Where are they going?

I think you cant forget the business aspect of it either.

On bladeforums, it costs ~75 usd to be a knife maker and ~300 to be a supplier.

The average post in the for sale threads gets about 100 views, and its pretty regular for people to dog pile you for what they see as unauthorized sale posts or advertising anywhere but the rarely trafficked for sale sections.

Where as on instagram, no one accuses you of sale postings, no one claims you are ruining the website with your post of a knife that includes a price. And you have a much better market. Not just more makers, but you can get seen by hunters, collectors, chefs and more on Instagram. And they find you.

Here is how I see it.

You have one place where you have to pay, cant advertise, has a small, mainly knife maker demographic without the potential for serious expansion and if seem like you are advertising the platform turns against you,

VS

Free way to see other makers, collectors, suppliers and buyers where you can advertise all you want and in a second send a message to anyone about ordering. On the forum, if a buyer doesnt have a paid membership, good luck messaging them. Instagram lets you message someone in a second.

If i am a maker or supplier, I see very few reasons to spend more time on the forum than on something like instagram.
 
Good evening,
Something to consider, we all age. As we gain skills and learn techniques time passes. We get older. By the time we have become proficient at this we look about and see we are no longer young. Me, I've gotten to be 75 as I was learning, as I was making a thousand knives. Now that I've garnered all this information and accompanying skill sets that go with it; I find I now go to bed at 9:30 and no longer stay up late hanging out on the forums, sharing information.

I do still make knives, just not so fast as I used to.

Good evening gentlemen, Fred


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I like this forum. I don't sweat what others say. I just post and enjoy the other posts. I learn a lot and try to give back where I can. It's good stuff. Maybe not the best sales location, but heck, where can you hang out and hear from other knife makers all around the world and what they are doing?
I've always puzzled about charging those who share their great talents. It does seem to be a bit of a negative feedback loop. But it's not my site and I don't care that much.

This is one of my favorite cartoons. Luckily I found this early on in my internet journey and have tried to incorporate the implied lesson in my activities

index.png .
 
Its bot only here, its also on other forums: Forums are a dying breed.

Too complicated to use, especially to upload pictures. FB or instagramm are much faster and simpler to use and hav bigger reach.

As a maker i can say that you can spend your time either in the shop or in a forum. Which one of this two options is more productive?

Also everything is said and discussed a hundred times, and why should an experienced maker spend his time to answer newbies questions only because they do not want spend their time to research by themselves?
 
Just a side remark, here we have discussioms and share knolledge. We have dialogs
Social media are monologs; look what I did/think/whatever.
The world has changed and always will.
Social media will change forums but I doubt if it will ever replace them.
Just like I still and always will read paper books
 
One of the problems is that some of the moderators became dictators. They kept handing out that too many of the things going on in the forums were not to their liking even if it was trivial. Have you never seen that if something was for sale in one area and you tried to pass the info on you were told that is not allowed? It did seem to me a it became not very friendly .
 
I have to say that being around here is a really positive experience for us new to knife making. While I’ve been making “knives” for a little over 4 years now I really only became seriously interested in it after joining the forum. I try to contribute as much as possible as to not only ask questions, because it does feel (as others have said) almost like freeloading if I only come here for questions. I do feel sometimes like I’m not experienced enough to give advice to others when they ask questions.

I really come here for the people, I share every knife I work on because shop talk really does feel like a family. Even though I don’t get to post often while away at school. I used to use other social media but I’ve get bored of them or they just don’t feel necessary. Where as I browse BF every day.

To be honest the only reason I haven’t purchased a knife maker’s membership is because I don’t feel comfortable selling any of my knives yet. And I also have been trying to set up the best time to purchase a membership as to not waste that $75. If the price was lower I wouldn’t think twice about buying a membership even if I wasn’t going to fully take advantage of the perks. I’m not in anyway saying the current price is wrong or anything, just trying to explain my reasoning.

