Your customers: Thin Blades or prybars?

[rustyrazor]

There's a matching 6" knife with a sabre grind. $425.00 worth of 3v, after duty, tax, and conversion to Canadian. I suggested 80crv2, to save money, and the geometry is so thick, that 3v is overkill. Nope, 3v it was. :thumbup:

lol... at that size, ats 34 is likely overkill! one thing's for sure, it's gonna last him for a lifetime or 20. Man, i miss alberta sometimes. for you americans, it's like our canadian version of texas; big trucks and belt buckles, oil derricks and a lot of open range awesomeness.

 

[Rick Marchand]

... Like many guys, I started out using thick stock in the 3/16 or 1/4 range, and found that the knives just didn't cut as good as the thinner knives I was starting to make. Also after some destructive testing, I realized how much abuse the thinner knives can actually take and don't see a need for overly thick blades now.

See... that's what I love about making and using knives. I basically took the opposite route. I found that while the thinner knives sliced well, flexed well and were lighter to carry, they just didn't perform the way I needed. I required a wide cross section for lateral rigidity(yes, prying), trailing mass for chopping and a thick spine for batonning. My bladesmithing matured toward larger pieces. Who knew?

 

[rustyrazor]

that's just it... I sort of landed on the same type of geometry. I know my knives will be used up to and including at least minor abuse (including prying) and I sacrifice a little slicing ability for that due to the customers I make my knives for. I have zero use for the "sharpened prybar" sort of pieces but my knives have to be at least thick enough to not have to worry about them at all.

 

[Metalhead0483]

lol... at that size, ats 34 is likely overkill! one thing's for sure, it's gonna last him for a lifetime or 20. Man, i miss alberta sometimes. for you americans, it's like our canadian version of texas; big trucks and belt buckles, oil derricks and a lot of open range awesomeness.

Heh. Comparing parts of Canada to parts of the US is always a fun game...

 

[Horsewright]

Coming down on the other side from my Canadian friends. Making a thick knife in my world will get ya nothing but cussed, well actually it won't sell in the first place. Thin, compact slicers easy to carry with ya at all times horseback. Besides all the utilitarian chores that a knife gets called for (opening a feed sack, hay bale, rope etc), they are crucial safety items for us. If ya have a roped cow going one way and your horse going the other and you are tangled in the rope, ya need to cut it now, well yesterday. Most working cowboys I know carry 2 to 3 knives in different places so they can get to it in a time of need, NOW. Also during a branding one of the parts of processing calves is that the bull calves get castrated thus becoming steers, (you know the steak you had last night). Thick blades simply don't work for that at all. Nuther topic but neither does a highly polished edge. About 220 to 320 grit with just the apex of the edge stropped is about right.

Lot of stuff to get tangled in when "cowboy sh.." happens fast. The wife at one of our brandings last spring.

Everyone has a sharp knife whether you're ground crew or roping.

Salty was our designated cutter.

Spraying on some disinfectant after.

Everyone has a knife even when ya ride that calf for fun when he gets up.

And they're all thin ground, no prying, batoning or tree felling (we got chain saws for that), they need to slice.

 

[kuraki]

Man, and I thought banding was harsh, the way some of'em bellow

 

[Horsewright]

I think they object more to the restraint than to the cutting, numerous shots, worming, ear tagging and the hot iron.

 

[Cliff Parker]

Thin is in

 

[kuraki]

I think they object more to the restraint than to the cutting, numerous shots, worming, ear tagging and the hot iron.

Agreed. I haven't done it in a few years and to be honest don't miss it a bit. Even though we used 4 wheelers and a chute.

 

[Horsewright]

No fun that way. Chute is tougher on calves then good ropers. We use a chute on the cows and bulls though. Just did our fall works last weekend.

 

[Willie71]

lol... at that size, ats 34 is likely overkill! one thing's for sure, it's gonna last him for a lifetime or 20. Man, i miss alberta sometimes. for you americans, it's like our canadian version of texas; big trucks and belt buckles, oil derricks and a lot of open range awesomeness.

I like Alberta too. :thumbup:

You have to hold this in hand to appreciate the perception of power it has. It's pretty awesome, even though it's not my typical style.

 

[woodwrkr221]

I've only sold a few so far. Mine have mostly been small, thin, hard Wharncliffe styles I made for my brother and his co-workers at the nuclear power plant.

They're instrument mechanics and electricians and they use them while working with wiring. They tell me the next best alternative to one of my knives is a simple utility knife with replacable blades and that my knives are the only thing they have found that works better with wiring than a utility knife.

