Zero Tolerance and their heat treat on steel....Newb here!!!

I bought a ZT 0801 a few weeks back in Elmax. I use the knife everyday and find it to be a very tough, sharp, reliable knife. They are discontinued now, but Kershaw guy has them still for a very good price. All around great flipper for the money, a knife that looks good, comfortable in the pocket, and tough as hell.
 
I have a ZT 0566 in elmax, I strop it every once in a while and have never had problems keeping it sharp. It gets used mostly for packages, boxes, webbing, food ect as well as (poor attempts at) whittling. I don't shy away from using it for any cutting task.
 
sorry if this is resurecting an old thread . but i have a zt 801 blk serial 0034. it seems that once i strop it and can shave hair, i can slice 1 or 2 pieces of paper or 1 cut in car board and i cant shave, cant slice or anything. was there ever a heat treat issue with elmax or was it just people who did not know how to sharpen ?
i dont want to send it in for a new blade if i dont have to .
 
I have a 0562 in elmax. Blade has held up well. Knife itself is in the realm of perfection for a ball bearing flipper.
 
I own several ZTs and they span through a many different years ...from Elmax to the S35VN they have switched to more recently ... I personally have never had and heat treat issues with any of my ZTs ...

I know some people cried out that ZT had bad heat treats ... first it was on their Elmax and then it was when they made the switch to S35VN ...

I can't say positivily that every knife was perfect or there never was a bad batch of blades ... but in all my years of buying sharpening and using ZTs ... I would say they have one of the better heat treats in the business IMHO ... so I wouldn't be the least worried about ZTs blades.
 
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dauntless15 said:
sorry if this is resurecting an old thread . but i have a zt 801 blk serial 0034. it seems that once i strop it and can shave hair, i can slice 1 or 2 pieces of paper or 1 cut in car board and i cant shave, cant slice or anything. was there ever a heat treat issue with elmax or was it just people who did not know how to sharpen ?
i dont want to send it in for a new blade if i dont have to .
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They probably burned the edges when they sharpened them. I'd send it back. But you could also try sharpening it yourself a few times,once you get passed the burnt section. It's also possible it was a low hrc heat treatment. Not every blade will be perfect.
 
Misanthropia said:
Don't forget he also accused CRK of something similar involving heat treatment that was pretty much unsubstantiated. It's an unfortunate byproduct of the size of the knife community that a certain few tastemakers can make waves that ripple through the community for years after, even when they've been discredited.
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Yes unsubstantiated, except S35VN grotesquely failed, on camera, while he was slicing some thin rope on a board... And then S35VN grossly failed again, after a few similar cuts, and again on camera, but this time with a Spyderco, not a CRK...

That he later personally couldn't cut it as a knife maker is highly relevant to the video camera not recording what it recorded... His future dishonesty must have retroactively seeped into the camera circuitry. I am just following your reasoning here.

Then all these crummy CPM steels miraculously changed their inherently non-knife nature, thanks the heat treat being "revised". Evidence of what was wrong with the initial heat treat, and what was changed with it, is very thick on the ground, and is apparent everywhere you look. Except no one really knows what it is. Manufacturers said so. That means it is so.

This is all highly substantiated. Trust me.

Gaston
 
"Yes unsubstantiated, except S35VN grotesquely failed, on camera, while he was slicing some thin rope on a board... And then S35VN grossly failed again, after a few similar cuts, and again on camera, but this time with a Spyderco, not a CRK...

That he later personally couldn't cut it as a knife maker is highly relevant to the video camera not recording what it recorded... His future dishonesty must have retroactively seeped into the camera circuitry. I am just following your reasoning here.

Then all these crummy CPM steels miraculously changed their inherently non-knife nature, thanks the heat treat being "revised". Evidence of what was wrong with the initial heat treat, and what was changed with it, is very thick on the ground, and is apparent everywhere you look. Except no one really knows what it is. Manufacturers said so. That means it is so.

This is all highly substantiated. Trust me."

I've gotten to know enough about you in the last few years here that trusting you is the last thing I would do. Speaking for myself anyways. I feel that in most cases sharpening issues are the reasons behind a lot of these so called failures. Yours especially Gaston.

Just because someone can film themselves and put it on you tube does not mean they don't have a burr or other problem on that edge. It's much more common than many people believe and can be hidden by the strength and quality of todays high hardness powder steels.

Joe
 
I still carry my 0804cf, but it seems I gotta sharpen it as often as a 420hc! Well, maybe not, maybe I’m being hard on it!
 
The Mastiff said:
"

Just because someone can film themselves and put it on you tube does not mean they don't have a burr or other problem on that edge. It's much more common than many people believe and can be hidden by the strength and quality of todays high hardness powder steels.

Joe
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Yes, and that burr would explain why the entire S35VN bevel base moved sideways right up into the primary. (It was getting warm from the cutting, but that's still pretty awful.)