Seeing posts like these pop up makes me want to support the forum more, because you’ve all given so much priceless information. I want to be able to give the same guidance I’ve received to other so hopefully other new makers will be motivated to support the forum and contribute as well. Hopefully in time we’ll see an opposite trend than what’s happening now. Hopefully others interested in knifemaking will come here to stay as well.

Thank you, all of you,
Kevin
 
I think things like not having messages or only having a limited number of messages unless you pay is an incredibly outdated way of doing things. In the early 2000, yeah it makes sense.

But when every app in the world has a faster, better and free chat system? A private message system that works like email you have to pay for is a relic. Nothing more.
 
I still come here and lurk fairly often, but rarely do I see a question or subject which I care to respond to. Mostly because who wants to have another convo about what belts to use- also because folks who aren't tired of that yet will generally talk it out fine without any input from me. If something like more advanced pattern welding tips comes up, then I might be happy to contribute or better yet learn something. As far as membership level and the more experienced contributors, the Forums here are not that great a direct market for high end knives (fixed blades, kitchen knives for sale areas.) Marketing in the C&H forums pays off but as far as paying for a membership to directly sell knives here, by the time you are selling knives frequently for over $1K you'll probably have more reliable avenues to move them than just posting for sale here. So, since the folks with the most to add to discussions here are also the ones who may have talked about all this stuff to the point of burnout, with the fact that it's not a super meaningful direct market, means there's not a whole lot of incentive to buy membership or be engaged. Greener pastures await on other newer forms of social media (Facebook has absorbed IG, now we get to watch that get monetized and wait for the next moving train to jump onto.)
The best reason to engage here, I think, is still to help foster a breadth of knowledge of a wider range of techniques and perspectives that whatever's currently in vogue, and to keep alive the knowledge and names of the older generations of makers that came before us. I'm still shocked at times by the lack of overall "knife world" knowledge newer guys will sometimes display in conversation. "Buster Warenski?" Blank look... "Corbet Sigman? Don Fogg, who?"
OK I'm off to the shop.
 
I always credit BF as the main source of information for me when I started, and pretty much how I learned to make knives. I'm not on here as much, admittedly because A: I don't have as many questions as I used too, and B. Because it does get old answering questions that I found in the stickies WITHOUT asking questions when I was a noob. in a twist of irony, most of the makers on here that I have become (at least virtually) friends with, I am friends with on FB and we follow each other on instagram. Or I call/ email them.
 
This problem started about 5 or 6 years ago when professional knife makers were posting on the forum and did not have knife makers memberships. They were posting how to articles and WIP posts with photos that everyone liked and benefitted from . These guys were chastised for not paying the $75 membership fees even though they were the ones that provided the valuable content that made the forum such a success. Meanwhile the newbies and less experienced makers coasted buy sucking up all the knowledge without paying for it. Many of the professional makers were insulted and left the forum. I almost did also and am considering it now when my membership expires. It's kind of like publishing a magazine and not paying the writers but letting the readers have it for free. That can't last. Larry

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Also the Sales forum has not kept up with the membership. It only holds 20 threads for sales then drops off to the second page which is typically a grave yard for sales.

You then can not repost a sale for 2 weeks, and sometimes that first sale pages moves so fast due to some makers listing blades everyday.
So you may get 2 days of front page before it goes to the graveyard and have to wait 2 weeks to repost it.

I suggested opening up another sales thread for those that move off of the front page so they do not have to wait 2 weeks to repost.

It was met with crickets. How do you rationalize selling more and more knifemaker memberships but not accommodate more sales threads do to the increase memberships being sold?

So you pay $75 to be able to post a knife for sale twice in a month, when you can post it everyday on Instagram and Facebook.

When a knife does not move on Instagram maybe I will pay for a knifemakers membership again when it is worth doing so.

Being able to post a knife only 2x per month is not a real benefit for many.
 
My opinion as a beginner with a desire to learn is that this is the best place to learn and absorb. My experiences on the Facebook knife making groups is poor. I see it as 'snacking' with a continuous feed but with little continuity, depth, and just plain wrong information. Instagram is also for inspiration, ideas, and seeing what is out there, but difficult to gain content from a learning perspective.

