Yelling at the tv - forged in fire

I'd have bought a plank of ash. Seems a bit more "springy" than hickory, if anything it might be better for this.

If he had used ash or hickory (or oak, yew, or countless others) and ensured a straight grain, he definitely would have avoided the problems he had. While wood does have vairitions, it is easily strong enough for the task. If he wanted to make double sure, he would split the shaft from a quartersawn board of acceptable size, and then worked it with a drawknife down to size. That or work on a LONG bed lathe. It has worked for thousands of years, and it isn't that hard to do.
 
FIF has annoyed me from it's very inception. The entire series has fed to the LIE that the MATERIAL offers little in the outcome. Rather, it is solely in the smith's HANDS which make for the superior blade! Absolute GARBAGE! It's this rediculous mysticism, that lends to the false belief that ancient samurai swords have the ability to "cut through anything"! When, in reality, one of those swords put up against a sword made with modern alloy, would fail immediately!

What's worse is that there are still those certain "smiths" today who actually believe this nonsense! They think forging JUNK somehow gives said junk supernatural cutting power! REDICULOUS!
 
FIF has annoyed me from it's very inception. The entire series has fed to the LIE that the MATERIAL offers little in the outcome. Rather, it is solely in the smith's HANDS which make for the superior blade! Absolute GARBAGE! It's this rediculous mysticism, that lends to the false belief that ancient samurai swords have the ability to "cut through anything"! When, in reality, one of those swords put up against a sword made with modern alloy, would fail immediately!

What's worse is that there are still those certain "smiths" today who actually believe this nonsense! They think forging JUNK somehow gives said junk supernatural cutting power! REDICULOUS!

We must be watching entirely different shows. One thing FF shows is how forged blades break and how important good material is for a good blade.
 
FIF has annoyed me from it's very inception. The entire series has fed to the LIE that the MATERIAL offers little in the outcome. Rather, it is solely in the smith's HANDS which make for the superior blade! Absolute GARBAGE! It's this rediculous mysticism, that lends to the false belief that ancient samurai swords have the ability to "cut through anything"! When, in reality, one of those swords put up against a sword made with modern alloy, would fail immediately!

What's worse is that there are still those certain "smiths" today who actually believe this nonsense! They think forging JUNK somehow gives said junk supernatural cutting power! REDICULOUS!
I don't think you've put enough time in to watching the show and listening to the comments. You just made some black and white statements regarding a show(and craft) that is in full color. If you can bare through a few seasons, you'll be better for it. Are there misconceptions? Yes. Is there misinformation? Yes. Is there good info? Absolutely. Can you learn from Forged in Fire? Definitely.

We've had BF members who are top-notch makers, on that show.... and Salem, too! lol.

The show is what it is.... a competition under restricting conditions, meant to entertain.

And I'm only adding this because you did it twice and emphasized it... It is spelled "ridiculous" not "red..."
 
What's worse is that there are still those certain "smiths" today who actually believe this nonsense! They think forging JUNK somehow gives said junk supernatural cutting power! REDICULOUS!
Of course idiots and charlatans exist everywhere. But dont be so quick to discount all those ”certain smiths” as believing nonsense.
Part of success in Smithing is talking at a individual customers level of what they understand or want to believe.
Those ”certain smiths” maybe just playing along. I did it alot, and the wallet was much happier for it.
 
FIF has annoyed me from it's very inception. The entire series has fed to the LIE that the MATERIAL offers little in the outcome. Rather, it is solely in the smith's HANDS which make for the superior blade! Absolute GARBAGE! It's this rediculous mysticism, that lends to the false belief that ancient samurai swords have the ability to "cut through anything"! When, in reality, one of those swords put up against a sword made with modern alloy, would fail immediately!

What's worse is that there are still those certain "smiths" today who actually believe this nonsense! They think forging JUNK somehow gives said junk supernatural cutting power! REDICULOUS!
You miss the point of the show. It's entertainment, not educational.
I've enjoyed every episode! :D
 
I would definitely prefer if the FIF challenges were something other than: forge a knife from some hunk of a cannon/used blade/whatever, HT it under time constraint in a brightly lit area with a vertical forge and some luck, grind heavily after HT before temper, have blade tempered by someone else, slap on a handle w/ 5m epoxy and bash into a block of X.

It would be great to see: take your pick of steels, forge, grind, HT in a controlled environment, control for as many variables as possible. But then every episode would come down to: Bob's finish and hamon looked great, but Bill's slightly weight forward blade made it bight slightly more deeply into the sugar cane. There would be no spectacular failures, no big warps, no cracks, no handle failures. Even if you left the time constraint for the 1st challenge, if you gave guys a full range of HT tools and known steels, blade failures would be extraordinarily low.

We see failures nearly every episode. Any vaguely experienced smith, working with known materials in a reasonable size with good HT equipment, even under time constraint could turn in a structurally sound, straight blade in 3 hrs. The show would be boring for most viewers. When was the last time a maker here had a blade fail while doing something that they didn't already know was high risk (interrupted quench for hamon development for instance)?

So, just take the show for what it is: kinda fun, kinda silly, and a good way to see cool techniques you haven't seen before and the failure of dumb ideas you may never have even considered before. Also, the cautionary tale of competent smiths pushed past their comfort zone and rather than doing research, using rake handles on $10k spears.
 