JDavis882, with his many well-received, heavily watched, and apparently quite helpful videos on sharpening, has probably forgotten more about sharpening than you will ever know. It sounds very likely he couldn't figure out a burr. Huh-hm.

Cliff Stamp was shocked by JDavis882's video, but neither of them went to the logical conclusion that the CPM process as a whole is fundamentally in question. JDavis882 even went so far as to say his Sebenza was fine for the average use of his viewers (showing perhaps a bit of the duplicity that should have discouraged sending money to a guy with 0 knives produced)...They both just went at narrower issues like the steels or the heat treat. The fuzzy reality of knife use, and the emperor's clothes syndrome going a bit further than expected, it just went beyond what these two were prepared to handle.

Gaston
 
One of my favorite work folders is an Elmax 0562. It's one of two folders that have made me like Elmax a lot. The balance of edge retention, edge maintenance, sharpening, corrosion resistance, toughness is right in the goldilocks zone for me. No chipping or wobbly edge has occurred in the 2 years I've had it.

OP, my very limited experience with ZT's (I have 4) shows me that ZT makes very good folders with great steels, heat treatment and all, if the designs are right for you.
 
I have a pair of 0801 with Elmax and they are some of my favourite knives when it comes to steel

Overall I like the steels from ZT
I have 0350s with s30v and m390, 0801s with Elmax, 0550 and 0630 with s35v and 0562 with 204p

I would say I prefer m390, Elmax, s30v, s35v and then 204p
 
dauntless15 said:
sorry if this is resurecting an old thread . but i have a zt 801 blk serial 0034. it seems that once i strop it and can shave hair, i can slice 1 or 2 pieces of paper or 1 cut in car board and i cant shave, cant slice or anything. was there ever a heat treat issue with elmax or was it just people who did not know how to sharpen ?
i dont want to send it in for a new blade if i dont have to .
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The good news is it is not likely the steel is the issue. I have a low serial number first version 801 in Elmax with zero problems.

The issue you are running into sounds like a wire edge. Do a few strokes on the stone on each side at a higher than usual angle to make sure you got rid of the burr. (For example if you sharpen at 15 deg per side do a few very light pressure 20 deg per side strokes)

There are lots of great threads here about wire edges and dealing with them.
 
Gaston444 said:
Yes, and that burr would explain why the entire S35VN bevel base moved sideways right up into the primary. (It was getting warm from the cutting, but that's still pretty awful.)

JDavis882, with his many well-received, heavily watched, and apparently quite helpful videos on sharpening, has probably forgotten more about sharpening than you will ever know. It sounds very likely he couldn't figure out a burr. Huh-hm.

Cliff Stamp was shocked by JDavis882's video, but neither of them went to the logical conclusion that the CPM process as a whole is fundamentally in question. JDavis882 even went so far as to say his Sebenza was fine for the average use of his viewers (showing perhaps a bit of the duplicity that should have discouraged sending money to a guy with 0 knives produced)...They both just went at narrower issues like the steels or the heat treat. The fuzzy reality of knife use, and the emperor's clothes syndrome going a bit further than expected, it just went beyond what these two were prepared to handle.

Gaston
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Weren't you supposed to turn up with some "proof" of your assertions?
 
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He's gone off to unclog his apex. He'll be back sooner or later...

OP, my other well used Elmax folder is a Para2, it was my favorite Para2 (I have a bunch) because of the steel, until I got one in M4.
A Para2 and an 0562 are really different particularly in blade thickness, but the Elmax works so well in both, takes a great edge, hold it well, forgiving to use - meaning good toughness. I have about 16 DPS on the Para2 and 18 on the 0562, using a WE, maintain them easily on the SM.
For an all round stainless for a folder blade, I've found Elmax very hard to beat.
Just my 2 groats.
 
I had a early 801 in elmax and it would get and stay sharp as a razor. I wish I had keep it!
 
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Gaston444 said:
Yes, and that burr would explain why the entire S35VN bevel base moved sideways right up into the primary. (It was getting warm from the cutting, but that's still pretty awful.)

JDavis882, with his many well-received, heavily watched, and apparently quite helpful videos on sharpening, has probably forgotten more about sharpening than you will ever know. It sounds very likely he couldn't figure out a burr. Huh-hm.

Cliff Stamp was shocked by JDavis882's video, but neither of them went to the logical conclusion that the CPM process as a whole is fundamentally in question. JDavis882 even went so far as to say his Sebenza was fine for the average use of his viewers (showing perhaps a bit of the duplicity that should have discouraged sending money to a guy with 0 knives produced)...They both just went at narrower issues like the steels or the heat treat. The fuzzy reality of knife use, and the emperor's clothes syndrome going a bit further than expected, it just went beyond what these two were prepared to handle.

Gaston
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Saying stuff like this is dangerous, especially around the holidays! Do you really want people jumping off bridges with a sack full of Millie’s tied around their necks? The whole cpm process?
 
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