I wince every time I see or even think of someone prying or batonning with a knife. I buy my pry bars at Home Depot or Lowes.

 

[scott.livesey]

No fun that way. Chute is tougher on calves then good ropers. We use a chute on the cows and bulls though. Just did our fall works last weekend.

I liked the pictures of your spread. reminded me of my mom's parents ranch in South Dakota. i remember a couple of visits, city kid meets the cowboys. one adventure with 250 pounds of scared range calf was enough to convince me ranching was not in my future. I thinking ranching is one of the most demanding careers/way of life. Thanks for keeping beef on the table.
scott

 

[kuraki]

I've only sold a few so far. Mine have mostly been small, thin, hard Wharncliffe styles I made for my brother and his co-workers at the nuclear power plant.

They're instrument mechanics and electricians and they use them while working with wiring. They tell me the next best alternative to one of my knives is a simple utility knife with replacable blades and that my knives are the only thing they have found that works better with wiring than a utility knife.

I wince every time I see or even think of someone prying or batonning with a knife. I buy my pry bars at Home Depot or Lowes.

I wince when people say they'd "never think of doing anything like that" with a knife I made them with the intent of doing just that.

 

[Horsewright]

Thanks Scott and you're welcome. Check this one for fun over at Sheaths and Such: http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...-Go-to-the-Pro-AM-Leather-being-sold-and-used.

 

[woodwrkr221]

I wince when people say they'd "never think of doing anything like that" with a knife I made them with the intent of doing just that.

There's definitly more than one school of thought on this.

Some people want to go into the woods with a knife, a few feet of paracord and their skivvies. OK, sure, if that floats your boat.

Me? When my people and I are working for Habitat for Humanity, rebuilding Katrina homes or helping flood victims I bring my truck and trailer with all the tools I can carry and thats a lot of tools.

If I see someone pulling on some siding and they ask for a screw driver (this has happened many times) I'll automatically hand them a pry bar and later they'll thank me for handing them the better choice of tools. That's just the way I am.

 

[Rick Marchand]

It is a never-ending back and forth between the two camps. I love it! More options means more knives means more folks making and buying. This is one argument I hope lives forever.

 

[Horsewright]

All Hail Rick!!

 

[kuraki]

There's definitly more than one school of thought on this.

Some people want to go into the woods with a knife, a few feet of paracord and their skivvies. OK, sure, if that floats your boat.

Me? When my people and I are working for Habitat for Humanity, rebuilding Katrina homes or helping flood victims I bring my truck and trailer with all the tools I can carry and thats a lot of tools.

If I see someone pulling on some siding and they ask for a screw driver (this has happened many times) I'll automatically hand them a pry bar and later they'll thank me for handing them the better choice of tools. That's just the way I am.

Understandable. When Okuma can't make the $1.2 million machine they sold us work, I have to figure out how to shoe horn something too big, in multiple setups, sometimes in multiple pieces, into other machines not intended for the work, because like life, the customer doesn't care if you've got the right tool, they just want their job done.

So while I love it when I've got the special proprietary spanner wrench to make the thing turn that needs to turn, if I don't, I'll make it or substitute something else. It's nice when the other thing can handle it.

But it's not black and white, you and I both realize that. A nail gouge might be the right tool and a wonder bar will work. Sometimes a Leatherman is perfectly adequate and sometimes you don't have a trailer of tools but you can't pack up and go home cause something needs to get done.

My original comment wasn't about batoning curly ironwood with a .06 razor. It was more towards people buying a custom .250 thick knife meant for that task and then deciding "it's too nice to do that with." Usually folks with scratchless truck beds and gunsafes full of guns they "can't shoot."

I'll just part with my favorite Heinlein quote: "specialization is for insects."

 

[woodwrkr221]

My original comment wasn't about batoning curly ironwood with a .06 razor. It was more towards people buying a custom .250 thick knife meant for that task and then deciding "it's too nice to do that with." Usually folks with scratchless truck beds and gunsafes full of guns they "can't shoot."

Yeah, those people get under my skin too.

One of my few customers won't use the Wharncliffe I made for him. He only shows it off to his friends. Oh well....

Another customer got rough with his and broke two chips out of the edge. He thought it was dead but I set the entire edge back perhaps 3/16". His getting rough with a thin hard slicer took 20 years of useful life off his knife.

My brother tells me his knife is the only thing he's found that'll work multi-conductor shielded cable better than a utility knife. That's a specialized job that requires a particular sort of tool to ket the job done really well. That's the sort of stuff they do all day every day.

BTW, a knife that can be batonned sounds more like a froe to me.