FIF has annoyed me from it's very inception. The entire series has fed to the LIE that the MATERIAL offers little in the outcome. Rather, it is solely in the smith's HANDS which make for the superior blade! Absolute GARBAGE! It's this rediculous mysticism, that lends to the false belief that ancient samurai swords have the ability to "cut through anything"! When, in reality, one of those swords put up against a sword made with modern alloy, would fail immediately!

What's worse is that there are still those certain "smiths" today who actually believe this nonsense! They think forging JUNK somehow gives said junk supernatural cutting power! REDICULOUS!

There's absolutely zero question that modern alloys with modern heat treating will outperform a basic carbon steel blade treated in a coal or propane forge, but that still doesn't discount a bladesmith's contributions to a final product, regardless of materials or process. The show isn't about making the best, toughest and sharpest knives ever created, but working within specified constraints/parameters to make a better knife than the smith next to you. As for "junk" steel, they may not always get a pristine bar of W2, or 1084, but the smith's are always given a hardenable steel suitable for taking and holding an edge. It's up to the smiths to make the best decisions on how to get to the end product.

We see failures nearly every episode. Any vaguely experienced smith, working with known materials in a reasonable size with good HT equipment, even under time constraint could turn in a structurally sound, straight blade in 3 hrs. The show would be boring for most viewers. When was the last time a maker here had a blade fail while doing something that they didn't already know was high risk (interrupted quench for hamon development for instance)?

You may be giving some of the smiths a little too much credit... This thread was started (if I recall) in response to watching a "vaguely experienced smith" break a blade of known material while at his home forge.
A few of the episodes have also shown smiths trying to heat and forge massive chunks of steel (whether known or unknown) that would have been enough for 3 or 4 knives in the given parameters. In other cases, they sometimes start with too small of a piece.

I'm not saying the show doesn't have its shortcomings, or that certain parts aren't engineered solely for entertainment value or to increase odds of failures, but at the same time, nearly every show has at least one or two stand out smiths that turn in a fairly well done piece, while still working within the given constraints. Salem, in his episode, was a prime example of this. Fuad's friction folder was another more recent example (his later made big box store rake handle not withstanding).
 
FIF has annoyed me from it's very inception. The entire series has fed to the LIE that the MATERIAL offers little in the outcome. Rather, it is solely in the smith's HANDS which make for the superior blade! Absolute GARBAGE! It's this rediculous mysticism, that lends to the false belief that ancient samurai swords have the ability to "cut through anything"! When, in reality, one of those swords put up against a sword made with modern alloy, would fail immediately!

What's worse is that there are still those certain "smiths" today who actually believe this nonsense! They think forging JUNK somehow gives said junk supernatural cutting power! REDICULOUS!

That's an interesting posting style. In case you needed a reminder, here:

upload_2018-4-16_17-37-46.png

Maybe I'm wrong. But I doubt it.
 
I wouldn't say they've always been given suitable steel, as lawnmower blades have been on at least twice....
 
What's worse? A lawnmower blade sourced from a company that's verified to make them from 5160 or a random coil spring from a random car?
 
If the lawnmower blade is indeed one of those.

Its the scrap steel, and the typical TV stuff that put me off it. Mind you I don't really watch TV at all, so I'm not the best to really comment
 
If you pay close attention you will catch little slips of the tong by will. Like last episode is a prime example of this. Thy gave them the cannon and there was a little slip where will said the axle was W1 or W2. I can’t remember which one but it was one of thoes. I would be fairly certain any steel given to them to make a knife is known steel. At least to the judges if not to the contestants.
 
I wouldn't go as far as to say they "know" the steel they're giving to the contestants. They know the type, maybe.

They should have an episode where they ditch the parameters and allow the smiths to make whatever they want to suit a range of predetermined tests.

BTW... I have made several lawnmower blade machetes for neighbors, friends and my son. I have never had a complaint. Even left the holes in. I told them upfront it was more of a novelty than a tool but they love the fact it was once a lawnmower blade. I'd never SELL one to anybody but hey, these things are still cutting

A "sliver" from a blade off a huge tractor deck. Complete with ABS pipe sheath

mower blade.jpg mower blade2.jpg
 
What's worse? A lawnmower blade sourced from a company that's verified to make them from 5160 or a random coil spring from a random car?
John Deere blades are a reliable source of good steel. As kuraki states, they include right in their info sheet this is known quality steel they use. They just temper it down to a lower hardness for the given purpose.
 
BTW... I have made several lawnmower blade machetes for neighbors, friends and my son. I have never had a complaint. Even left the holes in. I told them upfront it was more of a novelty than a tool but they love the fact it was once a lawnmower blade. I'd never SELL one to anybody but hey, these things are still cutting

A "sliver" from a blade off a huge tractor deck. Complete with ABS pipe sheath

View attachment 889262 View attachment 889263

Rick, I would gladly not pay you for one of your crappy “mow”chettes.... you know.... just to make sure nobody else has to suffer through using it.

Those look amazing.
 
If you pay close attention you will catch little slips of the tong by will. Like last episode is a prime example of this. Thy gave them the cannon and there was a little slip where will said the axle was W1 or W2. I can’t remember which one but it was one of thoes. I would be fairly certain any steel given to them to make a knife is known steel. At least to the judges if not to the contestants.
I brand new shinny piece of W1 drill rod slid in for the axle. And two knuckle heads on there trying to cut a chunk of the fake canon barrel for blades. Too funny!:D
 
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