bodog
BANNED
- Joined
- Dec 15, 2013
- Messages
- 3,097
Please keep your flaming away. Any constructive conversation appreciated.
Timeline.
ZT started with rugged, beefy, no nonsense blades meant to be carried by first responders, law enforcement, military, etc. I knew several guys who carried 0200s and 0350s before ZT was really known for being anything but an offshoot of Kershaw. Those knives made me curious though they weren't for me, personally.
ZT came out with the 0550, 0560, 0801, and 0566. IMO these were the highlights of what ZT has done as far as working man knives for knowledgeable people. They were relatively affordable and they were doing things no one else was doing on a production scale at the time. The steel was on point, the designs were on point, and more importantly, they were made to be used hard. They came out with the 0560CBCF for collectors and I think it was well done. Kept the spirit of working knives while doing something new and exciting. I've had two 0560CBCFs and have a 0561. Also a 0566. All great in their own respects. Actually, really impressive in all respects. I had some real issues with them being called "zero tolerance" with any kind of faults leaving their factory but their warranty guys were pretty good about fixing their screw ups. I carried the 0561 today and it's still a really damned good knife. I enjoy it.
Then came the 0600, 0777, the 0454, 0450, etc. Great, solid knives. But starting towards "pocket candy" status. Beautiful but it took jumping over some some internal hurdles to EDC these as a first responder/ law enforcement, and especially military. Owned a 0600 and was blown away with the quality. Didn't like the steel all THAT much but it was good. It was now I was questioning whether they were actually for any kind of first responder or LEO or especially military. This is where they deviated from what they were founded upon. They were still beefy and COULD be considered good for first responders and LEOs, but really, no one cut from that cloth would carry them.
Then came the 0180 and their hatchet. I was skeptical but bought an 0180 and beat the shit out of it and recorded my first tests of it here on BF. It was surprisingly great at taking a real ass whipping. I currently carry it on my duty rig. When things are going to get at least a little rough and I know it going in, I carry my 0180. I believe in it that much. I needed to rehandle it and the sheath sucks, but it's molle compatible and I did need a sheath that's molle compatible so whatever. It works.
And then came some crazy ideas and some stupid ideas and some production knives that I couldn't figure out how they are anything like the earlier iterations that men better than me trusted their knife needs to. Now we're up to carbon fiber inserts in the blade and ugly angry bird knives that don't do anything but show off capabilities that no real world guy gives a crap about. They're definitely not anything that a first responder could ever conceivably carry on duty. Definitely not anyone in the military would think about taking into the field. IMO they're an embarrassment to what they founded their business model on. BUT they're great for people who like to fondle knives, make youtube videos of unboxing and initial impressions, and rave about the having something no one else has.
But where are the knives meant for first responders, LEOs, and military guys? The only stuff in their catalog that still serves that purpose were the same knives and designs that they started with. And nothing really changed with these. Even the MUDD, which, IMO, was damned near the best thing they could've give us, was marked off the list as soon as they saw collectors didn't want it.
The point of this is:
Their internal designers don't have a clue anymore about what to produce for the front liners. They have money to produce some really great things but they're not putting that into knives actually meant for anyone they originally catered to.
Why don't they reintroduce the MUDD with some better ergos? Why don't they scale down the 0600 for a more friendly carry? Why don't they create designs that are meant for something more than ogling? Why don't they tinker with the 0200 and 0350 to make them more desirable? Why did they move away from working knives for front liners? They obviously did well enough in that market to found a company on. People liked them. And now what? Production knives meant to rival custom art knives? Really, who in the scheme of things cares about that? No one, in all honesty. They'll get some attention, for sure, but the current knives are a far cry from rugged knives meant to use on the front lines they built a brand on.
And before someone claims these are limited edition knives, yada yada, please, someone talk about what ZT line IS NOT a limited edition collectable that hasn't been on the line for more than several years.
The point of the thread is exactly that. Is ZT anything more than pocket jewelry at this point? When I say that I mean in any kind of real way. Are they still serving the front line guys? Or are they moving to simple display pieces meant to show that China doesn't rule the roost? What are they doing now except showing that something that can be done IS being done without regard to any real life consideration? What kind of average grunt in Afghanistan would EVER think about buying a 0999 or a piece that looks like an angry bird turd missile?
What is ZT doing? Are they looking for simple profits from the knife market or are they serving people in a way those people haven't been served before? I know what they were founded on. Now it seems like once they became recognized they left the front liners to Gerber or whoever, yet again, while serving some guys who rarely make it away from their desk except to fondle their knives like some troll from lord of the rings movie talking about their "precious."
