1075

To be honest, I have ordered from Admiral a number of times and never heard of a $200 limit, or much of any limit, really. It's not mentioned on their webstore. Makes sense that there may be one, though. PimpinSquee just ordered about $90 worth earlier this week.
 
A couple weeks ago I asdked here about using 1095 for my first knives because I thought it was the easiest way to start. Almost to a man, the makers here steered me towards 1075/1080 instead, mostly because it's easier to heat-treat correctly. They all said it was a good steel to make an excellent knife out of.
 
I was not aware of the $200 minimum, either. I seldom order less than that, but have made small orders from Admiral before. I order mostly from Crucible lately.

1075/1080 is, IMHO, the best steel to start with. Some never leave it. It is the eutectic and thus the easiest to work and HT. It will get one Rc point less than 1095 on quench and will temper to Rc59 with a 400F temper. Nothing to not like about that!
Stacy

BTW, Albo Bruno sells 1080/1075 in the "For Sale" forum. Good prices from one piece to a truck load.
 
The 30' order I just received was just under $70 shipped. There is no minimum at Admiral.
 
Ok if they are indeed 12 feet for $12 I's like to have one
Are you going to get them? I do not care if you make alittle
profit for you trouble.
 
The 1075 is my standard steel for the WSK I make. I buy it 1/4 inch by 2 1/2 inch by 10 foot from Admiral Steel. When dealing with Admiral ask only for Terry Summers. He is often away from his desk but returns calls rather quickly. The 1075 is a bit touchy about quenchant temperature and time in quench and I HIGHLY suggest many hours in heat treating samples of the maximum thickness you will be using. It has taken me some long time to hit it the way I wish. To borrow a previous statement on this thread: "it cuts like a bugger". The 1075 will not come to you perfectly flat, at least not from Admiral. It will be flat to the eye but bowed but not badly. It will require some straightening by you. It will not machine as easily as O1. The 1075, like all 1000 series, is a shallow hardening steel - so hardness testing is not as easy either. I hardness test my 1075 at the very edge of a flat drop off (such as close to the finger guard). Testing 1075 anywhere else will give you a soft reading. As far as I know 1084 is no longer manufactured and 1095 is beyond our ability to get to quench quick enough. I should speak only for myself; I can get to quench in about 1 second. That is way late for 1095. Vendors may refer to 1075 as being 1075/1080. It is not 1080. The 1075 will contain about 0.72 percent carbon. That makes it 1075 at best.

rlinger
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rlinger said:
The 1075 will contain about 0.72 percent carbon. That makes it 1075 at best.

rlinger
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Click to expand...

I had some "1075" CR I got from Admiral tested--first by them, and then by an independent lab. It came in at .68. I was told that was "still within spec." I was not impressed.
I also had some of their 1095 CR tested and it came in at .88.

This sort of variation might not mean much to some guys, but when you're pattern welding stuff that takes many steps (spends a long, long time in the fire), there's a lot of opportunity to be loosing carbon along the way, so I go with 1086 and maybe after I'm done I'll have 1075.
 
the local steel yard is not open when I get off work, but I do have every other Friday off and I have the one coming up off. so I will be getting some. I need to pick up some angle to make a stand for my hydraulic press to. I will let everyone know how much I get and what thickness it is. I am not to interested if it is 1/16 because of carbon lose when making damascus and I have a bunch of bandsaw material that thick. If it is 1/8th I will grab a bit. O second thought I may get a little of the 1/16 as I could stack it with the 15n20 forge weld and twist and use it as a course twist as long as I don't do to many heats.
 
The 1075 will not come to you perfectly flat, at least not from Admiral. It will be flat to the eye but bowed but not badly. It will require some straightening by you.

rlinger
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I just purchased some 1/8"x1, 1.25, and 1.5 and it is all bowed to a degree. When I put it on the platen verticle to just clean the handle up. You could see the bow in the middle of the stock.
 
rlinger, as for your statment about 1095. Steel has to be cooled in a spiciffic length of time, not get to the quench tank in that time frame. As long as the blade is at or above critical temp, you can go to the quench in slow motion, but when it hits the oil, water ect, it has to cool down to under 900F in less than one second.
 
sunfishman said:
rlinger, as for your statment about 1095. Steel has to be cooled in a spiciffic length of time, not get to the quench tank in that time frame. As long as the blade is at or above critical temp, you can go to the quench in slow motion, but when it hits the oil, water ect, it has to cool down to under 900F in less than one second.
Click to expand...

