Why is paper so bad for knives

[stabman]

Everyone has regular sand paper laying around. Grab a sheet of 320 grit regular sand paper

Are you talking about dollar store sandpaper or something?
That junk won't sharpen the Chinese steel either.

I'm talking about regular silicon carbide paper you get at Canadian Tire, Home Depot, or anywhere else.
If that's fancy to you, then sure, I guess I'm using "fancy equipment."

I must also live in a fancy apartment..it has walls AND heat.

 

[Boris74]

Are you talking about dollar store sandpaper or something?
That junk won't sharpen the Chinese steel either.

I'm talking about regular silicon carbide paper you get at Canadian Tire, Home Depot, or anywhere else.
If that's fancy to you, then sure, I guess I'm using "fancy equipment."

I must also live in a fancy apartment..it has walls AND heat.

I use 3M sandblaster sand paper. Good stuff.

 

[stabman]

I use 3M sandblaster sand paper. Good stuff.

Looks like it might be meant more for wood.
I generally buy stuff aimed at use for metal, usually of a type that can be used wet as well.

Of course, I used to work in mouldmaking...not much wood used there.

 

[Boris74]

Looks like it might be meant more for wood.
I generally buy stuff aimed at use for metal, usually of a type that can be used wet as well.

Of course, I used to work in mouldmaking...not much wood used there.

That's my whole point. Basic and improvised methods will sharpen a working steel, not a super steel. I lived and learned that.

 

[Ankerson]

Looks like it might be meant more for wood.
I generally buy stuff aimed at use for metal, usually of a type that can be used wet as well.

Of course, I used to work in mouldmaking...not much wood used there.

Yeah, it's ment for working with wood, not steel, just looked it up.

 

[hookahhabib]

That's my whole point. Basic and improvised methods will sharpen a working steel, not a super steel. I lived and learned that.

Respectfully, my experience differs. SiC sand paper (typically sold as wet/dry paper) on a mouse pad or phonebook has allowed me to sharpen any steel I've tried it on, ranging from 8cr, to K294 and lots in between (Elmax, M390, and CTS-204p included). On the harder super steels I would need to use more sheets of paper and need a little more time, but it has always worked worked for me. I was actually very pleasantly surprised to see how relatively easy k294 was, despite its ridiculously high wear resistance...I see that as a mark of it totally deserving its designation as a "super" steel.

Of course having said all that, I do find myself satisfied and happy with "lesser" steels as well.

While we're talking about working edges, and easy to repair steel, I have to give big respect to INFI...call it koolaid if you want, but I've never seen a knife settle into such a long lasting working edge while also being soooo easy to repair and make razor sharp. My favorite user steel by far....

 

[marcinek]

Define use.

I'm sure you can Google it if you dont know what the word means. Though you probably shouldn't have included it in your post if you are asking me to define it for you.

Maybe you can tell us what "INFIorior" means. You saying the Busse fans only use their Busses for light use (because that is what INFI is best suited for), and then, when dull in about a year, they take their knives to a mall kiosk to be sharpened?

 

[Boris74]

Respectfully, my experience differs. SiC sand paper (typically sold as wet/dry paper) on a mouse pad or phonebook has allowed me to sharpen any steel I've tried it on, ranging from 8cr, to K294 and lots in between (Elmax, M390, and CTS-204p included). On the harder super steels I would need to use more sheets of paper and need a little more time, but it has always worked worked for me. I was actually very pleasantly surprised to see how relatively easy k294 was, despite its ridiculously high wear resistance...I see that as a mark of it totally deserving its designation as a "super" steel.

Of course having said all that, I do find myself satisfied and happy with "lesser" steels as well.

While we're talking about working edges, and easy to repair steel, I have to give big respect to INFI...call it koolaid if you want, but I've never seen a knife settle into such a long lasting working edge while also being soooo easy to repair and make razor sharp. My favorite user steel by far....

