Which Big Knife?

I am new to this form I am sorry to say but that's the past. I have a question here that I don't undersand.I make the Mission titanium knives and I think they are the best you can find as an overall big knife. BUT!! they seem to be lost in the shuffel and I would like to ask you all why? I know there is a price problem because of the cost of metal and processing but is that all??
 
Thanks for your advice, Mr. Stamp. I am honored to have one of Bladeforums most expert commentators offer advice to me.

I will stay out of the SOG debate, except to say that the SOG Tigershark looks to me to be more of a fighting knife than what I had in mind.

I am aware of the criticisms of Ontario knives. Since the RTAK is selling for a good bit more money than the Spec Plus knives, I thought perhaps the quality control would be better.

I have read about the disadvantage of a hollow grind for a chopping blade. For that reason I was leaning toward the RTAK or Battle Rat.

I will have to check out the Golok and Valiant knives.

Thanks again for the advice, everyone.
 
It appears I was confused over which knife is the BK9. I had in mind the older Becker Brute, but a little while ago came across an ad for the BK9, which I see is a new model.

The BK9 has a feature which I have previously seen only on the 7 inch bladed Becker knife. There is metal which extends beyond the integral handle guard, which might solve the problem I have had with earlier Becker models. I have cut myself with both Beckers I own, due to the slippery handles and rounded integral guard, which did nothing to stop the knives from slipping down in my hand so that my hand came in contact with the blades. Had such an extension been present on my Becker knives, I might not have been cut.

So I will withdraw my previous opposition to the BK9, since it appears to have a safer handle design than earlier models.
 
Hi W.T. Beck,
Originally posted by W.T. Beck
...the SOG Tigershark looks to me to be more of a fighting knife than what I had in mind.
Just thought I'd quickly insert here that the Tigershark is targeted as a general purpose field knife, with some tactical benefits, since it is far too big to be practical strickly in a tactical sense.

Best of luck to you in your knife search. There are many good ones out there.
 
Hello Mr. Moore,

If I were in need of a 7 inch bladed combat/utility, the Mission MPK would get very serious consideration - at least, the more affordable A2 version. However, I am currently wanting a much larger knife, with 9 to 10 inch blade, and I have not seen any such knife from your company.
 
Hey There...

I'll throw in my vote for the Battle Rat...

Although I've never held one,, and i know I shouldn't compare it to a Busse Basic #9,, but if it's anything even close to it it's a winner...

One thing about Busse, or anything related to Busse,, they know how to make Good f-ing knives...Simple as that....

ttyle

Eric...
 
To John Moore-My nephew and I enjoyed talking to you at the Blade show. We thank you for sharing your knowledge with us. Welcome to the forums. I look forward to hearing from you again.
 
Hey Guys...


As far as Mission Ti knives are concerned...

Sure Mission makes Great knives..I like them very much,,,but.....

Titanium on a primary field blade in my opinion is a waste of time..Especially if its going to be used hard...(i.e. Chopping and such) The Edge just won't hold up to that...

It's kind of like eating Steak with Kentucky Fried Chicken cutlery..Sure it'll work,,but maybe not the right tool for the job..

Before this last statement is taken out of context,, I'm not implying that Mission Knives are not of high quality or strong user knives,,they are...

Titanium has its place and time, but more as a specialty blade...Corrosion resistance, land mine removal,,things of this sort, they would be my first pick...

ttyle

Eric...
 
Mission did make up an MPK in A2 tool steel that was protectively coated against rust for the DEA. They wanted to weed wack down drugs in the field. The knife has a 10.25" blade and a standard 4.75" molded handle with an overall length of 15".It was a quarter inch thick and a very tough knife. It took a year to sell them off because of no one wanted this large a knife for field work til now. Go figure?
 
Heck John, got any left @ 50% off? ;) I remember seeing those and drooling. I really like A2 and they sure looked good to me.
 
Originally posted by blademan 13
Heck John, got any left @ 50% off? ;) I remember seeing those and drooling. I really like A2 and they sure looked good to me.

Please...No selling or buying on this Forum.;).
 