To go a bit further, I'd say all of the 10XX steels need to get past the pearlite nose in less than one second after hitting the quench in order to harden consistently. 1095 probably not only needs to do it in less than a second but I'd hazard a guess it's probably more like less than .75 seconds!
 
fitzo said:
To be honest, I have ordered from Admiral a number of times and never heard of a $200 limit, or much of any limit, really. It's not mentioned on their webstore. Makes sense that there may be one, though. PimpinSquee just ordered about $90 worth earlier this week.
Click to expand...

You must be right, Either I saw it in an old flyer they sent me years ago or I am mistaking them for Alro steel. I've never ordered from Admiral because I live in Detroit and there are much many steel suppliers here. I might give them a try for some 154cm, the price is pretty good.
 
JCaswell,

Thanks for that info about yours testing 0.68%. I must admit I only have gone by the analysis Admiral provided me and, as told to me by Admiral, that analysis is only a representative sample of the entire lot. Your posting is well taken and not at all in doubt by me.

jll346,

Yes, I am not at all surprised by that. At first, and I should have been more descriptive, I was getting really warped 1075 until I asked Terry Summers to get me as flat as possible - since I am a knife maker. Terry understands knife maker requirements and does very well I think in serving us. Being a hot roll it will only be so flat no matter. I never expect to get a long bar that is not flat ground that is not warped some. Deal with Terry only. He understands and I always try to remember that to them I am not a big outfit building ships and buildings but only a small order guy. Their people are more used to the big orders and Terry is great to deal with for us knife makers. Admiral is a good company for us.

Sunfish,

I believe no steel used for knife blades should be allowed to go to quench "in slow motion". That part in quotes are your words. I am sure though you did not mean it that way and I understand you were probably talking about a difference of only a second or a bit better. As for the steel at topic we should especially consider that it is a shallow hardening steel. We are dealing with bevels and such where thicknesses can be as thin as 15 to 20 mil. The skin of those areas will cool very quickly after the oven door is open. I believe it most imperative to get to quench immediately. ...but, I will not dispute you on this. I respect your knife making and your post was very thought provoking. Thanks Sunfish.

rlinger
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RE: "simple" high carbon steels... About quench times, including both time from forge to quench tank, and the ability of the quenchant to cool quickly... is it reasonable to presume that BOTH times can be a factor, less time being better in either case? I understand that too fast/cold a quench is bad and can cause cracking and other bad things... sorry for yet another "dumb" question. I've dang sure noticed how lousy an insulator steel is, from my primitive experiments with annealing/HTing a blade in open air with just a propane torch (it cools off a lot faster than it heats up), that's why I ask.
 
My opinion and firm belief is for all steels we use for our blades, from shallow to deep hardening, quick to quench is essential and in order of described, shallow to deep. As far as quench performance; that is a science I believe dependent on steel used. .. something I am still trying to learn. The question of quick to quench is not much of an argument. Do a search on Mete or Kevin Cashen (Cashin?) about anything having to do with heat treating. Those two, especially Mete - my opinion, are tops on this forum for anything having to do with HT'ing. I am treading on straying from the thread intent and hope I am not out of bounds by answering you. I better say something about 1075. Love the stuff. Its fairly tough and holds and edge. Good for chopping and as a knife edge. I like it in a medium large size blade.

rlinger
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1075 is a bit more tolerant than 1095 not because it cools slower, but because it has a lower austenitic (A1) temperature and a slightly softer nose. As far as the time from oven/forge/flame to quench tank......the instant you remove the heat source the steel starts dropping in temperature. If it is at the critical temperature , plus 50 degrees, it will start dropping through critical very fast. Once it crosses the A1 temp, it starts converting into a mix of Austenite, ferrite, and cementite. How slow the drop occurs determines what structure you get. If you miss the nose you get all Austenite . If you catch the nose a bit, you get Austenite and Ferrite. Stay in the nose too long and you end up with Cementite/Ferrite. The nose for 1095 is the shortest at 1050F and is .8 seconds. That translates to - YOU HAVE .8 SECONDS TO GET THE BLADE FROM 1450F TO 1000F. The edge is the thinnest place and will drop the fastest (And it is the edge on which we want the hardening to be right). A smooth safe and fast transition from heat source to quench tank is a must with shallow hardening steels. When quenching anvils and 6" propeller shafts in a factory, yes there is a big window from oven to quench tank. In .010 to .150 blade thicknesses of 1095, fractional seconds can matter.
Stacy

BTW, I have had good results with Aldo's 1084.
 
Thanks as always, bladsmth... that's kind of what I thought, but you made it much clearer.

I'm understanding even more why makers I respect have been advising me to start with the simplest steel possible (within reason).

Cheese an' rice, salt baths... I'm nowhere near being able to undersatnd that stuff yet :o
 
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