Why do folders still use linerlocks and framelocks?

That should be fine, what is the distance from the pivot to just in front of the lanyard hole? That will let me work on the where to fix the weight on mine.
 
My favorite edc folder is the Spyderco sage 1 linelock which has a very smooth action. I can brainlessly open and close it, do to the fact my thumb will always push up into the front of the choil (well away from the cutting edge), which will always hit my thumb nail when closing (great design). This also gives me more of a feel and control when closing slowly. I like the fact that with the liner and framelock you can rinse them out quickly and dry them out and oil them without taking the knives apart. The frame lock is more annoying to me because I keep grinding the lock face into the blade tang when trying disengage and close, I also push down on the lock when opening at times. Both of these locks are my favorite though. I like them for their simplicity, also being able to see the lock visually working, gives me peace of mind in a folder.
 
thanks, I'll start getting equipment together. It should be pretty quick, but my weekend is already tied up.
 
Is all of the anger finally cleared out? Can we now get on with our business like adults should?
 
dayhiker1968 said:
If you don't mind my Zt 0550. (my baby)

You have something comparable? Or would you prefer I pick something else up?

(I don't do liner locks either)



Agreed :D:thumbup:
Click to expand...

The 1st Gen 0550 has a hell of a thick frame lock. Can't imagine any normal use of that knife causing a failure in that knife.
 
Oakengroves said:
As for framelocks, the framelock represents one of the most mechanically sleek, simple, and strong designs available.I do not foresee the framelock going away anytime soon. It is unique in that it requires the smallest amount of moving parts to achieve one of the highest forms of lock strength. A properly executed framelock (CRK for example) retains obscene strength while reducing the horizontal width of the knife, leading to less weight and better pocket carry. It is also incredibly reliable due to its simple design. A properly executed framelock is exceedingly rare and difficult to produce. A framelock is hard to appreciate unless you have handled knives that take full advantage of its functionality (CRK especially).
Click to expand...

I am not sure I understand.

It's simple yet it's difficult to produce?
 
though the Axis lock, compression lock, & triad lock are all excellent, they too have their own flaws. For one they take more skill tome and money to produce, frame and liner locks are cheaper and can hold up just as well. im not saying always but they can.


your question is similar to the one i keep getting asked, why do you carry a fixed blade knife?? a pocket knife can do the same thing as a fixed blade........ its a yes and no question
 
DB731 said:
I am not sure I understand.

It's simple yet it's difficult to produce?
Click to expand...

They are difficult to make well. By well, I mean reliable.

Please. Have a look at these posts I did to see what goes into making a proper liner/framelock.

Those that think it is easy to make a liner/framelock well are ill informed IMO.

Please read the following link:

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...in-Frame-Liner-locks/page4?highlight=terzuola

Now, there is also been some good testing and evaluation done by Kyle Harris (cKc Knives) from new Zealand discussing blade play vs lock security. In short, though we think blade play is bad, making a truly dependable lock in the framelock/linerlock conversion requires some blade play.
Have a look at these videos:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7I3fJVL3DT4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2cZQv5cIqQ

You can see from the videos that even with blade play a lock can still be very secure, very reliable and would require the entire lock to self-destruct in order to disengage.

[video=youtube;A2f5h9zFQvE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A2f5h9zFQvE[/video]

Real interesting comments from Gavkoo on the folder of Kyle and what makers such as Bob Terzuola said about bladeplay being a thread for the specific market, yet there is nothing wrong with the desing.

People presume that blade play is bad, but not for a reliable lock. I would venture and say that the Victorinox soldier will only fail if there is a catastrophic failure of nature, same as the Tri-Ad. Under static load, the soldier might even surprise the best of us.

Interesting thing on how durable a liner can be:

[video=youtube;-MxCDbAW638]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-MxCDbAW638[/video]

I tried to repost all my lengthy posts but the server keeps interrupting.
 
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In regards to liner/framelocks having the thumb go across the lock when closing, I personally have not seen this as a problem. One hand operation is easy, and fast. Most of the time, the choil is what my thumb catches but regardless, I move my thumb away anyway during the motion of closing frame/linerlocks. I have never been cut this way in the thousands of times. All locks can be dangerous if you don't pay attention.
 
