Whisky Question

Discussion in 'Terrio HandMade Knives' started by AntDog, Jan 19, 2016.

  1. SpyderPhreak

    SpyderPhreak Rocketman for hire Platinum Member

    Apr 13, 2004
    I'm not arguing with you James, but it's definitely all confusing, and even the "experts" don't always agree. For example, George Dickel's website disagrees with you, stating that TN Whiskey is NOT Bourbon. See the first FAQ here. The text says,

    "First of all, Tennessee whisky isn't a bourbon. It's a separate category of whisky, differing mostly in the extra steps taken after distilling. One of these steps is charcoal mellowing, a process in which whisky is slowly seeped through vats packed with charcoal. Tennessee whisky distillers make their charcoal from aged, hard sugar maple trees, and we still fire ours the old-fashioned way: in the open air."

    Also, interestingly, they use the old Scottish spelling of Whisky without the "e" due to George's belief that his product was of equal or greater quality:

    "Born 40 years after the signing of the Declaration of Independence, George A. Dickel was an established Nashville merchant. In 1867, he visited Tullahoma with his wife, Augusta. Three years later, Cascade Hollow would be home to the Dickel Distillery. Declaring his whisky of equal quality to the finest scotch, George Dickel followed in the Scottish tradition of spelling whisky without an "e."

    So, there's that. :shrug:
     
  2. SpyderPhreak

    SpyderPhreak Rocketman for hire Platinum Member

    Apr 13, 2004
    The JD distillery tour is definitely worth doing at least once. I think I've been on it 7 or 8 times now, lol. :D The first couple times I went on my own, but then I've been with co-workers who haven't seen it many times since. I've spent a fair amount of time in the nearby area at AEDC for work over the years.

    Speaking of that, if you're in the area for the JD tour, don't forget to stop by the George Dickel distillery for a tour there as well! :thumbup: Only about about 20 minutes away, back to the East toward the highway. Dickel is a LOT smaller, but they do a few things a bit differently and it's interesting to see.

    [​IMG]

    I was extremely fortunate the last time I was there! They had just started their aged single-barrel program, and I was able to get a bottle of the exclusive 14-year from only the second barrel of the program!!! :eek: :cool: The first two barrels were only sold on-site, and buyers could sign the barrels if they chose to (I did).

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    They had about a dozen bottles left, and hindsight being 20/20, I should have purchased multiples. :( I only missed getting a bottle from the first barrel by a couple weeks, but that's the way it goes. If memory serves, they were selling for about $90 each. I opened this one, and enjoy a bit every now and then. :D :thumbup:

    [​IMG]
     
  3. james terrio

    james terrio Sharpest Knife in the Light Socket

    Apr 15, 2010
    Willfull ignorance of simple, demonstrable facts is something for which I have very little patience. You can lead a horse to water, and all that.

    One more time... Ol' George's website is "technically" and "legally" wrong in that regard. Dickel whisky IS bourbon, no matter how they spell it or market it, because it fits the definition of what bourbon must be. It is "more" than bourbon, because nothing requires bourbon to be charcoal filtered. That is historically, and legally, a hallmark of Tennessee sour mash. GD is definitely NOT Scotch, no matter how they spell "whisky".

    I personally think the various George Dickel Tennessee whatever-they-call-them :rolleyes: are really quite enjoyable... but if they feel sassy and truly feel they stand up to the best Scotch... that's for others to decide.

    It's not confusing at all. The legal and trademark definitions for the various forms of whiskey/whisky are extremely clear. Don't trust me, and don't trust anyone trying to sell you anything. Look it up yourself... This is not rocket science, and it's not a big secret. It is a matter of specific recipes and techniques.
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2016
  4. SpyderPhreak

    SpyderPhreak Rocketman for hire Platinum Member

    Apr 13, 2004
    We're absolutely on the same page James. I was just providing the counter-point / devil's advocate point of view.

    I've even brought these issues up on the tours at GD, and the line (excuse) you'll get from them is, "That's how ole George wanted it" or something to that effect. They won't discuss it. But that's probably obvious after the recent TN legal battles. :rolleyes: Whether they really believe the BS, or it's rooted in the corporate fighting between the JD / GD owners, I could really care less. The tour is still worth the time though, but JD's is a LOT better!

    Whisky was around WAY before Whiskey.
     
  5. hhmoore

    hhmoore Gold Member Gold Member

    Feb 7, 2014
    - removed -
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2016
  6. Greykilt

    Greykilt

    Dec 12, 2013
    Jamus !
    I'm sending a letter to Ireland. I'm gonna try to get a batch labeled
    "JAMUSON" .
    Who knows, it might fly.
     
