seems to move around a lot

Just wait... runningboar's next thread will be "What's up with all these Busses".

 

[tarmix101]

Just wait... runningboar's next thread will be "What's up with all these Busses".

LMAO.... can't wait for that one. The "Hogs and Piglets" will come out in force for that one.

Wait.... haven't we gone over that before?!?!

 

[kgd]

Guyon - can I just ask where the heck you put all your stuff?
(I'm also expecting to see a line up of fifteen sheds in every type of siding imaginable)

 

[rick43t3]

It seems every other thread on this forum is about chopping and what chops better. What is all this chopping about, does everyone live in the far north and has to chop copius amounts of firewood to make up for the poor or lack of gear you brought. Or maybe tents and tarps are not allowed where you are from so everytime you go to the woods you have to build a log cabin. Or maybe that is just what you like to do in the woods, instead of enjoying nature or hunting or fishing you enjoy chopping things.

Down here in the warm, free south I very, very rarely chop and would not think of choosing a woods knife with chopping as a criteria. Not to mention in most instances I don't agree with chopping live trees and my saw works wonders on the dead stuff.

I realize the can of worms I am opening here, but geez enough of the "You really need something to chop with in the woods" threads, in the frozen north maybe, but all of us don't live in the north. Chris

Your'e right. They should saw a saw in half with a saw, see.

 

[Guyon]

Guyon - can I just ask where the heck you put all your stuff?
(I'm also expecting to see a line up of fifteen sheds in every type of siding imaginable)

It's all buried out back in PVC. I do get tired of digging sometimes.

Some of the trip wires and mines have to be moved every time I start a new hole, and that sets the guard dogs to barking. Insanity.

 

[CanDo]

Oh cool. PM me when you get it done, please, so I don't miss it.

My big complaint with khukuri's is those handles they come with. I've never held one, but they look quite uncomfortable. But then, that might just be an excuse to play around with re-handling the thing....

Well, having not paid for my membership, I can't PM you, so I'll just copy&paste what I have to say about the handle here. Beware, it's not proofread yet. Full review goes up tomorrow.

"The wood section of the handle is 4.5" (11.4cm) long and is of an ideal thickness. People with small hands shouldn't have a problem, yet those with large hands will still find plenty to grab onto. Two features separate this handle from any that I've seen before. At the back, it flares both upwards and downwards. At first, I was skeptical of this design, as it seemed the upward flare would impede downward swinging, yet I didn't think that a few centuries of bladesmiths could really be wrong. It was slightly awkward to hold the first few times, since I was used to more traditional handles, but it quickly won me over. The upward flare doesn't get in the way of downward swinging, and actually makes the grip more secure. The second peculiar feature is the large ridge in the middle of the handle. It too has proven to be a clever feature; by resting between two fingers and gripping the palm, it locks the hand in place and affords more control over the blade. For most tasks, this ridge rests between the middle and ring fingers, but if more control is desired, it can be placed between the ring and little fingers, or beneath all of the fingers (with thumb and forefinger resting on the bolster). In my time with this knife, the ability to 'lock in' at each place on the handle has proven useful. Further enhancing ergonomics is the drop in size from the area forward of the ridge to that behind it, (about 3/16", .5cm in height). This helps the ring and little finger secure a good grip. These features combine to make an exceptionally secure grip out of a natural material - something very important when more than a pound and half of razor sharp steel is being swung about. "

Oh, and what about pics?

9.5" Diameter, oh yeah

 

[DOC-CANADA]

I am talking about less than 1 inch diameter trees especially green. I have seen and nearly done myself, a hatchet bounced and glance off a small green limb and nearly kneecap myself. I personally find hatchets dangerous.

But whatever works I guess.

Skam

I have to agree with Skammer on this. I used to use hatchets, an Estwing was my favourite but too many stories of accidents and a couple of close calls myself, over the last 50 years, so I stopped using them.

Maybe 20-25 years ago, a new buddy came with us on a canoe trip. He said how come you guys don't use machetes? (He was from Jamaica). I replied that we didn't have any sugar cane in northern Ontario.

Anyway, the next time he came on a trip, he brought a machete and subsequently demonstrated how he used it. (a Bolo machete) Probably, if you had a keen eye, a stable platform, etc., a hatchet would outcut the machete on the type of wood you find up here, but in a canoe, trying to cut a few branches out of the way, that machete was king. We also started using them for fire wood prep, limbing saplings for shelters, etc. and we were hooked. For the last bunch of years, I've used the Becker Machax but still for the same reasons. I also have machetes that I sometimes take along instead of the Machax. Still work as good now as they did then. But as has been said, over and over, USE WHAT WORKS FOR YOU!

