Why no Victorinox Steel Upgrade?

I'm just guessing, but I would say that 99.85% of SAK buyers find the current steel to be just fine. At the rate most people use a SAK, they won't have to sharpen it in their lifetimes. It may be an economy of scale issue, and just not worth the effort to put S30V in a $30 SAK.

I do believe this is the correct answer.

“Because they don’t have to” is also correct, but the above is more complete.

I would add that many of us who are SAK fanatics and know that what steels are available and what advantages they might provide have no desire to see Victorinox switch to something else.
 
The steel Victorinox used is already pretty perfect for the style of knives they make.
It would be interesting to see a SAK blade in some super steels because I don’t think it would work very well.

The blades are already fairly thin and I treat SAK’s like a machete in the way that I put a edge bevel that is task suitable.
Some of my SAK’s are well less than 10 degrees per side.

I doubt that I am the only tradesman that does this and I seriously doubt most super steels can stand up to such low angles, especially stainless ones.
 
I never suggested a super steel. That I would not want. What I suggested was something more modern, better edge holding, and perhaps just as tough or tougher. Sandvic 13c26 or Bohler N680 (not N609) would be great choices, especially N680. It is nearly rust proof and is used in salt water knives. It holds a much better edge than Vic's current steel, and it does not chip.

If we think about it, Vic has already ventured into this steel upgrade with Damascus steel. There is no need to be that fancy. Perhaps a special edition Alox to test the waters?
 
.... I want to emphasize also what 22-rimfire mentioned: that in countries with lower buying power SAKs are "expensive" as they are. Growing up, spending the equivalent of $5 on a knife was a significant amount, so SAKs (costing much more than that) were out of the question, and I had to settle for a $3 knock-off (a good one at that actually, that worked for me for almost 20 years).
I started with a $0.50 slip joint from the 5&10 (Imperial brand). I dreamed of owning a Case like my Dad.... Finally with trapping money, I bought a Case Barlow (~$20 then) and used it for years for everything.

I can still remember visiting the local hardware store which had a Case display. I loved the smell of the oil that Case used on their new knives. I still do as it brings back a very fond memory.

People in the US and Europe get spoiled with their nearly disposable Vic SAKs in terms of cost and how that cost impacts our daily lives (essentially ZERO). It is not like that in other countries. I recall J jackknife mentioning in Costa Rica that the jungle guides carried a SAK and a short machete. I would be willing to bet that those SAKs were provided to them either by clients or the business. In Colombia, you didn't see many Vic SAKs because they were expensive in a relative sense. I lost (probably stolen) my Tinker there from my hotel room.... it took a day to find a store that sold them in a major city. It was easy to find jewelers with high grade emeralds and 21 carat jewelry, but a Vic SAK was a challenge.

D DocT I suspect if you see Vic upgrading their steel, it will be on their large models (huntsman series I believe it's called?). I always viewed them as expensive as is without an upgrade. I don't own any Vics larger than 111mm. I carried a 111mm SAK for at least 15 years. Now, I mostly carry the 111mm One Handed Trekker hiking in my carry bag and a smaller knife day to day.
 
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I wouldn't have their knives any other way, and I would stop buying them if they used a fancy blade steel.
I just don't or need these so called " upgraded " steels.

Surely you jest. If they decided to offer their knives with an “upgraded” stainless with better edge retention that touched up easily, you’d quit buying Vic’s products? That’s straight up silly.
I’m not calling for it because I’m satisfied with what they’re using now, but I’d definitely be willing to give something else a shot.
 
People in the US and Europe get spoiled with their nearly disposable Vic SAKs in terms of cost and how that cost impacts our daily lives (essentially ZERO). It is not like that in other countries. I recall J jackknife mentioning in Costa Rica that the jungle guides carried a SAK and a short machete. I would be willing to bet that those SAKs were provided to them either by clients or the business.

No, not really. For some reason, people in Costa Rica, especially in the city like San Jose, love SAK's. They are very very easy to find and every ferreteria, (kind of hardware store and agricultural supply store) sells them. They had SAK stand up displays next to the shelves of machetes and machete sheaths.

In the urban city of San Jose, about every second or third person in the street had a black pouch with the Swiss cross on it, on their belts. SAK's of all sizes were around. Not many machetes on view on the streets of San Jose, but outside of town, every male walking around had a 10 to 12 inch machete on his belt, and many had the pouch with a SAK and Bic lighter.

One thing that is cultural that I saw was, theres fresh fruit everywhere. Not just bananas, but mangos, papayas, citrus. It was very common to see someone in a sidewalk cafe order a cup of coffee, and takeout an orange or other fruit, and take out a SAK and peel and eat the fruit with the coffee. Always a SAK of some model. Bottles of chilled mineral water or spring water are sold everywhere and you need a cap lifter to drink. No twist off caps. But a bottle of water from a street vender and sit on a bench and takeout a piece of fruit from a bag and instant light lunch on the spot. Rinse off SAK with the last of the water and back in the belt pouch or pocket. Costa Ricans love their SAK as much as their coffee, and they have some really great coffee there!!!!

Machetes and SAk's seem to be the cutlery that makes Costa Rica function. They also love Bic lighters and pens. I you have to sign anything in San Jose, it will be with a Bic pen. Many cigars are lit with Bic lighters.
 