I fully respect everyone's choice of steel and what they do with it. The Grand Canyon analogy comes back, you can take two people who never seen it and show one pictures and have them explain it to the other. Someone who has been there will tell them you have to see it for yourself to believe it. Your not going to see what I and others have experienced and observed (even posted in this thread by more than one person) without going there. Ever seen a super steel hit a staple in cardboard? They don't use them tiny staples for paper either for boxes. It's not a pretty sight most the time and at best you get a quite significant portion of the edge chipped out, and you will hit one at some point, even repeatedly with a blade doing legit work, there is no way around it.

For people doing medium to light work on an occasional to random basis the super steels excell greatly in they they will indeed go a long time between sharpenings. For constant actual heavy use more than one person is reporting they are so so at best mediocre. I respect not everyone uses a knife hard and their super steel is best for them. I'm saying it don't cut it for me and I know this through experience. With several making the same report the super steel fans should maybe rethink what they consider heavy use and what steel is best for it. I guarantee if you did 440C would be as super as you went when you put your working knife in your pants. All I'm doing is sharing my experience and observations.

 

[Gravy]

Web did this become a thread about sharpening?

 

[marcinek]

All I'm doing is sharing my experience and observations.

And so you have concluded this about the super steel fans...

Age of the thread is irrelevant. His info in the revival was pretty much spot on. I know too many people who slice a few boxes and observe the super steel is still very sharp and it is declared superior winner over worker steels. If you actually use a knife it's easy to observe the super steels will not wear down to a working edge and hold it, they just keep wearing, and the more worn it is the quicker it degrades. Super steels after an honest day's work, not just slicing a few boxes, will become a mini hand saw to complete tasks. Later that night when you go to return the edge you realize you need lots of time and specialized tools. Where the working steels return to very sharp quickly with basic methods of sharpening.

Yeah he revived an old one, but the use the search function guys are worse than the you revived an old thread guys, I do the same thing. His information is spot on to my observations. Skip the super steels if you actually use your knife to do work. The super steels are best suited for the light user category where it might need a sharpening once a year and they will most likely stop at that kiosk in the mall to have the dude there grind and hack at it for them. Most likely they will get bored with it and get hyped up on the newest flavor of the month super steel anyway and ditch that old boring out of style super steel for the next INFIorior super steel.

1) They don't actually use a knife;
2) They don't do an honest day's work;
3) They are incapable of sharpening their own knives;
4) They are fickle and driven only by passing fancy.

I'm not a steel junkie. I love AUS-8. Perfectly happy with it and other "un-super steels."

But I find your generalizations about our fellow members who are fans pretty insulting.

 

[marcinek]

Web did this become a thread about sharpening?

Sometime around 2007-2008.

 

[BenchCo Spydermade]

While I like higher end steels, I also think people often hate on decent non "super" steels that can get almost all the same jobs done. I find there are situations where both have advantages.

I think it is odd some people say paper chips super steels. I find paper and cardboards without metal are where my harder steels shine. I use my knives but I am more particular about my treatment of higher end hard steels (mine are zdp and s110v). I have gone pretty hard on my cruwear, s30v and d2 and have not had issues. One chip in s30v and it was because I hit a piece of metal.

While some less expensive steels are also great, super steels have been hyped because they have PROVEN performance increases in certain areas, be it edge retention, corrosion resistance or toughness. Whether someone thinks that is worth the price increase is an individual's subjective opinion.

 

[BenchCo Spydermade]

I fully respect everyone's choice of steel and what they do with it. The Grand Canyon analogy comes back, you can take two people who never seen it and show one pictures and have them explain it to the other. Someone who has been there will tell them you have to see it for yourself to believe it. Your not going to see what I and others have experienced and observed (even posted in this thread by more than one person) without going there. Ever seen a super steel hit a staple in cardboard? They don't use them tiny staples for paper either for boxes. It's not a pretty sight most the time and at best you get a quite significant portion of the edge chipped out, and you will hit one at some point, even repeatedly with a blade doing legit work, there is no way around it.