Doc

 

[DOC-CANADA]

CanDo,

Please cut it out (no pun intended). I can't afford more knives.

Doc

 

[bulgron]

9.5" Diameter, oh yeah

Thanks for this section of the review. It answers a lot of things for me.

What size is that khuk? I've been contemplating the Ang Khola in either 12" or 15", but since I have no way to actually get my hands on one it's hard to decide. Frankly, I suspect the 12" would be more than adequate for my needs, since I think a "big" knife is my 5.5" Mountaineer II.

 

[bulgron]

CanDo,

Please cut it out (no pun intended). I can't afford more knives.

Doc

lol. My wife always tells me that no matter how big the meal, there's always room in the "dessert compartment."

In that vein, I think every budget has room for one more knife.

 

[Bernoulli]

Chop all you want, but it will never be as efficient as a saw. Oh my gosh; the saw won't split wood.... maybe I could saw up a smaller piece. Would that work? But, if it floats your boat....

 

[Bushman5]

To the OP, try clearing overhanging limbs from a trail all day with a hatchet, then get back to me after you get out of hospital. A large chopper (for ME), bet it a machete or any one of my 12" - 14" small knives is vastly superior for cleaving off the overhanging brush and limbs on the trails. It snicks thru the wood and leaves a clean cut.

When i go into the woods, i make shelters, i chop for fun, i make firewood, i cut apples in half etc etc etc. The 12" - 14" knives that i carry feel like an extension of my hand, a precise surgical tool for chopping. Smaller knives k\just feel wimpy to me.

dad said it best:

"would you rather cleave thru a limb easily, with a big knife, or try to FORCE a small knife thru, possibily resulting in injury?"

each to their own though.

 

[Thomas Linton]

Guyon - can I just ask where the heck you put all your stuff?
(I'm also expecting to see a line up of fifteen sheds in every type of siding imaginable)

You can stack em' in 5 gal. buckets - maybe grouped by type.

(Be careful the bottoms don't fall out.)

 

[Cpl Punishment]

Well all this hatchet bouncing off green wood, and 1" diameter got me motivated. I have about 10 yellow pine trees on my property. One of them has a large branch that has grown into my Kids swing. So out came the Lee Reeves, and Wetterlings medium hunter.

Wetterlings measures 19" OAL. The Lee Reeves is 14 1/2" OAL. Wetterlings is about 24 oz, and the Reeves is about 20 oz.

The Wetterlings was only used to take the limb from the tree, which it did with one chop. The limb at it's thickness is about 2 1/2" in diameter. It's been snowing and raining (warmed up today) for the last three days here in Spokane so everything is wet.

. . .

Here is the branch at it's thickest laying accost a straw bale:

Using the keener side of my Reeves I took one big swing at the thicker base of the limb and.... well two chops and it was in half:

Here is a spot where there was a fairly large knot. Two swings and it was in half:

The smaller 1" to 1/4" diameter limbs was not even a challenge for the hatchet. With about a 1/4 swing and off the came:

You know, I had a real problem with what Skammer, among others was saying about knives outchopping hatchets and kukris. But, thinking it over, I think they mean while it's still standing, or at least chopping it without backing. I always try to chop with what I'm chopping backed by something else. Which is where I get my contention that no knife (I do not consider kukris, bolos, goloks or machetes to be "knives", I consider them a separate class) will outchop a hatchet or kukri. However, if freestanding, and the wrong technique is used hatchets and kuks will bounce off.
Now I've found that if using a hatchet or kukri on a small diameter piece of wood, or vine or something, the primary chop should be away from the point of anchor. I.E. the primary chop would be upward for the sapling, the sapling itself, via it's anchored roots providing the tension necessary for the chop. Most people naturally make the downward strok the primary, and the upward to be the opne to remove the chip.
I've also found that you need to decrease the angle of incidence when chopping light wood and vegetation. Instead of hacking out a 90 degree angle (45 each side), try a 120 to 160 degree angle. When I did this with my kukri, the branch that it had, indeed bounced off of with a 45 degree angle, came off with a single stroke. Same thing with a hatchet.

A khukri would do very well, check out the chiruwa line from HI.

