Why are Al Mar knives SO EXPENSIVE?

Kai Corp. said:
Pricing = Marketing. Hmmm, I'm thinking that's a bit of a stretch. As an end line user, I feel you're reaching here. There are many variances that can go into costs. Manufacture efficiencies can vary greatly. What it costs one manufacture to build, the same knife would cost much more for another. Vendor relationships and the price for services can have extreme differences in costs for manufacturers. Size and volume can make a dramatic difference in the cost of parts/knives. There are many more variables that have significant impacts, some absorb it better than others. Psychological? Not usually a factor when setting prices.

To equally compare manufacturers and their MSRP's, and call one out as over priced based on your distant understanding is not fair IMO, and in many cases not applicable. As an ELU, you do have a choices though, but a bit more perspective may assist with more understanding.

Is this information or opinion?

I don't feel there is much inflating, again if you're arguing that Manufacturers are gouging based on reputation or because they can. I feel that is a bit of an insult, and again not accurate.

An old joke in the knife manufacturing business.

How do you make a small fortune manufacturing knives?

You start with a large one.

Trust me on this, no manufacturer laughs when it's told.


It's a view your entitled to, but every manufacturer is unique, and they are all produce differently from each other. Maybe something to try and remember in the future prior to putting the boots to a brand.
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With all due respect, I disagree, and I agree that marketing can and does influence sell price.
It’s all about perception. I have a marketing degree and I can’t tell you how many assignments I have done where we start off with a product that is technically the same as everyone else's. You differentiate it in some way from your competition and set a price point that creates a perception of quality and exclusiveness for the customer.
Its not a bad thing, and im not insulting anyone who has a large markup on their knives.
What if we used nike tshirts as an example. Your paying for a brand, and the image that goes with it. Like it or not the same thing happens with most products.

edit: also we use "Psychological price points" ALL THE TIME.
 
nzedge said:
With all due respect, I disagree, and I agree that marketing can and does influence sell price.
It’s all about perception. I have a marketing degree and I can’t tell you how many assignments I have done where we start off with a product that is technically the same as everyone else's. You differentiate it in some way from your competition and set a price point that creates a perception of quality and exclusiveness for the customer.
Its not a bad thing, and im not insulting anyone who has a large markup on their knives.
What if we used nike tshirts as an example. Your paying for a brand, and the image that goes with it. Like it or not the same thing happens with most products.

edit: also we use "Psychological price points" ALL THE TIME.
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If you and pn want to use generalities in getting your point across, I understand completely.

Our take comes from a knife industry perspective. No brand we know of in our industry has the juice to carry out what your marketing degree taught you. Being that we're in our 40th year in this industry, you'll just have to trust us on this one, 99% of knife manufacturers do not have the brand power, or magical marketing prowess, to pull it off. We're not talking about national brands in gigantic industries, producing products that are widely accepted in society. We're talking about pocket knives, and we're not feeling generalities truly apply in this case. Not sure any of us are so stable and have made much profit.

Manufacturing knives is a very difficult business. Creating a brand from knives is even more difficult. There unfortunately are not the sales and marketing luxury's available to us as a product and as an industry so to apply general marketing principals that we see in our every day. The real world of manufacturing, branding, pricing, and selling knives does not, in our opinion, fit the general sales/marketing/business model one simply learns in school. It is quite unique in its nature, and the real world keeps the opportunities for psychological marketing = price gouging to an anorexic level.

Just our take, and thank you for the fine discussion.
 
The question of why is this or that knife so expensive is a regular thread on this forum. My thought always is how does the poster determine "too expensive" and what does he think said item should cost? There are a world of products and services that are "too expensive" for me personally to own but that doesn't mean the maker has priced them unfairly. I just need to set my sights on something I can afford.
 
Sidehill Gouger said:
The question of why is this or that knife so expensive is a regular thread on this forum. My thought always is how does the poster determine "too expensive" and what does he think said item should cost? There are a world of products and services that are "too expensive" for me personally to own but that doesn't mean the maker has priced them unfairly. I just need to set my sights on something I can afford.
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:thumbup::thumbup: Very Good post. A great way of looking at the cost of products in general, knives too of course.
 
