Why Sebenzas?

Matt, your points are well made as to why you don't like the Sebenza. The comment on the integral lock applies to all liner locks, but so be it, you prefer another locking style. The Axis and Rolling Lock are great alternatives, and I really like them both. "Jedi Knife", negative comments about knives don't start flames unless they are presented in a way which personalizes them to the owners of these knives. I think it's obvious that the "sophomoric" and "ignorant" comments fall under this category. The last thing I want to do is use this thread as a place for you and I to argue, and I tried to email you to avoid this, however you have no email address listed here. I bear no ill will toward anyone simply because they don't care for the Sebenza. I receive none of the profit from Sebenza sales, nor do I own stock in CRK. Personally, I feel that the fewer people there are who own them the better, as I enjoy owning knives which have a certain exclusivity. That being said, when someone asks for my opinion on a knife, I give it honestly, just as you did. What I don't do, whether I like the knife or not, is give my opinion on the people who own that knife.
-Paul Petrick
 
OK we need to stop. I was wrong to respond to Jedi Knife's flame. It's either you like the Sebenza or you don't. And if you don't that's perfectly fine and understandable. Let's just leave it at that. The last thing we want is to turn into a cult like those mad dog followers. Say one thing bad about a mad dog knife in that forums and if your post does not get deleted you will get flamed.

-Johnny

[This message has been edited by JoHnYKwSt (edited 02-19-2000).]
 
HERE HERE! well stated, Paul.

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russ aka bladezealot. a cat almost always blinks when hit in the head with a ball-peen hammer.
 
Originally posted by Matt Shade:
I personally don't like it and don't think the high price is justified.If you still want to buy one go ahead.
The reasons I don't like it are
1. Its an integral lock. I don't care how strong the lock is, why would you want to put your fingers in the path of a closing blade? Especially if it is as sharp as everyone here claims it is.
2. I don't care much for the overall design. Looks don't matter much to me but I don't like the sebenza very well.
3. The price. Not only do I think its sold at an unfair price, I wouldn't want to carry a knife that expensive. I use knives hard, they wear out,break, get lost. I don't have $300 to burn if it ever gets lost or stolen.
Click to expand...

Fair enough. I personally said I would never buy a liner lock after the last one I bought. Not because I thought they were inherently dangerous during closing but because many of them fail liner lock tests, even expensive ones. And they seem to wear, some rather quickly. My favorite lock is the Axis lock but so far, BM doesn't make it in a blade that excites me too much. Although I wouldn't mind having a 710 to go along with my 705.

The other thing I don't particualr care for is the thumb stud. I much prefer a hole. But I already own the closest production knife to the Sebbie with a hole, a Wegner (actually have 3).

One thing that appeals to me in the Sebenza is the ability to adjust for wear in the lockup. This looks pretty spiffy to me and I can't wait to play around with it.

As for looks, well the sebenza just trips my trigger. I love the fly buy couldn't justify the extra deniro for it. When I get this one and if I like it, well maybe. Also, like you I'm a hard user of knives and I can't see getting nice artwork on a handle I'm just going to muck up a bit.

As for cost, I once bought a pair of Leica binoculars for $1200--an extremely high price for good binos. Doubt you could tell $600 worth of difference between these and a $600 pair of Nikons. But I've never regretted it. When I'm out birding with 20 or 30 other people, when they can hardly make out the field markings on the bird, I always can. The Swift Audubons ($300) and the Nikons I mentioned above probably are just as good at resolution but I've used Leicas before, under hard-use conditions and I know they will take a beating and may last my lifetime.

As for carrying a $300 knife around (price of my small sebby), I can't wait! If I lose it, I will kick myself in the ass but I haven't lost a knife in years and I'll take the risk.

I hope I'm not disappointed with it. I could be,who knows? If I think it's a POS for the price, I'll be the first to let you know. I've never handled one so I'm basing my purchase on what I've read in magazines and on the opinions of people I respect in this forum and on the fact that I just love the style and high-tech simplicity of it. The Synergy is similar, and similarly priced I believe, but I just don't like the style. Doubt I would cough up the bucks for one of those without handling one first.



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Hoodoo

The low, hoarse purr of the whirling stone—the light-press’d blade,
Diffusing, dropping, sideways-darting, in tiny showers of gold,
Sparkles from the wheel.