  7. james terrio

    james terrio Sharpest Knife in the Light Socket

    Apr 15, 2010
    I'm not at all sure that JD and GD were/are on opposite sides of that conflict to change or relax the "legal" definition of what makes mostly-corn, sour-mash, charcoal-filtered and charred-oak-aged liquor "TENNESSEE WHISKY". JD and GD have the most to protect by keeping that exactly the same as it is now. And they damn well should protect that! There is NO reason to change those laws and trademarks and so forth.

    My understanding was, other johnny-come-lately's were trying to water down the requirements in order to CHEAT and put a historically-trusted label on their half-vast efforts to compete with the real deal. My gut instinct is... forget them nitwits who try that. :thumbdn:

    Make your own way, newbie, don't tear down the giants on whose shoulders you stand.

    But hey... I've been wrong before, and I have no inside information. Just my opinion. So don't quote me on that.
     
  8. james terrio

    james terrio Sharpest Knife in the Light Socket

    Apr 15, 2010
    That's far more than kind! I am sincerely humbled that anyone would even consider typing such a crazy idea out loud.

    If you find a distillery willing to bottle such a monstrosity and put anything resembling my name on it, KY, TN, Scotland or Ireland... well shucks... have them send me a case and I'll be more than happy to field-test it. ;)
     
  9. SteelMyHeart85420

    SteelMyHeart85420

    10
    Jun 25, 2015
    Thanks, anyway. I'll have a good beer, instead
     
  10. james terrio

    james terrio Sharpest Knife in the Light Socket

    Apr 15, 2010
    Ohhh my heavens.... beer is a whole other ball of wax... ;)
     
  11. Greykilt

    Greykilt

    Dec 12, 2013
    Beer.
    And you can't just say beer anymore because there are so many different brands and so many different styles and so many different kinds.
    Home brew, Stadium brew, Craft brew, Micro brew, etc.
    How about this one, "Live Cask Conditioned" ?
    Lights. Darks. Reds. Blacks. Black AND Tans.
    Wheat. Oat. Hops. Extra Hops. Gluten Free :)confused: )
    Lagers, Pilsners, Ales, Stouts, Porters, on and on.
    And once you decide all that then you have to decide to what degree.
    Stout or Extra Stout. Light or Ultra Light. Bock or Double Bock or Triple Bock.

    And then there's Cider.... :eek:
     
  12. 1066vik

    1066vik Gold Member Gold Member

    Nov 28, 2009
    I was really bummed when they stopped making Mackeson's XXX Triple Stout.
     
  13. james terrio

    james terrio Sharpest Knife in the Light Socket

    Apr 15, 2010
    Beer questions and discussions deserve their own thread. :)
     
  14. Aias

    Aias

    Aug 1, 2012
    Thank you sir! I've learned something... now, drink on!
     
  15. mqqn

    mqqn Gold Member Gold Member

    Nov 12, 2009
    Jack Daniels and Dickels are both, by recipe, a Bourbon until they are charcoal mellowed, after which they become Tennessee Whiskey.

    Prichards also calls itself a Tennessee Whiskey, however it does not follow the Lincoln County Process of charcoal mellowing through a vat of maple charcoal so I don't personally recognize it as a Tennessee Whiskey.

    best

    mqqn
     
  16. james terrio

    james terrio Sharpest Knife in the Light Socket

    Apr 15, 2010
    ^ that guy gets it ;)
     
  17. mqqn

    mqqn Gold Member Gold Member

    Nov 12, 2009
    Thanks JT - I have been a Tennessee Squire for 33 years, and I have a small collection of Jack Daniels....

    [​IMG]

    best

    mqqn
     
  18. Aias

    Aias

    Aug 1, 2012
    Hey guys--ever hear of Widow Jane bourbon? I just read a review; I think I'll need to try some--anyone have any experience with it?
     
  19. james terrio

    james terrio Sharpest Knife in the Light Socket

    Apr 15, 2010
    Dang... that's a gorgeous bar. :thumbup:

    Although I'm not a huge fan of JD No. 7 (I drank way too much of it in my misspent youth - I blame that on the rock'n'roll), I have enjoyed some of their other offerings.

    As it happens, my wife and I own and live on a bit of land here in East Tennessee, where her family goes back more generations than I can count. Our intent is to retire here. I have heard that the only way to become a Tennessee Squire is to be nominated by someone who is already a Tennessee Squire.

    *ahem*
     
  20. mqqn

    mqqn Gold Member Gold Member

    Nov 12, 2009
    Thanks - pm sent.

    best

    mqqn
     

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