As far as the zdp 189, they are running 64-66 and I have one coming. At the least it will be a regrind candidate. Just ask cliff stamp..... Russ
 
I had an Al Mar Hawk ultralight that I bought back in the 80's-90's, never used it, because as soon as I bought it, I discovered the wonders of spyderco & their pocket clips, and never went back to a knife at the bottom of my pocket.
I found it a few years ago in my glove box and discovered the lockback would fail with only a minor pressure on the spine of the blade.
I sent it back to Al Mar, they returned it back to me saying they couldn't fix it, and didn't even offer to exchange it, or even offer a discount on a new knife.
I guess after Al's passing that they just don't stand behind their products.
Now buying from them again.
 
I have an Al Mar SERE 2000 Butch Vallotton auto in VG10 and have to say it was a great buy... it's been my EDC for a few months now, and am constantly impressed with it's fit and finish. I haven't used it for any heavy duty work, but am sure it would stand up well to anything I could throw at it in a regular day.
 
LGMartialArts said:
I have an Al Mar SERE 2000 Butch Vallotton auto in VG10 and have to say it was a great buy... it's been my EDC for a few months now, and am constantly impressed with it's fit and finish. I haven't used it for any heavy duty work, but am sure it would stand up well to anything I could throw at it in a regular day.
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Sorry man, but this thread's been dead a while. Your's is one of only three posts since june of last year.
 
Kai Corp. said:
Pricing = Marketing. Hmmm, I'm thinking that's a bit of a stretch. As an end line user, I feel you're reaching here. There are many variances that can go into costs. Manufacture efficiencies can vary greatly. What it costs one manufacture to build, the same knife would cost much more for another. Vendor relationships and the price for services can have extreme differences in costs for manufacturers. Size and volume can make a dramatic difference in the cost of parts/knives. There are many more variables that have significant impacts, some absorb it better than others. Psychological? Not usually a factor when setting prices.

To equally compare manufacturers and their MSRP's, and call one out as over priced based on your distant understanding is not fair IMO, and in many cases not applicable. As an ELU, you do have a choices though, but a bit more perspective may assist with more understanding.

Is this information or opinion?

I don't feel there is much inflating, again if you're arguing that Manufacturers are gouging based on reputation or because they can. I feel that is a bit of an insult, and again not accurate.

An old joke in the knife manufacturing business.

How do you make a small fortune manufacturing knives?

You start with a large one.

Trust me on this, no manufacturer laughs when it's told.


It's a view your entitled to, but every manufacturer is unique, and they are all produce differently from each other. Maybe something to try and remember in the future prior to putting the boots to a brand.
Click to expand...

Wow it's kind of cool that you responded because I was wondering about a knife I have made by KAI... No comment on the rest of your post though.

I have a Wild Turkey 4150DM and love it. I did some reading about this knife and have seen it suggested that MOKI manufactured this knife for KAI. Any truth to this?
 
Being in school and studying a subject, in this case marketing is very different than actually being in charge of production and marketing for a multimillion dollar company. I remember my college classes, most of what we learned was theory, examples, problem solving, etc. I'd be more inclined to believe someone that does the work, day in and day out, than what generalities projects and assignments can do.
 
RevDevil said:
Those are two very important aspects that I can agree, about any manufacturer. The problem comes in when you need something from their customer service department. There are dozens of horror stories about unanswered phone calls, emails, lack of follow through on repair and such. I don't mind too much paying a premium for fit and finish, but if you don't do much to take care of your customers afterwards, then you are only half in the game. If a manufacturer won't take care of a legitimate issue for me, the customer then I take my money elsewhere. Simple.
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That's the difference between when the company was run by Al Mar and when the company was run by Gary Fadden after Al Mar died in 1992.
 
Al Mar thread from 2013. Don't know why the Mods don't lock these old threads so people don't keep adding to them without realizing how old they are.
 
I don't understand the distain some spout when an old thread is revised. I find it helpful to pick up on the same conversation. I've never heard a logical reason where locking an old thread
makes sense. Why jump around to different threads when you can stay in the same one? Also, unless rules here have changed it's allowed. What shouldn't be allowed is posting about "zombie threads". If you are so offended it's being revived, why would you help to revive it further by responding?
 
Ron Sabbagh said:
I love the older threads. Gives us a chance to see what we have learned, if anything
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Not so much in this case. Well, the question is still pretty much valid, but the circumstances for the answer are completely different. Now, Al Mar knives are expensive because the company is no more (different owner, different production, different knives) and the Al Mar knives of old command a collectors price.
 
Positioning. Marketing. They have been milking the good name of the deceased founder of the brand for a long time. A decent knife but a pricing strategy of smoke and mirrors.
 
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