J jackknife Good to hear about Costa Rica. I was surprised by your comments. Maybe it has changed in South America and Central America in the last 20+ years or so.
 
Surely you jest. If they decided to offer their knives with an “upgraded” stainless with better edge retention that touched up easily, you’d quit buying Vic’s products? That’s straight up silly.
I’m not calling for it because I’m satisfied with what they’re using now, but I’d definitely be willing to give something else a shot.
I suppose if they limited themselves to the 440c or lower range I'd be okay, but anything above that I would not be buying.
As with the rest of the non knife nut world I just don't need a knife to stay sharp forever when I can easily touch it up in no time.
 
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image.jpeg image.jpeg This is a G Sekai Trekker with glued on Titanium scales. The original scales were wood. The new scales hold SAK tools (toothpick, tweezers, and pen).
I would only request the option of a premium blade not a wholesale switch on SAK blades. The main blade on this knife is ZDP-189 which can be sharpened on regular stones (no Vanadium).
 
View attachment 1346493 View attachment 1346492 This is a G Sekai Trekker with glued on Titanium scales. The original scales were wood. The new scales hold SAK tools (toothpick, tweezers, and pen).
I would only request the option of a premium blade not a wholesale switch on SAK blades. The main blade on this knife is ZDP-189 which can be sharpened on regular stones (no Vanadium).

Very nice indeed. That is what I meant, just the knife blades. The other tools should not be touched. I would prefer a lesser steel than ZDP-189. I want something I can still sharpen on the bottom of a mug or a car window top. I just want better edge retention and still able to keep that thin edge. That is one reason for my suggesting Sandvik 13C26 as it is very tough.
 
ZDP-189 sharpens up quickly on my Shapton Glass Al2O3 spritzable water stones even though it is hardened to 67HRC. The sharpening takes no time at all and the edge lasts a long time. I have all the S30, 35, 60, 90, 110, and 125 stuff, but ZDP has kicked these out of my pocket.
 
These no good?

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I've never owned a Vic SAK that I couldn't easily get razor sharp with very little effort.
And I've never seen a rusty Vic SAK.
This is true. I simply rinse off my entire SAK under the tap when it's got dusty, shake it off and put it back in the pouch. I don't know of anything else quite as maintenance free.

For years I'd always looked down on SAK's simply because of the steel. Then a few years ago I found a SAK I really wanted, the Pruner. So I decided to do a test. I bought it cheaply. Sharpened it up quickly to my usual edge and then carried it for a month without sharpening. Simply to see if how much this soft steel would bother me. I think I stropped it quickly once that month but it didn't see a stone. It's first task was to dress a brisket and from that initial baptism by fire it was used without mercy for everyday tasks. Packaging, my lunch, cable ties, cooking - the works. A month later it was somewhat ragged cutting through paper but still cut 'real' stuff very well. I had learnt the value of truly excellent geometry over steel specs. I gave the 'trial' one away to a friend and bought a fancy version of the same in blue. Since then I've been carrying a SAK pretty much.

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The 'trial' sak with the pastrami it helped to create straight out of the box.

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The posh version I bought as a result of the successful test and carried for a year or more before switching to Spartan's, first a single layer mod I made from one and then finally back to the simple basic model. Less of a looker than the Alox above but a lot more utility.
 
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Not sure if it's been mentioned yet or not but what they hey here's a repeat.

I'd wager that a very significant percentage of the SAKs victorinox sell don't end up in knife nut hands. It seems to be the knife which most people get if they don't really care about knives but just need something to cut stuff. It's the ubiquitous glove box-birthday present-engraved christmas gift-sock drawer-fishing kit knife for most every member of the western world. Where people get uncomfortable around other knives even the use of the phrase "swiss army knife" salves the sheeple soul, due to its ubiquity and smiling boy scout connotations. With that in mind an upgraded steel would probably not be noticed by the majority of Victorinox's customers, and even those of us who would don't really care, as evidenced by several voices in this thread already. If I want a high performance cutting tool, I'll get one in a model that is equally high performance, not a bulky tri-layer multitool with a short blade. My spydercos and zts offer the benefits of high performance steels in packages capable of pushing those steels to their performance boundaries. They're synergistic. M390 in a SAK just seems like hot sauce in my whisky.
 
Pomsbz - that Strami looks SO GOOD! I can almost smell it. Tomorrow I must go find me some good Strami. FOOD PORN!!!! The knives are also very handsome and extremely usable I'll bet. I've been using Victorinox knives every day most of my life and wouldn't want to give any of mine up. For the price they are fantastic working knives and have saved my butt SO MANY times........
 
My two cents, I think their 1.4110 steel is used because:

- it's quite cheap
- it's easy to machine
- it's local to Europe
- they can use it for all of the different tools (at different hardesses)
- it is very corrosion resistant (good when there's a lot of crevices and parts)
- it's tradition

Would I like the blades to be made of some self respecting blade steel? Absolutely. I'd take 8cr13mov in a blade before 1.4110. I'd love to see something like S35VN or M390 (I can dream, okay?). But if it works as is, meh. There's so much other good in a SAK, I can live with it.
 
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