I hope I can change your idea about the field workability of Missions titanium knives. This titanium we use is made for Mission only and it is a percipition hardned spring alloy. We have never had broken blade in the field. They punch through steel drums, are run over by tanks, they are shot at, and used to rip open ammo boxes. At one time we worked on this alloy as a potential armour plate and one outfit we work with is setting up to actually do this.

Titanium will edge bend if over stressed but you can simply wack it back in shape while steel will break at the edge and is not fixable. This is the knife of choice for cold conditions because of the inherent brittlness of steel. We have a number of hunters who want a short 7" dressing out knife because they are immune to blood corrosion and work well in cutting bone. One guy reported he dressed out over 40 deer in Montana with the MPS survival knife.

American Tomahawk and Mission are working to develop an all titnium axe head. It looks awesome and we hope to use this same spring alloy to extend into Ice axes and emergency shipboard axes.The reason is that they are light weight (40% lighter than steel)and extreamly tough. Steel has a long and fine history as a blade material but this Mission titanium is the new kid on the block.
 
By the way, please nobody suggest the Marble's Trailmaker. Trying to order a Marble's knife from an internet dealer can cause one to lose one's "marbles". I am fed up and disgusted with recent attempts to order Marble's knives.
 
W. T. :

I will have to check out the Golok and Valiant knives.

I have an evaluation Golok piece from Martindale you can have if you are interested, I have some work left to do (about a week), and can drop it in the mail then. Drop me an email if you are interested. It is nothing fancy, but it a solid work knife for brush work and if it doesn't suit you, you have lost nothing and will know much better what you want in any case.

Normark :

Titanium on a primary field blade in my opinion is a waste of time..Especially if its going to be used hard...(i.e. Chopping and such) The Edge just won't hold up to that...

Having used a MPK-Ti, for much chopping and splitting my experience is different. I even drastically slimmed down the NIB profile and it still handled the most robust wood work without harm :

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=184219&perpage=20

The only reservation I would make is that the serrations will be prone to impact damage, you can see some impaction on splitting knotty wood, however they are very acute (~15 degrees included), and few bush blades have edges that are this thin. Secondly, if you attempt to cut very hard material (hardned steel), you can grind the serrations off so be careful of reinforced belted tubing and the like.

Glockman, in regards to the sharpness, in Ron's own words :

The Tigershark does come with a bit more of a blunt edge ...

The standards that have been described *by Ron* for SOG as the expected performance are much lower than what is to be expected from the Swamp Rat line (and lots of others like Cold Steel, Spyderco). To be specific, after cutting 1000+ pieces of hemp rope, a Busse knife is still as sharp as the SOG can be expected to be NIB. Again, from Ron's own words. Ref :

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=203367

To be complete, Ron isn't the only one who has this view of sharpness. As I said it is a common knife myth. It can be disproven with basic physical and engineering principles, as well as it has been studied in great detail, mainly by woodworkers, see Lee's book on sharpening.

As for the other problems, they can be seen in the above link in detail. Performance is of course relative, but compare a SOG to a knife in its price range like the Swamp Rats, or even something far cheaper like the Camillus CU/7 and CU/9, and a large difference in performance can be seen. What you are seeing is mainly the difference due to the clean functional utility based design of the Swamp Rats, CU/7 (lots of others of course not just those two) etc. .

As a short summary, I would echo much of Chad's comments about the SEAL :

I had a co-worker bring me one to sharpen, it really is not an optimal design for any task. The primary grind was very obtuse, as was the edge bevel. The knife lacked the weight or balance to chop and was not suitable for slicing. The edge on this one was rolled in several places, had some light chiping from hitting a concrete subfloor and was extremely dull from cutting carpet. I removed a fair amount of metal using a DMT edge aligner and finishing up on a spyderco 204. I could not set the edge bevel at an acute enough level to compensate for the obtuse primary grind because the steel was not durable enough, a result of its softness. This is not a knife I would ever buy, and if I was given one would trade or give it away in short order.... Although 440A is very corrosion resistant, this aspect is somewhat muted by the bead blasted finish, which I have found to have a large impact on a steel's relative oxidization rate... The grip was rather square, the handle material was akin to Cold Steel's Kraton which I particularly dislike.... I don't mind giving up some area of performance for a larger gain in another, but it is silly to design a knife that offers poor performance in every category except that it looks cool.....

