0550 Here we go!

[CrimsonTideShooter]

You guys are arguing about how a CRK knife performs in a thread about a ZT? Really?

Well yeah, since it shares blade steels. I didn't know that was out of order?

I guess I should just start a separate thread for that? Please. Don't get all bent out of shape over it.

 

[Morrow]

Well yeah, since it shares blade steels. I didn't know that was out of order?

I guess I should just start a separate thread for that? Please. Don't get all bent out of shape over it.

I'm not bent of shape. When the ZT 0550 shows up in your mail box a ZT 0550 vs. CRK Sebenza thread would be interesting. Back and forth opinions on how CRK's S35VN knives perform probably don't belong in thread. I know I don't really care (not that means much) because I come to this thread to see the what's up with the ZT 0550. I'm pretty sure there is CRK forum here.

 

[CrimsonTideShooter]

I'm not bent of shape. When the ZT 0550 shows up in your mail box a ZT 0550 vs. CRK Sebenza thread would be interesting. Back and forth opinions on how CRK's S35VN knives perform probably don't belong in thread. I know I don't really care (not that means much) because I come to this thread to see the what's up with the ZT 0550. I'm pretty sure there is CRK forum here.

Sounds completely reasonable. Will do man.

ETA: I will probably start that comparison thread here. I am not liked over in the CRK forum, haha!

 

[Morrow]

Sounds completely reasonable. Will do man.

ETA: I will probably start that comparison thread here. I am not liked over in the CRK forum, haha!

I can't imagine why.

 

[Esav Benyamin]

As long as Thomas is willing to let this continue, I will not interfere. Were it up to me, I would have removed the non-Kershaw/ZT posts, and made a new thread in General Knife for them.

 

[Gnarly]

Onward and upward.

My ZT/H 0550 should arrive tomorrow!

~Gnarly :devilish:

 

[CrimsonTideShooter]

As long as Thomas is willing to let this continue, I will not interfere. Were it up to me, I would have removed the non-Kershaw/ZT posts, and made a new thread in General Knife for them.

I apologize Esav, and Thomas. I sincerely didn't know that it should have been a separate thread.

 

[ohmyheckinslc]

Two random samples were tested today. One came in at 59, the other at 60 Rc.

Thanks Thomas! I appreciate the info. Mine arrived today, (THANKS DAVE!) and I must say, somehow the blade survived the shipping process without crumbling in transit... so... Make of that what you will.
Toothy, but very nearly hair-popping sharp, ridiculously light, seriously, VERY VERY light. Surprisingly so. Anyway, haven't really done anything with it besides clip it to my pocket and (almost) forget it was there...because of how light it is. I wonder if they figured out how to infuse titanium with Helium or something.

 

[Thomas W]

Why do people think I am stating anything other than that?

...because you haven't been qualifying your statements. Been a bit defensive as well.

I fully expect that my particular piece is not correct in some way. It seems to me like the HT is off. Same goes with my S35VN Native 5. That's why I've been saying that the steel doesn't perform well at it's current state.

Now you're starting to qualify. Go back and read your posts, you have been generalizing.

But, I still hold firm that no matter what the hardness, it won't perform on par with S30V.

Based on what?

 

[CrimsonTideShooter]

...because you haven't been qualifying your statements. Been a bit defensive as well.

Now you're starting to qualify. Go back and read your posts, you have been generalizing.

Based on what?

I am sorry for the vague generalizations. Sometimes I am not able to articulate the thoughts in my head. The post below by Jim pretty much sums up why I believe it will never perform on par with S30V:


Here's a link to the post, and the actual post:


http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/904581-3V-vs-S35VN-characteristics?p=10255172#post10255172

Quote Originally Posted by hardheart View Post
niobium is a very strong carbide former.

If the heat treat is off, then you can't yet call the steel 'garbage'. If the heat treat needs to be sorted, then blaming the alloy composition seems rather premature. Any steel is garbage at the wrong hardness. Spyderco seemed to do a good job on the Mules already, and they don't use it on anything else. Maybe wait until they or someone else decides to run it harder and plays with the heat treat protocol for several runs.




****This starts Jim's post****

But at .50% it won't make much of a difference when they dropped a full point of Vanadium and dropped the Carbon content also down to 1.40% and kept the Chromium the same and are trying to say there won't be a difference in edge retention.

Or someone was saying it has better edge retention.....

Some people are smoking crack or something.

It seems to me like simple chemistry outlines the reasons it won't perform as well as S30, but of course I could always be wrong. As a matter of fact, I would be very happy if I was wrong as I have a lot of money tied up in the steel.


I want to say that I am not one of those people that makes statements and then sticks to them no matter what. Knowledge is what's most important to me, not defending some arbitrary point I'm trying to make. I am not a metallurgist, knife maker, or anything like that - I just crave knowledge and I like to share that knowledge with other people. If I end up being wrong on this then great! If not, then I will sincerely be sad since some of my favorite makers are switching to S35VN exclusively. I guess only time will tell though.

 

[P1GEONPOO]

CTS Could you please send your dodgy knife to Thomas for testing like he asked??
Sorry if this is already happening, just you never mentioned it after he asked.

 

[Buffalohump]

I'm glad to hear its light as the 0551 seemed quite heavy to me. Has the steel liner been replaced by a titanium one? Or removed altogether?

Thanks Thomas! I appreciate the info. Mine arrived today, (THANKS DAVE!) and I must say, somehow the blade survived the shipping process without crumbling in transit... so... Make of that what you will.
Hair popping sharp, ridiculously light, seriously, VERY VERY light. Surprisingly so. Anyway, haven't really done anything with it besides clip it to my pocket and (almost) forget it was there...because of how light it is. I wonder if they figured out how to infuse titanium with Helium or something.

