Why do people 'de-assist' assisted opening knives?

AF said:
They're harder to close one-handed.
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Yup. Assisted opening = resisted closing. :D Also, I can personally flick open most one-hand-opening knives faster than the spring even can.
 
I have a few AO knives, and have kept them as they are. But now, I'd probably prefer them as regular manual operated without the assist. Not that I carry them much (I don't). For me, it was never about the resistance to closing; it was about one more thing that could go wrong. I've settled on simpler is better in my knives.

Jim
 
T.K.C. said:
Then why bother to BUY a knife that is assisted opening?
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Insipid Moniker said:
There are some great designs that are A/O only. If it can be deassisted why miss out on a great knife when you can tweak it to be what you want?
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A great example is the ZT 0770CF:
auLcBaX.jpg

An awesome knife, and there’s nothing else quite like it that’s unassisted, so why not try to de-assist and see what happens? As it turns out, I’ve heard that the results vary—some people find the flipping action to be not so great after de-assisting due to a weakish detent.

AF said:
They're harder to close one-handed.
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They can also be more dangerous to close one-handed if you’re not careful. One more than one occasion over the years I’ve been closing a spring-assisted knife one-handed without paying much attention, and the spring pressure pushing back at me would cause something to slip and wobble, bringing my thumb into harm’s way. Sort of hard to describe, but the point is that it’s just harder to safely control a spring-assisted knife when closing.
 
The way it works on the Kershaw RJ Martin 1986 Tactical 3.5, and probably the smaller 3.0, I can't imagine why anyone would remove this feature... It is probably my favourite feature on any folder I have ever owned.

kershaw-rj-martin-tactical-30-plnb.jpg


The difficulty in closing is really only for the last four inches of tip travel (at or less than 90 degrees), and is really nothing to worry about: For closing one-handed, with the hand alone, it does requires a bit of extra care and effort, but nothing in any way objectionable... For closing against the hip or pants, as many other folders would be closed, there is no difference whatsoever...

Gaston
 
Speedsafe is a nice assist, but there are plenty of people who don't appreciate having the blade shoot out when they want to use the knife, as speed is almost never a benefit when deploying a knife for a task, and thus the spring assist only draws attention to the knife and the user while not adding anything tangible.

But, there are many knives designed with assisted opening that look fantastic, are affordable, have nice steel, etc., so that those who don't like assisted opening are still wanting to own and carry these knives. Since it is really easy to de-assist these knives, it makes it easy to purchase these knives for the knife and not have to worry about the assist.

Assists on knives are for show more than practicality, I can deploy my Benchmade Rift and my Spyderco Native just as fast as I could deploy my ZT0566 (before I sold it) but nobody cared when I opened my Rift or my Native because they didn't spring open and make noise and draw attention like my ZT, something that I have become more aware of since hanging around people who don't carry knives and have never considered them as carry options.
 
I would go with the noise and difficulty closing. Now, a "good" spring assist in my opinion doesn't affect closing. My ZT 0566BW is no more difficult to close than any other frame locks, but when I had a SOG Zoom that was difficult to close one handed and if you weren't careful it could pop out of your hand. Also the sound is like a loud "thwak" when you open many assisted knives, vs manual knives which are more quieter. Now, which do I prefer? Manual, when you have a manual action as fast as a ZT 0560BW or a BM 940-2 you don't need an assist and not to mention you can control how fast you can deploy the blade... But, most knives don't have that smooth/fast of opening. I use the ZT 0566BW assisted, as that is the way it came and I prefer know that when I want the blade to deploy it will fully deploy. I would prefer that the ZT 0566BW was a KVT like its big brother..
 
Gideons said:
I would go with the noise and difficulty closing. Now, a "good" spring assist in my opinion doesn't affect closing.
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I've handled a couple of Ken Onion customs that were like this. The spring was extremely light, so that you could barely feel it when closing the knife, but it would be there to give the flipping action a little extra push. This, combined with an extremely smooth action, combined with a lighter detent than would be required on a knife with no spring at all, created a really wonderful result that I have not experienced before on any other knives.
 