I would add though, that you can make a decent knife out of the SEAL. I put a full convex grind on mine, and it works much better now for wood work and general cutting. No durability problems on splitting knotty wood, and a much higher level of cutting ability. The other low performance aspects are still there though like the squarish handle, upper swedge etc. . Of course, different people have different expectations, so you have to take user experienced and perspective into account. In particular, the level of cutting ability that Chad would find acceptable (based on past comments), is much higher than average, as are his general expectations on use as his experience is high.

-Cliff
 
Originally posted by W.T. Beck
My next knife purchase will be a large 9 - 10 inch utility knife, and I am looking for opinions as to what is best in my severely restricted price range (under $200).
Come have a look at the 12" OAL khukuri knife in this thread:

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=203600

It is a design that is being custom made and there will be a limited edition released. Should be around $100 each.

warning: there are a lot of wide images, you may need to maximise your browser.

I created the design - let me know what you think.
 
It's a special order only. Perhaps after more interest is shown, they will add it to their line. But, yes, it will be an HI product with Uncle Bill's famous longer-than-lifetime warranty.
 
I wondering if one of the candidates I have been considering is even available yet. I found the following comment by Jeff Randall on another thread, concerning the Ontario RTAK :

The sheath maker is running the production knives behind, so the delivery has been pushed out by Ontario again.

The date on this reply was 7-1-2002.

I was searching for any reports on the Ontario RTAK by owners, but could find none. Maybe this is because nobody has one yet ?
 
Mr. Stamp often struggles with basic issues. Some of them relate to SOG. Earlier in this thread, he said of SOG:
”...you have SOG’s promotion of intentionally not fully sharpening [the Tigershark] for “durability” reasons, which is one of the worst knife myths.”
In defense of this statement, he choose to quote me out of context by saying
”The Tigershark does come with a bit more of a blunt edge.”
How damning! While I write my resignation (yea, right!), let me give Cliff some lessons on contextual interpretation, rather than his method of selective interpretation (some call it “amnesic interpretation”).

In context, my statement followed up a post by Bobby B that dealt with differing edge types. I wrote my post seconds after reading Bobby’s and disregarding Cliff’s. So, Bobby’s post and mine, in context, should read:
Quote from Bobby B
Bigger knives like the Tigershark, are often used for chopping, so the edge will be “blunter”, with a greater included angle. Basically the edge is closer to (let’s say) 30°, to prevent it chipping. A thinner knife for example a filet knife will be much “sharper” closer to (for example) 20°, wich will slice much better. Most knives fall somewhere in between, depending on what the intended use is. The SEAL Pup is basically a scaled down SEAL with similar edge geometry.

Quote from Ron@SOG
Sorry for the problems. The Tigershark does come with a bit more of a blunt edge, but if you are unhappy, we would be more than to review your knife. If you would like to do that, here’s warranty return instructions.
Please note that the task of a finer cutting knife versus a blunter (not “duller”) cutting knife were covered. BOTH KNIVES ARE CONSIDERED FULLY SHARPENED! Mr. Stamp refers to this as “one of the worst knife myths.” His years in academia have fancied him sounding pedantic, but his words are ringing hollow. For science has given centuries of mankind a very narrow grind on a shaving razor and a very blunt grind on an ax. The day Cliff tells us these achievements have actually been myths is the day he will truly and finally find himself completely alone.

But please also note that the knife user was the person “on point.” The edge in question was in the hands of a consumer. So my comment to him was, “If you are unhappy, we would be more than [happy] to review your knife.” Customer satisfaction is always first.

I will leave it up to each of you as to whether you feel Mr. Stamp was slanderous (SOG “intentionally not fully sharpening knives”). In these forums, Cliff has certainly been more careless.

And Mr. Beck, I apologize to you for having to come into your thread to defend SOG from slanderous statements. You certainly deserve better.
 
Hmm. I don't see them mentioned here, but the Jim Moody makes an interesting camp/utility knife called the Cobra. He owns the Bay Knife Company out of Michigan. I bought one years ago. It's very good, and very inexpensive.

Before you ask, I don't have a picture.:(
 
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