Walt Whitman
 
Kudos, Hoodoo! Very well said. I personally don't care if someone approves of my purchases as long as I am happy. The last thing I need is to have to justify my purchases to anyone. I firmly believe that the Sebenza can stand on it's own merits without me attempting to defend it. But I just have to say one thing in terms of the Sebenza being an overpriced production knife; show me a production knife at half the price where you will find a premium blade steel, spot on heat treating, perfectly milled titanium handles, anodizing, a variety of options to individualize the knife, refurbishing as needed and customer service that sets the standard for the industry. As to those that insist on flaming us, let them go. Maybe someday they will find a knife that actually means something to them and then they will understand.

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It's only a mistake if you fail to learn from it!
 
Matt Shade,
Don't stress out. Nobody has a problem with you no liking or wanting a Sebenza. The flack is directed at the one dissenter that started with the insult.

Chi
smile.gif


[This message has been edited by CK (edited 02-20-2000).]
 
Matt Shade,
Don't stress out. Nobody has a problem with you no liking or wanting a Sebenza.
The flack is directed at the one dissenter that started with the insult.
Click to expand...

Matt Shade is not stressed out at all, as a matter of fact he made a fantastic point I'd like to emphasize:

This happens everytime there is a thread on sebenzas. Someone asks for
everyone's opinion on the sebenza. You get 4 million posts abut how good it is.
And about 5 posts that say it isn't that great. Then the people who own the
sebenza get insulted and take offense to the 5 posts against it.
Click to expand...

Kudos to you, Matt.

The real truth is that 1) I doubt that you are knowledgable enough to know what
"most people think" and 2)the real reason ANY thread ends up in flames is
because of posts such as yours. You started the name calling and now you
pretend it never happened. I doubt that most people would get upset about
whether you like or dislike the Sebenza. But your attack was not aimed
specifically at the knife, unless a knife can be sophomoric and ignorant. That
would be an amazing feat. And btw, you have yet to make a single post
illustrating the so called "fact" that Sebenza's are not worth the money people
pay for them. So why don't you stick to the facts. Go ahead and attack the knife,
I could care less. In fact, since I don't own one, I'd love to learn all the bad
things about Sebenzas before I send in the check.
Click to expand...

"ptalpha",

I doubt that you're knowledgable enough to be judging how knowledgable others are. That being said, I am certainly glad you displayed the typical righteous indignation so commonly shown against those who dislike Sebenzas. I can only can encouragement from the likes of you. Truthfully, I insulted no one personally, but, as is so typical, people such as yourself resort to the "I'm offended, how dare you dislike this knife" response. Your tantrums hardly make the Sebenza a better knife.

JK


[This message has been edited by Jedi Knife (edited 02-20-2000).]
 
Originally posted by Jedi Knife:
"ptalpha",
I doubt that you're knowledgable enough to be judging how knowledgable others are. That being said, I am certainly glad you displayed the typical righteous indignation so commonly shown against those who dislike Sebenzas. I can only can encouragement from the likes of you. Truthfully, I insulted no one personally, but, as is so typical, people such as yourself resort to the "I'm offended, how dare you dislike this knife" response. Your tantrums hardly make the Sebenza a better knife.
Click to expand...

This is actually kinda of funny. Hilarious, really.
smile.gif
First of all, I know enough to know that you are replying to the wrong person oh omniscient jedi. Maybe you should pay a little more attention to who is saying what instead of putting words into people's mouths that were never spoken. Second, if you truly do, as you claim, know what everyone is thinking, then I bow to your god-like powers. Truly impressive. You are a jedi after all! Third, you perpetuate the myth (i.e. straw man) that people are ticked in this thread 'cause you spoke bad about a knife. And here I thought you could tell what "everyone" is thinking. Suffice it to say that you are only fooling yourself. Whatever flame you and I have going on, I can tell you flat out, it has absolutely nothing to do with a Sebenza (except in your mind). BTW, never owned one myself.

I would really appreciate it if you would go back over all your posts in this thread and collect all the salient points that deal directly with the problems associated with the Sebenza. I've been having a hard time just figuring out what they are, given the content of your posts. Evidently you must have deleted some of them or I've just missed them somehow. All I've seen you do is whine about people that own Sebenzas but I can't find much in your posts that have anything all to do with the knife itself.

You see, I'm planning on buying one (well, I've actually ordered one but you know how that goes--cripes you'd think the are as rare as old antiques as hard as they are to get) and I would like to know more about its bad qualities before I actually send the check. What were they again? Somehow I've seemed to miss this in your really useful and psychologically insightful posts.
rolleyes.gif


Also, when you start accusing people of having a tantrum, again, I suggest you read your own posts. I'd say tantrum pretty well describes them. Ok, maybe hissy fit, I dunno. It's a toss.
biggrin.gif



------------------
Hoodoo

The low, hoarse purr of the whirling stone—the light-press’d blade,
Diffusing, dropping, sideways-darting, in tiny showers of gold,
Sparkles from the wheel.