For people doing medium to light work on an occasional to random basis the super steels excell greatly in they they will indeed go a long time between sharpenings. For constant actual heavy use more than one person is reporting they are so so at best mediocre. I respect not everyone uses a knife hard and their super steel is best for them. I'm saying it don't cut it for me and I know this through experience. With several making the same report the super steel fans should maybe rethink what they consider heavy use and what steel is best for it. I guarantee if you did 440C would be as super as you went when you put your working knife in your pants. All I'm doing is sharing my experience and observations.

Your grand canyon analogy didn't work in the first place dude. Some of the more knowledgeable people here are telling you intelligent things nicely. They also explained you were using wood sand paper and complaining it wouldn't sharpen your supersteel. An understandable mistake, but I'd be embarrassed and admit my wrong after that had it been me.

 

[Boris74]

Your grand canyon analogy didn't work in the first place dude. Some of the more knowledgeable people here are telling you intelligent things nicely. They also explained you were using wood sand paper and complaining it wouldn't sharpen your supersteel. An understandable mistake, but I'd be embarrassed and admit my wrong after that had it been me.

Lol, I know what they said. It was put pretty clearly. What they did not get was sometimes you are miles from home in your buddies pole barn and worked your blade over real good over the days time. You need to put an edge back on it (more work to do). If they have nothing but wood sand paper handy you are good with AUS8 and similar. You will be back to shaving sharp in 5 minutes or less. Sometimes you won't have time to make a trip back home and break out speciality tools or metal spec sand paper to bring it back. Let me tell ya, when you have a D2 blade and your edge is is working as good as a wet floppy turd and you try to sharpen it on the only abrasive in your buddies pole barn, which was 320 grit regular sand paper and all you do is turn the sandpaper into a glossy piece of paper and your edge is still floppy turd sharp, you tend to rethink if a super steel is such a good idea for a working knife. You are not always going to be at home when your blade needs to be sharpened.

 

[Shotgun]

It's all in ones perception on what they think use is. I fully understand how some can believe the super steels are superior. I can also understand why some don't understand why others report poor performance for them because they never used their knives like some people do.

I agree with this. People use their knives in different ways and for different things. I was reading a bushcrafter's blog and he said the same old thing you hear a lot, "carbon steel is easier to sharpen then stainless and holds it's edge longer." Which in my use is just not accurate. For day to day stuff my S30V holds it's edge significantly longer than say 1095. Then on one of his other articles he was describing how he smoothed a piece of wood over and said he did it by scraping the knife along the wood. Yep, a chippy steel is the worst thing for him and I believe that it would dull much more quickly than a basic non-stainless.

I personally tend toward pairing both types of steel. Lower end stuff for grunt work and high end stuff for quick cuts and media that's abrasive but has a low risk of damaging the edge like "clean" cardboard. And I'm with you Boris on those dang staples. They tend to be hidden with labels over them at my work.

 

[stabman]

What they did not get was sometimes you are miles from home in your buddies pole barn and worked your blade over real good over the days time.

At that point, you just do what my friend suggests..."Cut harder."

Of course, it helps that he's pretty damn huge and strong, but the edge on his knives is almost always WAY past what I'd consider dull...and he cuts stuff anyway.

 

[Shotgun]

At that point, you just do what my friend suggests..."Cut harder."

That's how accidents happen. I have a scar on my arm to prove it.

 

[stabman]

That's how accidents happen. I have a scar on my arm to prove it.

Only if you slip with the blade.

Hey, I like sharp knives too...but there are legions of daily knife users out there ripping through stuff with pretty dull knives.

 

[Shotgun]

Only if you slip with the blade.

Hey, I like sharp knives too...but there are legions of daily knife users out there ripping through stuff with pretty dull knives.

So we should all just use pot metal steel because it doesn't matter anyway?

 

[The Aflac Duck]

I don't know where this is heading, but I'll say this...

I use either a spyderco double-stuff or a fallkniven DC4 to sharpen all my different steels (from 154CM to M390 to M4, they do it all).

Many times, I carry 2 knives, so when one starts getting dull I can use the spine as a steel to "revive" the edge...

"Fancy" steel doesn't require "fancy" sharpening equipment; just knowledge...