Why inferior steels in knives?

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The OP mentions these steels: "440A, 420HC, 440C, AUS-8, AUS-10, 12C27, 14C28N, 5160, 1095, 8Cr13Mov, 52100, 80CrV2, even "old Krupp steel."" These being taken as representative of "pretty good" steels used in many If not most knives, that are not super-steels.
Two questions. Assuming these were all to be used to make the same model knife, would there be much difference in the cost to make the knife because of the steel used?
And, assuming good heat treatment & etc., would they all work pretty much the same? Or would some be consistently better than others?
These questions are left somewhat vague.
In this thread and across the history of Blade Forums as I've read it, there seem two views that appear contradictory. First, the general view, sometimes expressed emphatically, that some steels are better than others, and opposed the general view that within categories, even very broad categories, of steels, that while there are differences, the differences aren't too important, don't matter too much.
I myself am of the opinion that when the knife goes to work, the steel matters, and that sooner or later it will matter a lot.
Knives that don't do any work, of course, all function perfectly.


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Dagoth_Blur said:
100%. The big difference with Spyderco in my view however is they are still at the literal cutting edge of knife steels. They have more options in regard to steel type than anyone else
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Spyderco has certainly been a leader in this regard. Beyond just using different steels, they've given us new steel. They also drive the competition to improve.
 
Don’t buy the hype. It is just what unimaginative copywriters use to justify their advertisement and pricing. Most cutlery grade steels will perform well enough that you wouldn’t know the difference. What counts is edge geometry and heat treatment; Both need to match the intended use. Who cares if you have to stop once every 50 cuts to swipe your blade on a stone, would it make a difference if it were every 75 cuts? Who’s counting? Restoring the edge takes as long as brushing your hair out of your eyes, you are not going to notice it and for most of us cutting is not a race against time.

N2s
 
Dagoth_Blur said:
I think it's pretty straightforward as to why Benchmade can charge the butterfly tax. They have been around for a pretty long time in comparison to most other modern folding knife companies and been producing knives better than your average hardware store knife but not too expensive for the average person (at least in the past). The axis lock is ambidextrous and really easy to understand and quite strong. On top of that they like to project a strong police, military, and general blue collar type of vibe as a company which appeals to many people who buy knives. They have ingrained in people that buying Benchmade is being American, which in many ways is true. Oh yeah and they spend a good deal on marketing before most folding knife companies were even a thought in someone's mind.
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This

And the fact that you can buy one and expect it to last the rest of your life. If you abuse it and break it, mail it to them and usually for free, they fix it or replace it. A true buy it for life item.
 
CVamberbonehead said:
The real question in my mind is why so many people think they need super steel of the week knives? lol
In today’s modern world you hardly need a knife at all anymore. Lots of people (Neanderthals lol) get by just fine without having anything but 1 kitchen knife. Regular old “inferior“ steel works just as well as it ever has and it doesn’t balloon the cost of knives like Magnacut. A Buck 110 still does a great job, same as it ever has. And doesn’t need fancy sharpening equipment or a trip back to the mothership for sharpening when it dulls.
There is more to life than edge retention, and edge geometry is way more important than the name of the steel on the knife. Heck, a normal Buck 110 in 420hc outcuts a lot of super steel knives with thick “overbuilt” grinds!
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You're on a knife enthusiast forum, no one here actually needs most of their knives, regardless of what kind of steel they have. Better steels are what enable the ability to have better geometry, so it's not like you choose between a worse steel with better geometry and a better steel with worse geometry. This is what happens when you choose edge geometry for each steel such that they have the same toughness:

1000014157.png

You can see steels like Magnacut are able to reach high hardness and edge retention at whatever toughness is needed. The simple carbon steels are the opposite, they would be even farther to the bottom left on this graph.
 
not2sharp said:
Don’t buy the hype. It is just what unimaginative copywriters use to justify their advertisement and pricing. Most cutlery grade steels will perform well enough that you wouldn’t know the difference. What counts is edge geometry and heat treatment; Both need to match the intended use. Who cares if you have to stop once every 50 cuts to swipe your blade on a stone, would it make a difference if it were every 75 cuts? Who’s counting? Restoring the edge takes as long as brushing your hair out of your eyes, you are not going to notice it and for most of us cutting is not a race against time.

N2s
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I've got to agree with you. Heat treatment and edge geometry need to meet the intended use.
 
For a couple companies, they k ow hkwnto heat treat 420HC so it holds an ok edge, and are incredibly tough. Look at how the Gerber Strongarm is much beloved by the "pound a knife through logs" people without having to be overly thick or with a grind made to do only that. They are still decent at actually being knives and slicing things. Buck is similar across most of its line.
 
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Synov said:
You're on a knife enthusiast forum
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This is what kills me about these types of questions. Its like going to a car forum and being like "a factory Honda Civic gets me to the same places as all this stuff you are talking about so whats the point". Like brother...you are on a specialized forum with people who have spent more time doing this stuff than you have been alive.
 
Dagoth_Blur said:
This is what kills me about these types of questions. Its like going to a car forum and being like "a factory Honda Civic gets me to the same places as all this stuff you are talking about so whats the point". Like brother...you are on a specialized forum with people who have spent more time doing this stuff than you have been alive.
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People who drive Civics aren't dummies. They just like boring cars.
 
Ron Texas said:
People who drive Civics aren't dummies. They just like boring cars.
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That also depends on the board you're on. If you said that on a JDM board, they would lose their minds.

Yes, I drive a Civic, great cars for commuting. Boring, yep.

But there's also a custom market for them, just like knives.

Honda_Civic_Black_Purple_Custom_Vinyl_Wrap_1.jpg

Same could be said for a '67 fastback Mustang. Kinda a boring grocery getter, until...

Eleanor shows up.

Gone-in-60-Seconds-Eleanor-Ford-Mustang-10.jpg
 
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