Why are Koenig,Grimsmo,Holt.etc considered a higher tier of knife than Chris reeve,Hinderer,Les George.etc

[TrainedBullets]

I would guess it mostly comes down to the machining. Micro-milling requires very expensive equipment, thus an added cost must be attached to the products produced by them. As for the quality of the products from each, I find the difference negligible. The blades are equal, tolerances too. You're essentially just paying for cooler looking scales at that point.

I agree, the milling probably has a lot to do with it.

Also, at least Grimsmo to CRK, the caged bearings and whatever work Grimsmo does to make the thing ready to roll out of the gate are also factors. CRKs need quite a bit of work to break in. I’d probably pay $200 more if Sebenzas came fully broken in. They get there, and when they do they’re buttery smooth, but for me it’s an annoyingly long period.

 

[Leo Greer]

I would guess it mostly comes down to the machining. Micro-milling requires very expensive equipment, thus an added cost must be attached to the products produced by them. As for the quality of the products from each, I find the difference negligible. The blades are equal, tolerances too. You're essentially just paying for cooler looking scales at that point.

How does one test if the “blades are equal”? The tolerances certainly aren’t, or they’re at least different. It factually requires a higher tolerance to make a Holt with a very lightweight blade drop shut out of the box (while keeping perfect lockup) than an XM-18.

CRKs have a well known break-in period. This is the internal tolerances smoothing themselves out. There’s nothing wrong with this (and almost every knife has to break in), but for a CRK it’s a process that takes longer than most. People like it, as it allows them both to have a connection with the knife, and for the knife to wear in exactly right, but this method also factually requires less precise internal tolerances to make work.

 

[bladerunner01]

I agree, the milling probably has a lot to do with it.

Also, at least Grimsmo to CRK, the caged bearings and whatever work Grimsmo does to make the thing ready to roll out of the gate are also factors. CRKs need quite a bit of work to break in. I’d probably pay $200 more if Sebenzas came fully broken in. They get there, and when they do they’re buttery smooth, but for me it’s an annoyingly long period.

You know, I've changed my tune on this over the years. I used to loathe the slow roll CRK action. I did have one that was so bad I had to send it in for repair. However I've grown to appreciate it and after maybe 100 or so openings I can flick it with a little wrist action added. I still hate their thumb studs though. Regardless, I care absolutely nothing for that "dropshutty" action others seem to rave on about. Sure it's cool and a technical marvel in ways, but for practical use, I much prefer some friction there too require me to consciously put effort into owning and closing with intent. I think it's one of those "to each their own" sort of things, or "your mileage may vary".

I mean, the reality is, I've owned knives costing under 300 that have just as good an action as any Grimsmo, Holt or the like.

 

[rexromic]

All great knives but CRK is the best IMO.Simplest with least parts,easy maintenance,great fit and finish,tolerances and awesome customer service.Real life user friendly and still best in my books.

 

[mitchnola]

All great knives but CRK is the best IMO.Simplest with least parts,easy maintenance,great fit and finish,tolerances and awesome customer service.Real life user friendly and still best in my books.

I have to disagree with this on the simplest or ease of maintenance. Just my opinion but I hate the free spinning pivot, then there’s the pivot bushing that has to be held in place just right to hold the washers in place while sliding the blade with washers into the scales. Tim makes it look really easy on yt and I’m sure it gets better with practice but I by no means consider it particularly easy. I much prefer the sandwich method but can’t do that either with CRK’s because of risk of pinching washers. Simply put, something I would consider super easy doesn’t require practice or a ton of experience.

Otherwise I do love the design in completely eliminating blade play and for that it’s worth the lil extra effort but I don’t consider ease of maintenance a talking point for crks.

And since I’m complaining I might as well mention I especially hate the spanner bit required for hinderers! I just don’t get it. Just press in the pivot or square off one side like Ernie does. Just makes it so much easier.

I much prefer my LGs or Emerson. Locked in pivots, even less parts and easy on the first try with no experience. I can break these down, clean, lube and back together in a few minutes.

 

[rexromic]

I have to disagree with this on the simplest or ease of maintenance. Just my opinion but I hate the free spinning pivot, then there’s the pivot bushing that has to be held in place just right to hold the washers in place while sliding the blade with washers into the scales. Tim makes it look really easy on yt and I’m sure it gets better with practice but I by no means consider it particularly easy. I much prefer the sandwich method but can’t do that either with CRK’s because of risk of pinching washers. Simply put, something I would consider super easy doesn’t require practice or a ton of experience.