 

[P1GEONPOO]

Right, I am confused

Ankerson, who you say you hold in high regard has s35vn at 59 in the same group as s30v at 60.
This is two full groups ahead of s30v at 58.5.
So at only 0.5 harder, he has s35vn a lot better than s30v in his edge retention test which is totally different to what your claiming.
I don't know what to belive anymore as all this was putting me off getting the 550 as I couldn't get a 551 over here in the UK.

 

[CrimsonTideShooter]

Don't let it put you off from buying the kershaw, seriously.


PM Jim and ask him what he thinks of the steel, that would be better than me speaking for him here. The mule he tested was the exception, not the rule.

Right, I am confused

Ankerson, who you say you hold in high regard has s35vn at 59 in the same group as s30v at 60.
This is two full groups ahead of s30v at 58.5.
So at only 0.5 harder, he has s35vn a lot better than s30v in his edge retention test which is totally different to what your claiming.
I don't know what to belive anymore as all this was putting me off getting the 550 as I couldn't get a 551 over here in the UK.

 

[Thomas W]

...and Jim seems to to softening his stance on S35VN now that there is some rational back and forth.

I'll reiterate in that you can't take one sample, one test, and draw a final conclusion about a given steel.

It sucks if a given knife/steel (CRK S35VN in this case) didn't perform up to standards at the expense of your investment, but there are solutions to be made with the manufacturer in cases like that. The majority of the brands that utilize premium steel stand behind their products and want to make it right with their valued customers should there be an issue. To not give them a chance, and bash them (and the steel) prior to doing so is unfortunate in my eyes.

To then further with knee-jerk reactions, generalizing, and not being able to understand the situation past your own emotions based on your purchase or some bias one may be carrying around is unfair. Unfair to the steel, manufacturer, past and potential buyers, members here.

Of course it makes for a great dust-up in a given thread or two, and occasionally that makes for sensationalized drama and hard feelings.

I say who needs it.

 

[Thomas W]

PM Jim and ask him what he thinks of the steel, that would be better than me speaking for him here.

Jim is one guy, he has an opinion, his opinion should be taken at the value given with the situation. He's had mixed results with S35VN based on limited samples/tests. There are no final conclusions here. Stop letting Jim do your thinking for you.

I'd suggest you contact the manufacturer of the knife in question and politely ask them if you could send them the knife back so they could evaluate it. Give them the opportunity to at the very least see the damage done by the test. You may find all this noise you're making...avoidable.

The mule he tested was the exception, not the rule.

You're generalizing again.

 

[CrimsonTideShooter]

Jim isn't doing my thinking for me Thomas. The poster that I quoted was talking about Jim's test. Instead of speaking for him (which I can't do) I suggested that he PM Jim. You're making it out like I would have mentioned Jim even if he hadn't. To read his post.

He brought up ankerson, so instead of speculating I told him to contact him.

Jim is one guy, he has an opinion, his opinion should be taken at the value given with the situation. He's had mixed results with S35VN based on limited samples/tests. There are no final conclusions here. Stop letting Jim do your thinking for you.

I'd suggest you contact the manufacturer of the knife in question and politely ask them if you could send them the knife back so they could evaluate it. Give them the opportunity to at the very least see the damage done by the test. You may find all this noise you're making...avoidable.

You're generalizing again.

 

[CrimsonTideShooter]

Where do you get that I have emotions tied up into this? This isn't about a single CRK knife

Two different knives, from two different manufacturers performed the exact same way. This has nothing to do with my investments. Like I keep repeating, I would be elated if I end up being wrong. But, from what I've seen so far (given my experiences up to this point) I don't think I am.

Sure, I can't make a conclusion based off that small of a sample size, but that's the thing - I'm not making any scientific conclusions. I am speaking from my own experience and getting dog piled because of it.

Honestly, I don't care enough to keep talking about it. If the steel really doesn't hold up as well as S30V, then we will surely hear about it. If it does, then again we will surely hear about it. Either way is A ok with me.




And about the "sensationalized drama," please go watch my two cut test videos of S35VN and tell me that I am dramatizing this. The results speak for themselves, I don't have to hype it one bit. Both knives failed catastrophically, while 19 other knives in all different steels held up just fine. Seems pretty cut and dry to me.

...and Jim seems to to softening his stance on S35VN now that there is some rational back and forth.

I'll reiterate in that you can't take one sample, one test, and draw a final conclusion about a given steel.

It sucks if a given knife/steel (CRK S35VN in this case) didn't perform up to standards at the expense of your investment, but there are solutions to be made with the manufacturer in cases like that. The majority of the brands that utilize premium steel stand behind their products and want to make it right with their valued customers should there be an issue. To not give them a chance, and bash them (and the steel) prior to doing so is unfortunate in my eyes.

To then further with knee-jerk reactions, generalizing, and not being able to understand the situation past your own emotions based on your purchase or some bias one may be carrying around is unfair. Unfair to the steel, manufacturer, past and potential buyers, members here.

Of course it makes for a great dust-up in a given thread or two, and occasionally that makes for sensationalized drama and hard feelings.

I say who needs it.

 

[CrimsonTideShooter]

Again Thomas, I am not talking about one single knife in this steel.

Two different knives.

Two different manufacturers

Two different dates of assembly.


EXACT same results.

 

[ohmyheckinslc]

I didn't snag a 0551 but I was really surprised by how light this one is. Looking at it, I would've guessed it would feel much heavier.

I'm glad to hear its light as the 0551 seemed quite heavy to me. Has the steel liner been replaced by a titanium one? Or removed altogether?