I prefer controlled one handed opening . I dislike the awkwardness of closing assisted openers one handed. I have two deassisted folders that I like pretty well, but now I just avoid assisted knives no matter how much I like them otherwise. Too many other choices.
 
My first experience with assisted openers was a Kershaw Cryo. I liked the knife enough (and the price was right) that I figured I would give it a try.

The torsion bar fired VERY hard, and I was concerned about dropping the knife when the blade hit the backstop. Likewise, charging the torsion bar made the blade much harder to close. To me, it felt like the assist actually made the knife less safe, and more likely to cut me. It never happened, but it was always in the back of my mind.

I removed the torsion bar, and the Cryo immediately became one of my favorites.

So, safety and ease of use, are my reasons for removing the assist.

I only ever purchased one other assisted knife, a Mini-Cyclone with a little switch that disables the assist. If it had not been for that switch, I would have waited for another Mini-Cyclone to come up for bid. It's that important, to me.

Edit: I should say "perception of safety", to be more precise, but in practice, it's the same thing.
 
Velitrius said:
I received a Kershaw from a member once. It came de-assisted. It took about a minute to re-assist it.

The spring held the knife closed as well as assisting with the opening. So much so that it was difficult to open to the point where the spring took over.

The detent was fine, so I re- de-assisted it. It was a much better knife this way.

Also had a Scallion that would just open in my pocket. I was going to de-assist it, but I just stopped carrying it instead.

I can see why folks would de-assist.
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My Hissatsu was like that. I flip flopped between assist and de-assist until I finally filed down and bent the back spring enough that I could open it easily, though it still stays solidly closed in the pocket.
Also have a Fire Spark that had their new FireSafe on it that sucked, so I filed it off. It opens great now. Hasn't opened in my pocket yet, but yeah, it's a little TOO easy to open now and I don't carry it much.
 
Henry Beige said:
To me, assist is kind of a novelty feature, but if a knife comes with it, I'll leave it alone. My assisted Mini Barrage is one of my favorite knives.
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My sentiments exactly. To me, spring assist feels like a flea market gimmick. If it opens fast and hard enough then I like them but most assisted knives I've used were soft and sluggish and just felt like a half-hearted wannabe.
 
brancron said:
I've handled a couple of Ken Onion customs that were like this. The spring was extremely light, so that you could barely feel it when closing the knife, but it would be there to give the flipping action a little extra push. This, combined with an extremely smooth action, combined with a lighter detent than would be required on a knife with no spring at all, created a really wonderful result that I have not experienced before on any other knives.
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Exactly how I would describe my experience.

Without assist, the thumb on a small thumb stud can slip and offer only a partial opening, and this for me can happen with Spyderco holes, since they require more thumb reach, particularly with the old-style small holes that offer only a modest "purchase". Flippers without assist can also offer partial openings. My $25 Kershaw assisted flipper NEVER offers a partial opening, unless you deliberately hold back your pushing motion...

The opening noise is NOT a loud and obnoxious snap like on true automatics: It is completely indistinguishable from a normal one-handed folder... Yet another advantage...

To me they are exactly like automatics, with absolutely none of the reliability/safety/fear-mongering downsides of automatics. When they are right they are just a wonderful thing that spoils you for any other folders... All upside and no downside. The harder closing is slightly true, but a very, very modest effect... Yet another plus is that when you know how simple and brilliant the Kershaw assisted mechanism is, you are even more confident about it...

Gaston
 
Gaston444 said:
Exactly how I would describe my experience.

Without assist, the thumb on a small thumb stud can slip and offer only a partial opening, and this for me can happen with Spyderco holes, since they require more thumb reach, particularly with the old-style small holes that offer only a modest "purchase". Flippers without assist can also offer partial openings. My $25 Kershaw assisted flipper NEVER offers a partial opening, unless you deliberately hold back your pushing motion...