Hear! Hear! I can't say enough about kukris. I was a die hard hatchet man, and it was really hard for me to accept the kukri as my primary chopper. But it's outchopped everything I own save for a full sized axe. Now, of course it is a 20" Chiruwa Ang Khola, which is a brute, even by kukri standards.


One other thing, with a hatchet or kukri (I assume with a golok as well, I don't own one) the momentum of the tool does the work, not you forcing it. Now I've seen many a kukri and hatchet (and soem have seen big knives) go through softwood branches over 2" diameter and hardwoods over 1.5" diameter with a single swing. Now saws may be quieter, but faster and less effort? No, unless you are talking a buck saw going through a 12" diameter tree. But for most wood gathering, I find a 3 second swing to be faster and less effort than sawing for 30 seconds.

 

[CanDo]

Chop all you want, but it will never be as efficient as a saw. Oh my gosh; the saw won't split wood.... maybe I could saw up a smaller piece. Would that work? But, if it floats your boat....

Have you considered that splitting wood is for more than just making a fire, such as making bows? You can use choppers for cutting food, stunning trapped animals, as a spatula, as a draw knife, and as a hammer. Can you clear thin brush with your saw?
You bring a saw into the wilderness, I'll bring a chopper; let's see who's living more comfortably in a week

 

[NuclearBossHog]

A chopping/heavy cutting tool is an essential part of outdoor/survival gear, but I have always felt that it is absolutely stupid to chop with a knife....it is just the wrong tool for that job! If you are in the northern woods, bring a hatchet/axe (or at least a saw), and if you are in the tropics a machete.

If I am traveling ultralight (backpacking), I compromise by carrying an extremely light Gerber saw. On my ATV I carry a Gerber (Fiskars) Sport Axe when traveling light, or if I am traveling heavier the Gerber Camp Axe. In the truck, it's the full size Gerber Axe.

The Sport Axe in particular is a nice combination between chopping capability and light weight, and it is what I usually prefer to carry.

good for you. Not everyone thinks like you. I could just as easily say that it is stupid to attempt to cut and slice with an axe, so why use it for that. There are more uses for a knife than an axe. Makes sense:thumbup:

 

[tarmix101]

You know, I had a real problem with what Skammer, among others was saying about knives outchopping hatchets and kukris. But, thinking it over, I think they mean while it's still standing, or at least chopping it without backing. I always try to chop with what I'm chopping backed by something else. Which is where I get my contention that no knife (I do not consider kukris, bolos, goloks or machetes to be "knives", I consider them a separate class) will outchop a hatchet or kukri. However, if freestanding, and the wrong technique is used hatchets and kuks will bounce off.
Now I've found that if using a hatchet or kukri on a small diameter piece of wood, or vine or something, the primary chop should be away from the point of anchor. I.E. the primary chop would be upward for the sapling, the sapling itself, via it's anchored roots providing the tension necessary for the chop. Most people naturally make the downward strok the primary, and the upward to be the opne to remove the chip.
I've also found that you need to decrease the angle of incidence when chopping light wood and vegetation. Instead of hacking out a 90 degree angle (45 each side), try a 120 to 160 degree angle. When I did this with my kukri, the branch that it had, indeed bounced off of with a 45 degree angle, came off with a single stroke. Same thing with a hatchet.

I understand what your getting at, and I agree. A free standing sapling, or tree that is small in diameter can be a problem with a hatchet. Now I have never had one bounce off, but I have missed before, and yes it came damn close to sinking into my shin. A machete, Kuhk, or large blade with more cutting area is easier in this case

With the proper technique a hatchet, or axe can be used safely in this situation, but non the less, I agree with what your getting at.

 

[JackBauer24]

other than splitting something to make a hearth for the bow/drill, I don't see much use for chopping.

 

[roughedges]

Me and my "chopper" are the scourge of florida's non-native invasive species! I destroy them any time I am out and about and the only people who take issue with it are those who know nothing about the area's ecology.

 

[Yoshi]

Well I think it depnds on where you live and what your mind set is, I live near a nice woodland area, and when I go abroad I like mountains and jungle terrain. Personally I have found the khukuri to be the best overall tool out there, you have great control in the hand, they chop great, they draw cut great, they make good shavings, you can split wood by making wedges, you have usually have a small back up knife with your kuk, a chakmak for striking flint and burnishing the blade, and they are great for defending yourself with as well.