Planterz said:
I love the AXIS lock. Flick open, flick closed. Nothing is easier or quicker. And you don't have to put your finger or thumb in the path of the blade.

I don't like liner or frame locks. They're slower to close, and you have to put your thumb in the path of the blade when closing.

That said, liner and frame locks are simple. A well-made liner lock is safe, and a frame lock is very safe. No extra parts, no complex mechanism, no springs. I love the AXIS lock, and never had an omega spring break, but you hear about them breaking all the time, so maybe it's only a matter of time that I do break one. And taking apart and putting together an AXIS lock is a PITA. Taking apart and putting back together a lockback (assuming you can) like an Endura is a major PITA. And the lock on an SOG Flash? Overly complex, and there's this tiny little ball that you're probably going to lose.

I don't like liner or frame locks personally, but I can certainly understand why both manufacturers and users like them.
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You pretty much summed up my answer. Another thing I believe its just a trend as well. Such as the whole massive thick tank like titanium folders. You could go with a thinner steel that's stronger and weighs just as much if not less. Just two pennies being thrown out though. I don't make or buy or want those kinds of knives so I can't really say much. Oh and that tiny little ball....I lost it...in my Twitch II as well :foot: Learned after the second time haha.
Also...PITA...I know what it means but its awfully close to PETA...any correlations there? lol sorry i'm just being a PITA :D

From doing a quick skim through later posts as well, I have no issue with liner locks, I have my own opinions of them compared to frame locks. I have yet to have a CRKT M16 fail on me. I'll end up replacing them once the blade starts resembling a babies rattle. The first one took 4 years of abuse before I decided to replace it still works fine my brother uses it in the factory he works in He thinks its the greatest knife in the world. I'm on my second. That Autolawks is pretty awesome as well. It has saved my fingers more than once. I also have not a single issue with "gas station" knives. My best buddy, that is all he buys, he uses and abuses them till the blade is sharpened away in roughly 1-2 years. Never once has one actually failed him. To him a knife is a folding toolbox full of screwdrivers and large prybars and chisels and various metal/wood working tools. Nothing else. They are meant to be used, like trucks, they're high speed tractors not meant to be pretty and soft and cushy.

Sorry if I offended anyone, some of these topics can be touchy I've seen in my ventures on the internet. You'll just have to live with my opinion being different c: I do really apologize though, I hate starting arguments.
 
I feel very confident with pretty much any higher quality, typically expensive, folding knives lock.

But there is no folding knifes lock that I trust 100%. I typically cut with the blade's edge though. ...which really brings into question the blade's stop pin more than the lock. Sometimes I do pokey/stabby things with a folding knife but I always remember that the thing is broken in the middle. A screw break, a small crack in the material, gunk, & the slightest flaws in machining, whatever. All folding knives need to be treated with respect & due care.

I prefer frame locks to liner locks because frame locks are much more gunk resistant and cleaner.
As for frame locks in general.. They are my fav. lock type for many reasons already posted in the thread. But I've only really had high end ones.
 
my favourite lock up until this time is frame lock. followed by liner lock, and then back locks.

i never owned any that have LAWKS or tri ad lock, so i don't have a slightest idea bout em.
as for axis lock, i do understand that they are stronger than any of my favourites, but I cannot put myself to like it. i gave away my mini grip because of that. i rather have that 'thwack' sound when i flick my folder open.

as for the thread title, i am with those that said "framelock/linerlocks are easier to maintenance and to make". if i am in need of stronger locks more than framelocks i will bring fixed blades. but for what i learn even for abusive batonning if you use right technique ( to not fully open the folder for spine whacking and not grip the handle tightly) even opinel could be used.
 
Just a thought: does hanging a weight from a frame lock knife with the blade clamped in a vise simulate the real world conditions? One of the biggest functional differences between frame and liner locks is that the users hand is directly compressing the frame lock when gripped in a normal hold. IOW there is some added resistance to lateral deflection on a frame lock in use that doesnt come into play with a liner lock. The scales prevent the gripping force of the users hand from pressing the LL.

Maybe you should lightly apply a zip tie to the frame lock before testing to replicate this effect? Just thinking...
 
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