Make ZT great again.
Timeline.
ZT started with rugged, beefy, no nonsense blades meant to be carried by first responders, law enforcement, military, etc. I knew several guys who carried 0200s and 0350s before ZT was really known for being anything but an offshoot of Kershaw. Those knives made me curious though they weren't for me, personally.
ZT came out with the 0550, 0560, 0801, and 0566. IMO these were the highlights of what ZT has done as far as working man knives for knowledgeable people. They were relatively affordable and they were doing things no one else was doing on a production scale at the time. The steel was on point, the designs were on point, and more importantly, they were made to be used hard. They came out with the 0560CBCF for collectors and I think it was well done. Kept the spirit of working knives while doing something new and exciting. I've had two 0560CBCFs and have a 0561. Also a 0566. All great in their own respects. Actually, really impressive in all respects. I had some real issues with them being called "zero tolerance" with any kind of faults leaving their factory but their warranty guys were pretty good about fixing their screw ups. I carried the 0561 today and it's still a really damned good knife. I enjoy it.
Then came the 0600, 0777, the 0454, 0450, etc. Great, solid knives. But starting towards "pocket candy" status. Beautiful but it took jumping over some some internal hurdles to EDC these as a first responder/ law enforcement, and especially military. Owned a 0600 and was blown away with the quality. Didn't like the steel all THAT much but it was good. It was now I was questioning whether they were actually for any kind of first responder or LEO or especially military. This is where they deviated from what they were founded upon. They were still beefy and COULD be considered good for first responders and LEOs, but really, no one cut from that cloth would carry them.
Then came the 0180 and their hatchet. I was skeptical but bought an 0180 and beat the shit out of it and recorded my first tests of it here on BF. It was surprisingly great at taking a real ass whipping. I currently carry it on my duty rig. When things are going to get at least a little rough and I know it going in, I carry my 0180. I believe in it that much. I needed to rehandle it and the sheath sucks, but it's molle compatible and I did need a sheath that's molle compatible so whatever. It works.
And then came some crazy ideas and some stupid ideas and some production knives that I couldn't figure out how they are anything like the earlier iterations that men better than me trusted their knife needs to. Now we're up to carbon fiber inserts in the blade and ugly angry bird knives that don't do anything but show off capabilities that no real world guy gives a crap about. They're definitely not anything that a first responder could ever conceivably carry on duty. Definitely not anyone in the military would think about taking into the field. IMO they're an embarrassment to what they founded their business model on. BUT they're great for people who like to fondle knives, make youtube videos of unboxing and initial impressions, and rave about the having something no one else has.
But where are the knives meant for first responders, LEOs, and military guys? The only stuff in their catalog that still serves that purpose were the same knives and designs that they started with. And nothing really changed with these. Even the MUDD, which, IMO, was damned near the best thing they could've give us, was marked off the list as soon as they saw collectors didn't want it.
The point of this is:
Their internal designers don't have a clue anymore about what to produce for the front liners. They have money to produce some really great things but they're not putting that into knives actually meant for anyone they originally catered to.
Why don't they reintroduce the MUDD with some better ergos? Why don't they scale down the 0600 for a more friendly carry? Why don't they create designs that are meant for something more than ogling? Why don't they tinker with the 0200 and 0350 to make them more desirable? Why did they move away from working knives for front liners? They obviously did well enough in that market to found a company on. People liked them. And now what? Production knives meant to rival custom art knives? Really, who in the scheme of things cares about that? No one, in all honesty. They'll get some attention, for sure, but the current knives are a far cry from rugged knives meant to use on the front lines they built a brand on.
And before someone claims these are limited edition knives, yada yada, please, someone talk about what ZT line IS NOT a limited edition collectable that hasn't been on the line for more than several years.
The point of the thread is exactly that. Is ZT anything more than pocket jewelry at this point? When I say that I mean in any kind of real way. Are they still serving the front line guys? Or are they moving to simple display pieces meant to show that China doesn't rule the roost? What are they doing now except showing that something that can be done IS being done without regard to any real life consideration? What kind of average grunt in Afghanistan would EVER think about buying a 0999 or a piece that looks like an angry bird turd missile?
What is ZT doing? Are they looking for simple profits from the knife market or are they serving people in a way those people haven't been served before? I know what they were founded on. Now it seems like once they became recognized they left the front liners to Gerber or whoever, yet again, while serving some guys who rarely make it away from their desk except to fondle their knives like some troll from lord of the rings movie talking about their "precious."
Make ZT great again.