Otherwise I do love the design in completely eliminating blade play and for that it’s worth the lil extra effort but I don’t consider ease of maintenance a talking point for crks.

And since I’m complaining I might as well mention I especially hate the spanner bit required for hinderers! I just don’t get it. Just press in the pivot or square off one side like Ernie does. Just makes it so much easier.

I much prefer my LGs or Emerson. Locked in pivots, even less parts and easy on the first try with no experience. I can break these down, clean, lube and back together in a few minutes.

Never experienced any problems cleaning CRK,never used any Loctite on any CRK models and takes me also few minutes for disassembly,cleaning and assembly.
Pretty sure that CRK has way less parts than Emerson knives.

I have to disagree with this on the simplest or ease of maintenance. Just my opinion but I hate the free spinning pivot, then there’s the pivot bushing that has to be held in place just right to hold the washers in place while sliding the blade with washers into the scales. Tim makes it look really easy on yt and I’m sure it gets better with practice but I by no means consider it particularly easy. I much prefer the sandwich method but can’t do that either with CRK’s because of risk of pinching washers. Simply put, something I would consider super easy doesn’t require practice or a ton of experience.

Otherwise I do love the design in completely eliminating blade play and for that it’s worth the lil extra effort but I don’t consider ease of maintenance a talking point for crks.

And since I’m complaining I might as well mention I especially hate the spanner bit required for hinderers! I just don’t get it. Just press in the pivot or square off one side like Ernie does. Just makes it so much easier.

I much prefer my LGs or Emerson. Locked in pivots, even less parts and easy on the first try with no experience. I can break these down, clean, lube and back together in a few minutes.

Takes me few minutes for complete maintenance of any CRK,never used any Loctite on any CRK and pretty sure that Emerson knives have more parts and need more tools to disassemble than CRK.
Also overall quality of CRK is above Emerson.
Not comparable really but to each his own.
Cheers!

 

[mitchnola]

Never experienced any problems cleaning CRK,never used any Loctite on any CRK models and takes me also few minutes for disassembly,cleaning and assembly.
Pretty sure that CRK has way less parts than Emerson knives.

Takes me few minutes for complete maintenance of any CRK,never used any Loctite on any CRK and pretty sure that Emerson knives have more parts and need more tools to disassemble than CRK.
Also overall quality of CRK is above Emerson.
Not comparable really but to each his own.
Cheers!

As I said, sure it may not be hard to someone well practiced. That doesn’t mean it’s easy. If you had 10 people do maintenance on a crk for the first time vs an Emerson they would unanimously agree the Emerson is way easier.

As far as tools, an Emerson only needs a flat head and a Phillips screw driver for full disassembly. A crk needs 2 allens the same size for the pivot and then a smaller allen for the body screws for full disassembly.

As far as parts, the crk has the additional pivot bushing and hardware for the lanyard. Emerson only has a the pivot and pivot screw, body screws and standoffs. Number of body screws vary by model so technically it could have more parts. But again much simpler design. And only one side of the body screws need to be removed for full disassembly. Standoff stay in tact from the screws on the other side.

LGs are even easier. T20 torx bit for pivot, t10 for 2 body screws/standoffs. And a pressed in pivot.

I’m a fan and love my crks and appreciate/respect the design but I’m by no means a fan boy. There’s quite a few things I don’t like about crks, like the thumb studs, the ergos of the the sebenza handle, how easy the finish scratches/snail trails, flicking them voids the warranty, and the disassembly. At one point I had up to 8. Im down to two that I absolutely love, a lg box elder 31 and lg cf inkosi.

And btw, obviously wasn’t comparing quality of Emerson to a crk, just in regards to maintenance. However, I will compare a LG to crk all day and it blows em out the water!

Just my opinion of course

 

[rexromic]

LG knives?Which ones are those?
My Sebenza 21,Regular have only one allen key.Again,personal preference to which knives anyone likes and uses.

 

[scorpnsnake]

As I said, sure it may not be hard to someone well practiced. That doesn’t mean it’s easy. If you had 10 people do maintenance on a crk for the first time vs an Emerson they would unanimously agree the Emerson is way easier.

As far as tools, an Emerson only needs a flat head and a Phillips screw driver for full disassembly. A crk needs 2 allens the same size for the pivot and then a smaller allen for the body screws for full disassembly.