Walt Whitman

[This message has been edited by Hoodoo (edited 02-20-2000).]
 
Hoodoo; I will bet that AZCK or Northwest Cutlery has 'benzas in stock. Both companies are first class, and deal very fairly with their customers. Walt
 
Originally posted by Walt Welch:
Hoodoo; I will bet that AZCK or Northwest Cutlery has 'benzas in stock. Both companies are first class, and deal very fairly with their customers. Walt
Click to expand...

Walt,
I ordered a small "new classic." Have you seen any of these around yet? I don't know much about them other than what I read in a magazine article a week ago. I haven't heard if any of these are being shipped yet. Thanks for the tip, though. If my current supplier turns out to be a wash, I will check them out.

And geez, how refreshing it is to have a civil, helpful response in this thread!
smile.gif


------------------
Hoodoo

The low, hoarse purr of the whirling stone—the light-press’d blade,
Diffusing, dropping, sideways-darting, in tiny showers of gold,
Sparkles from the wheel.

Walt Whitman
 
Hoodoo is right, JK. Here I thought I'd been curteous and diplomatic, only to find that you felt compelled to attack me because of what someone ELSE said.
Well folks, this thread has now gone beyond the realm of any discourse which is informative or even thought-provoking. Like I stated in a previous post, Jedi Knife I'd be more than happy to discuss this (or any) issue with you in e-mail; my address is posted so contact me if you want to. I'd bet that we have more in common than this thread indicates. Gentlemen, I bid you farewell.
-Paul
 
Northwest cutlery has a couple different styles of the sebenza in stock. Not that I'm interested
smile.gif
, but anyone who is should check it out. First you should stop off at the spyderco section , and check out all those great knives for less than a million bucks
wink.gif


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Fix it right the first time, use Baling Wire !
 
Originally posted by Matt Shade:
Northwest cutlery has a couple different styles of the sebenza in stock. Not that I'm interested
smile.gif
, but anyone who is should check it out. First you should stop off at the spyderco section , and check out all those great knives for less than a million bucks
wink.gif

Click to expand...

Matt,
I cruised over there to see what they had but no "new classics." The ariticle I read on these said that for more information, contact Chris Reeve but when I went to their website, I couldn't find anything there either. I suppose I should send them an email to see how soon before these become widely available.

Thanks for the tip!
smile.gif



------------------
Hoodoo

The low, hoarse purr of the whirling stone—the light-press’d blade,
Diffusing, dropping, sideways-darting, in tiny showers of gold,
Sparkles from the wheel.

Walt Whitman
 
Nicely done guys! See we can all get along
cool.gif
. Now I can sleep tonite.

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It's only a mistake if you fail to learn from it!
 
Because the other mass production knives lack QC, have inferior steel. inferior locks, and porr cutomer service. The Sebenza is better than many customs - sharper and better QC.
 
Name a better production knife? Name a better custom knife - some have definite QC problems?

Get the best and forget the rest. It's cheaper in the long-run.
 
QC stands for Quality Control, this is the process used to catch defective products. If you rely on QC only it is inevitable that some bad ones will slip through. QA, on the other hand stands for Quality Assurance, this is the process used to prevent defective products. If you spend the time, effort and money working on preventive measures to reduced defects, the outcome is fewer products that you have to catch through QC and a lower overall cost for quality in your production. This I believe is the true area that CRK excels.

------------------
It's only a mistake if you fail to learn from it!
 
Originally posted by Walt Welch:
Hoodoo; I will bet that AZCK or Northwest Cutlery has 'benzas in stock.
Click to expand...

Walt, I couldn't find any Chris Reeve stuff at AZCK.

------------------
Hoodoo

The low, hoarse purr of the whirling stone—the light-press’d blade,
Diffusing, dropping, sideways-darting, in tiny showers of gold,
Sparkles from the wheel.

Walt Whitman
 
Akula, without naming names (space constraints), there are any number of custom knives that go beyond matching the Seb. And they do so without the benefit of mechanically cranking out several thousand identical pieces a year. Some at prices competitive with CRK. Far more impressive, IMHO.

There are production knives that do match the Seb.

I refuse to get drawn into the back and forth, but while the Sebenza is a very nice knife, it is NOT the penultimate expression.

A statement like yours reflects the blind, cult-like attitude that does as much to turn people off of the Sebenza as it does to turn them on.

For further information, do a search for the term "Mad Dog".

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AKTI Member #A000832

"That which does not kill me just postpones the inevitable."
 
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