It takes a different mindset to gain benefit from here compared to many who populate the Facebook pages. Here, one needs to do their leg work first and make an effort to absorb the significant information in the stickies and through initial searches. There is more of that instant gratification mindset on the FB pages.

I'm grateful for the knowledge here that is shared openly and hope the knowledge base stays and has patience to keep answering the same questions. My own experience is growing to the point that I can attempt to answer questions or at least point others to links, references that I found useful.
 
ashwinearl ashwinearl The best place to learn is Youtube. Many of those makers who left here post on youtube and you can find the correct answer and technique with some diligent research.

I like the community of knifemakers here, but when I want to see a technique or information most the time Youtube is the place to find it.
 
Salem- a couple of years ago, I was checking into my hotel for the Blade Show.
I saw my old buddy Pat Crawford sitting outside of the hotel having a drink. I asked him why he wasn't at the "pit" where everybody hangs out. His response was "Nobody knows me over there." It's really a shame these young guys don't research the industry they profess to be so involved in.
 
Salem Straub said:
I still come here and lurk fairly often, but rarely do I see a question or subject which I care to respond to. Mostly because who wants to have another convo about what belts to use- also because folks who aren't tired of that yet will generally talk it out fine without any input from me. If something like more advanced pattern welding tips comes up, then I might be happy to contribute or better yet learn something. As far as membership level and the more experienced contributors, the Forums here are not that great a direct market for high end knives (fixed blades, kitchen knives for sale areas.) Marketing in the C&H forums pays off but as far as paying for a membership to directly sell knives here, by the time you are selling knives frequently for over $1K you'll probably have more reliable avenues to move them than just posting for sale here. So, since the folks with the most to add to discussions here are also the ones who may have talked about all this stuff to the point of burnout, with the fact that it's not a super meaningful direct market, means there's not a whole lot of incentive to buy membership or be engaged. Greener pastures await on other newer forms of social media (Facebook has absorbed IG, now we get to watch that get monetized and wait for the next moving train to jump onto.)
The best reason to engage here, I think, is still to help foster a breadth of knowledge of a wider range of techniques and perspectives that whatever's currently in vogue, and to keep alive the knowledge and names of the older generations of makers that came before us. I'm still shocked at times by the lack of overall "knife world" knowledge newer guys will sometimes display in conversation. "Buster Warenski?" Blank look... "Corbet Sigman? Don Fogg, who?"
OK I'm off to the shop.
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I gotta tell you that the answers you gave me around wiring up a vfd and how you had things set up in your shop gave me the confidence to try it myself Salem. Same with Stacey and knife to a gun fight and a number of other people. The info you guys have given me is so massive and saved me hundreds of $$ as I built my grinder. Every time I start it up I think of everyone that pitched in some info from all over the place that helped me. Thanks to all of the experienced knife makers here that have helped me.
 
Hey I thought I’d chime in...

I’m a beginner in pretty much every way that counts. But I pay for a membership, because basically everything I know about knife making I have learned here.

Sure I watch YouTube and all that but this is where I come for info that I know is reliable.

I don’t contribute much because I’m not innovating and not pushing the boundaries of the craft. I’m just playing around in the garage.

I do pay however, because I want this place to continue and maybe if I pay someone who doesn’t want to but knows how to make awesome things will come and teach us all something.
 
DevinT said:
Where do we go from here?

Hoss
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Elsewhere? E.g., places we cant even mention here without likely violating some antiquated tos.

Unless the powers that be here change things up and keep the shoptalk/custom sections alive, thats really the only option in the long term. These sections of bf are id wager not even 25% of peak activity now, and its worse every day. I mean in all honesty it should be booming, more makers, collectors and fans of custom knifemaking then ever. The fact that during this meteoric rise, bf is withering says it all.

Adapt or die. Balls in bf admins court on which way it goes. Not really stuff forum members can turn around, its up to those in charge. Really hoping they adapt :)
 
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