As far as parts, the crk has the additional pivot bushing and hardware for the lanyard. Emerson only has a the pivot and pivot screw, body screws and standoffs. Number of body screws vary by model so technically it could have more parts. But again much simpler design. And only one side of the body screws need to be removed for full disassembly. Standoff stay in tact from the screws on the other side.

LGs are even easier. T20 torx bit for pivot, t10 for 2 body screws/standoffs. And a pressed in pivot.

I’m a fan and love my crks and appreciate/respect the design but I’m by no means a fan boy. There’s quite a few things I don’t like about crks, like the thumb studs, the ergos of the the sebenza handle, how easy the finish scratches/snail trails, flicking them voids the warranty, and the disassembly. At one point I had up to 8. Im down to two that I absolutely love, a lg box elder 31 and lg cf inkosi.

And btw, obviously wasn’t comparing quality of Emerson to a crk, just in regards to maintenance. However, I will compare a LG to crk all day and it blows em out the water!

Just my opinion of course

Grandpa action and flicking voids the warranty? Well, that settle that, I'll have to wonder forever how they stack up with Holts and the Grimsmo Brothers offerings.

 

[bladerunner01]

How does one test if the “blades are equal”? The tolerances certainly aren’t, or they’re at least different. It factually requires a higher tolerance to make a Holt with a very lightweight blade drop shut out of the box (while keeping perfect lockup) than an XM-18.

CRKs have a well known break-in period. This is the internal tolerances smoothing themselves out. There’s nothing wrong with this (and almost every knife has to break in), but for a CRK it’s a process that takes longer than most. People like it, as it allows them both to have a connection with the knife, and for the knife to wear in exactly right, but this method also factually requires less precise internal tolerances to

I have to disagree with this on the simplest or ease of maintenance. Just my opinion but I hate the free spinning pivot, then there’s the pivot bushing that has to be held in place just right to hold the washers in place while sliding the blade with washers into the scales. Tim makes it look really easy on yt and I’m sure it gets better with practice but I by no means consider it particularly easy. I much prefer the sandwich method but can’t do that either with CRK’s because of risk of pinching washers. Simply put, something I would consider super easy doesn’t require practice or a ton of experience.

Otherwise I do love the design in completely eliminating blade play and for that it’s worth the lil extra effort but I don’t consider ease of maintenance a talking point for crks.

And since I’m complaining I might as well mention I especially hate the spanner bit required for hinderers! I just don’t get it. Just press in the pivot or square off one side like Ernie does. Just makes it so much easier.

I much prefer my LGs or Emerson. Locked in pivots, even less parts and easy on the first try with no experience. I can break these down, clean, lube and back together in a few minutes.

I don't understand, why are you doing maintenance on your CRK anyway? Spa treatment is fantastic and they only charge you for parts that might need replacing, which is usually no more than a set of washers for me. They also sharpen it back to factory for you. It's fantastic!

 

[mitchnola]

LG knives?Which ones are those?
My Sebenza 21,Regular have only one allen key.Again,personal preference to which knives anyone likes and uses.

Of course bro, to each their own. Nothing wrong with a friendly debate. LG is Les
George. I highly recommend checking one out given the chance.

And I was partially joking about them blowing crk out the water. The quality and durability of crk is unquestionable, LGs are just my personal favorite.

 

[mitchnola]

I don't understand, why are you doing maintenance on your CRK anyway? Spa treatment is fantastic and they only charge you for parts that might need replacing, which is usually no more than a set of washers for me. They also sharpen it back to factory for you. It's fantastic!

Personally I’d much rather do my own maintenance then risk mailing it. I also enjoy it generally, just don’t think it’s as easy as other knives. No doubt though their customer service is one of the biggest things that stands them apart.

 

[mitchnola]

Grandpa action and flicking voids the warranty? Well, that settle that, I'll have to wonder forever how they stack up with Holts and the Grimsmo Brothers offerings.

I actually didn’t believe when I first heard of it. There was guy that sent one in with late lock up and they refused to warranty it because of “excessive flicking”. I didn’t believe it till I looked it up myself and sure enough it’s mentioned in the warranty on their website. I flick mine and haven’t had any problems but I do think that’s kind of wack for what’s considered to be a hard use knife.

 

[scorpnsnake]

I actually didn’t believe when I first heard of it. There was guy that sent one in with late lock up and they refused to warranty it because of “excessive flicking”. I didn’t believe it till I looked it up myself and sure enough it’s mentioned in the warranty on their website. I flick mine and haven’t had any problems but I do think that’s kind of wack for what’s considered to be a hard use knife.