The opening noise is NOT a loud and obnoxious snap like on true automatics: It is completely indistinguishable from a normal one-handed folder... Yet another advantage...

To me they are exactly like automatics, with absolutely none of the reliability/safety/fear-mongering downsides of automatics. When they are right they are just a wonderful thing that spoils you for any other folders... All upside and no downside. The harder closing is slightly true, but a very, very modest effect... Yet another plus is that when you know how simple and brilliant the Kershaw assisted mechanism is, you are even more confident about it...

Gaston
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Just nope.
 
I have a couple Assisted openers, a Kershaw Blur and Knockout, and a Benchmade Emissary. I can one hand close the Knockout quite easily and don't feel in danger of painting the carpet red while doing so. The Emissary I would only close with two hands. I have thought of trying to de-assist it as I like the spear point blade. I'll keep the knife intact though for value's sake.
 
brancron said:
A great example is the ZT 0770CF:
auLcBaX.jpg

An awesome knife, and there’s nothing else quite like it that’s unassisted, so why not try to de-assist and see what happens? As it turns out, I’ve heard that the results vary—some people find the flipping action to be not so great after de-assisting due to a weakish detent.


They can also be more dangerous to close one-handed if you’re not careful. One more than one occasion over the years I’ve been closing a spring-assisted knife one-handed without paying much attention, and the spring pressure pushing back at me would cause something to slip and wobble, bringing my thumb into harm’s way. Sort of hard to describe, but the point is that it’s just harder to safely control a spring-assisted knife when closing.
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It depends on which version of the 0770. The aluminum one de-assists fine from what I've heard. The CF didn't. I the the flexibility of the CF scales messed with the smoothness of the pivot. I re-assisted it and sold it. I hope in the future there will be a manual version, as otherwise it's a great design.

One of the reasons I don't like assisted opening is its not sheeple friendly. I used to work in an office environment and some people would freak when I opened a knife quickly, so I always opened two handed when opening packages, etc.

Sent via pony express
 
I deassisted my Kershaw Blur (S30V). The advantage to deassisting a knife is that you can open it how ever fast or slow you want. When I'm in public I don't want to attract attention with a very loud and intimidating thwack that you get from the assist. Also, with my blur I can actually open it faster than the assist anyways. And there's something really relaxing and simplistic about not having an assist feature. It comes down to personal preference really. The only knife (that I no longer own) that I preferred the assist was my ZT 0350 only because without it, I had to give the knofe a wrist flick to open it
 
K.O.D. said:
It depends on which version of the 0770. The aluminum one de-assists fine from what I've heard. The CF didn't. I the the flexibility of the CF scales messed with the smoothness of the pivot. I re-assisted it and sold it. I hope in the future there will be a manual version, as otherwise it's a great design.

One of the reasons I don't like assisted opening is its not sheeple friendly. I used to work in an office environment and some people would freak when I opened a knife quickly, so I always opened two handed when opening packages, etc.

Sent via pony express
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I've had an example of each, the CF and the Al and both were very nice with the assist in and equally disappointing with it taken out. Just didn't flip all that well. If I recall correctly, the ZT 750 I had was the same way. All great knives though with the torsion bar in.

My brother has had a couple of ZT's that were excellent with and without the assist in. A 350 and a 566. The 350 is probably the best assisted knife I've used. Strong detent yet easy to actuate when needed and closes with very little resistance considering there is a spring it is fighting against. Both the flipper tab and thumb starts are easy to use as well.

Had a similar experience with the Hissatsu as rschuch. Very hard to overcome the spring and IIRC you had to come from a specific angle to get it right. It was a well made knife and deassisting it made it extremely smooth. If it was ground a little thinner I probably would have kept it.

While some assists are nice, I don't find them necessary for me and much prefer a manual folder.
 
Agree with someone above me, theyre harder to close one handed. And ive had the blade open in my pocket, with the spring there, it forces the knife to stay in a dangerous position.

I own 2 assisted knives, kershaw shield and ZT0566. The shield cant be deassisted, and i deassist the 0566.
 
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