Can't shake the feeling that the thumb studs were designed to discourage flicking now. Always found it curious that such a highly esteemed manufacturer could get that part less than great for a decent number of purchasers.

Haven't tried one yet, just tales from the webs feeding this paranoia. lol

 

[mitchnola]

Can't shake the feeling that the thumb studs were designed to discourage flicking now. Always found it curious that such a highly esteemed manufacturer could get that part less than great for a decent number of purchasers.

Haven't tried one yet, just tales from the webs feeding this paranoia. lol

Well I would definitely still recommend them. The pivot design is very impressive. There’s no blade play even with the pivot screw completely removed. The hollow grind on the blade is top notch. Their generally an all around great knife. And the break in period really creates a bond. Their warranty and customer service is possibly the best. They’re just not designed with fidgety in mind and I respect that. For the sole purpose of a knife their quality may be matched by some but probably nothing actually better. Keeping in mind personally I much prefer washers over bearings. I also much prefer the ergos of the inkosi over the sebenza. I also think the jimping on the inkosi is the best I’ve ever felt.

 

[norcalAF]

As I said, sure it may not be hard to someone well practiced. That doesn’t mean it’s easy. If you had 10 people do maintenance on a crk for the first time vs an Emerson they would unanimously agree the Emerson is way easier.

As far as tools, an Emerson only needs a flat head and a Phillips screw driver for full disassembly. A crk needs 2 allens the same size for the pivot and then a smaller allen for the body screws for full disassembly.

As far as parts, the crk has the additional pivot bushing and hardware for the lanyard. Emerson only has a the pivot and pivot screw, body screws and standoffs. Number of body screws vary by model so technically it could have more parts. But again much simpler design. And only one side of the body screws need to be removed for full disassembly. Standoff stay in tact from the screws on the other side.

LGs are even easier. T20 torx bit for pivot, t10 for 2 body screws/standoffs. And a pressed in pivot.

I’m a fan and love my crks and appreciate/respect the design but I’m by no means a fan boy. There’s quite a few things I don’t like about crks, like the thumb studs, the ergos of the the sebenza handle, how easy the finish scratches/snail trails, flicking them voids the warranty, and the disassembly. At one point I had up to 8. Im down to two that I absolutely love, a lg box elder 31 and lg cf inkosi.

And btw, obviously wasn’t comparing quality of Emerson to a crk, just in regards to maintenance. However, I will compare a LG to crk all day and it blows em out the water!

Just my opinion of course

All hail the King!

 

[crk1984]

Idiots on reddit falling over themselves to have the next flavor of the month cnc crap marketed as "high end". The ones you listed lower are legit better than your upper level

 

[crk1984]

I guess I should amend my statement to be metal handles in general. Too temperature sensitive unless they have a coating like autos.

Personally, I like lightweight knives. Large inlays (iMamba for example) help.

I just always hear stuff about a new knife that has great action, and at least 80% of the time it's a full Ti knife. Gets old.

As cool as some of the finishes are, they (or at least the one ano Ti folder I own) don't wear well and fade with use, so as cool as something like Olamic's entropic finish is, it definitely seems geared more towards an art knife and not for actual use.

I may just to try a milled and anod folder again, maybe the finish will last longer on a higher end knife.

People can like different things.

 

[crk1984]

Ahh, I must admit that I have noticed the newer mk3’s don’t quite match that amazing action on those that came out the first few yrs. However the newer one I had broke in very nicely. I’ve also noticed the actions are stiffer on coated scales.

Really surprised to hear that about the Talos. I have two of the prototypes and they’re flawless. Especially the lockbar, so easy to disengage. Maybe he’s feeling some pressure on getting them out and he’s rushing. I know people are all over him about getting one on fb.

As far as the pivot screws, I’ve had to use loctite or is teflon tape to lock them in place once tuned but those were all secondhand and years old. The new ones I’ve bought directly from him were locked in place.

So they are all flawless, but you noted flaws on many. Got it. Truly an unbiased, non shill opinion.

 

[mitchnola]

So they are all flawless, but you noted flaws on many. Got it. Truly an unbiased, non shill opinion.

Haha, an opinion is always biased hence it’s an “opinion” silly fella.

And yes a proud LG shill here!

Never said they were flawless but now that you mention they absolutely are. Comments were in regards to consistency.

I suppose your opinions in regards to crk should be considered likewise considering your screen name.

All Hail George!!!