20 gauge shotgun with pistol grip.

P

PV29

Joined
Feb 13, 2007
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I've been considering getting a small shotgun for home defense to augment or even take the place of my S&W .38 revolver as the primary home defense weapon. I'd like a smaller caliber than 12 gauge so that the wife can use it and to prevent over penetration, so I've settled on the 20 gauge. Also, I'd like the the shortness of the pistol grip to make it easier to use in tight places inside the home, and again so the wife can use it.

I've seen the Mossberg model with the pistol grip and was wondering if anybody has had this model and what they thought of it. Also, if you folks have had experience with other brands, please tell me about them. I'll be shopping over the next few weeks and I'd like to make an informed decision.

Thanks!
 
By "pistol grip" are you talking about a stocked shotgun with a pistol grip or a "pistol grip only" where there is nothing on the back end of the but a grip?

I have a pistol grip only that I sometimes screw onto my 870 and shoot low brass out of for fun. However, for any real SD application, a stocked shotgun is going to offer tons more control and accuracy.

My mother-in-law has a 500 Mossburg with an adjustable AR stock. This would be ideal for people that might find the pull of a standard stock to be a bit long. Her's is a 12 gauge and she has no problem pointing and controlling it. It might do the trick.

For me, the Remington 870 feels a little better. tomato tomahto :D
 
Thanks.

I was referring to the "pistol grip only" variety, with nothing behind the grip. Should've made that clearer.
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The wife would have a heck of a time coordinating the butt end on the stock and the trigger. I know because I've seen her try to line up my Marlin .22 and it's not gonna happen.
 
you can learn to shoot a PG shotgun ok with some practice, i used to shoot hand thrown skeet with mine occasionally and got pretty good with it at one time, mine is a 12 gauge though, but a 20 would just be easier imho, but it does take some practice. i know the best ammo in 12 is the federal tactical buck because it has less recoil.

of course a full stock is probably better for most applications, and a folder is ok too, i have tried a few shotguns with folders and have found some i like some i dont, the best one i have tried was an old remington 870 with the remington top folding stock, worst was a mossy side folder (just didnt like it, lotsa felt recoil and really too short for me) i have not tried the AR looking collapsible yet but want to try one.
 
PG29: While I understand what your are attempting, I also think you are going at it the wrong way. Over penetration will be just as much of a potential problem with a 20 as a 12, or even on down to a .410. As for recail, a 6 lb 20 guage will kick as much or even more than a 7 lb 12 gauge, with the same performance shells. The only thing you will accomplish by going to a smaller guage is send a smaller shot charge down range.
Now with all of that stated, I have yet to see a pump or double barrel do much to reduce recoil, BUT, most of the gas operated semi autos reduce recoil dramatically. I own a rather old Baretta 20 gauge AL 3 which is no problem to fire one handed, like a pistol. Without the stock to help spread recoil to the main torso, recoil will hurt a smaller stature person. I also own several of the Savage model 24 series, which is a .20 gauge single shot under a rifle barrel, and those are light, chambered for up to 3 inch magnum, but most will only fire a hot load once in it, as it does get your attention.
I do know several companies modify production shotguns and convert them into combat types, both in the pump and the semi auto. There is a tremendous amount of accessories to do much of this yourself, available, but as I have stated, I do not think the method you are going will work. Just one person's opinion, and your MMV.
 
shooter10
I've got a 6 pound 20 gauge and a 7 pound 12 gauge (both Remmy 870s) and the recoil is definitely not the same.

I agree that a 12 with a pistol grip might be a bit hard on the wrist, but muzzle control is the most important factor here. PV29, can your wife hit anything with a shotgun? That is, does she already shoot? If so, great. If not, I'd vote against the pistol grip until she learns how to aim and shoot.
 
Man, I wouldn't dink around with the grip and over thinking it.

Perhaps a simple youth sized 20 gauge Mossberg or Remington pump (reliable, cheap, light, and a great home defense tool) and take her out to the range and have her shoot it until she is comfortably firing effectively and safely.

Much more versatile, imo.

:)
 
Perhaps a simple youth sized 20 gauge Mossberg or Remington pump (reliable, cheap, light, and a great home defense tool) and take her out to the range and have her shoot it until she is comfortably firing effectively and safely.
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I remember an article in Field 7 Stream or some such where someone took a cheap, used youth gun and converted it into a turkey gun for less than $400 (price of gun included.) It seems it would be pretty easy to do this- youth guns come stock with 22in barrels, I think, which should be fine for HD. Add a sight of your choice and maybe, maybe a tactical stock. A sidesaddle would be a fine option as well.
You could also look into a semi-auto if you really want to cut down on recoil.
 
shooter10 said:
PG29: While I understand what your are attempting, I also think you are going at it the wrong way. Over penetration will be just as much of a potential problem with a 20 as a 12, or even on down to a .410. As for recail, a 6 lb 20 guage will kick as much or even more than a 7 lb 12 gauge, with the same performance shells. The only thing you will accomplish by going to a smaller guage is send a smaller shot charge down range.
Now with all of that stated, I have yet to see a pump or double barrel do much to reduce recoil, BUT, most of the gas operated semi autos reduce recoil dramatically. I own a rather old Baretta 20 gauge AL 3 which is no problem to fire one handed, like a pistol. Without the stock to help spread recoil to the main torso, recoil will hurt a smaller stature person. I also own several of the Savage model 24 series, which is a .20 gauge single shot under a rifle barrel, and those are light, chambered for up to 3 inch magnum, but most will only fire a hot load once in it, as it does get your attention.
I do know several companies modify production shotguns and convert them into combat types, both in the pump and the semi auto. There is a tremendous amount of accessories to do much of this yourself, available, but as I have stated, I do not think the method you are going will work. Just one person's opinion, and your MMV.
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I hear what you're saying, thanks. My fear with an auto-loader would be the Missus not holding it properly, doing a limp wrist fire and the damn thing jamming.

I'm leaning towards the Remington 870 Tactical with the fold up stock. It's 12 gauge and I'll use reduced recoil 00 shot or Federal's Personal Defense Shotshell.

Your thoughts?

Thanks.
 
If you do go the pump action type, the Remington 870 is certianly one of the very best, although Savage has in recent years improved to the point many folks prefer it to the 870, although I have not used one so refuse to coment. If you keep low brass shells, do not attempt to get a super light firearm, with practice and training most can learn to handle the recoil. I have seen Fathers purchase a "smaller guage shotgun for their children", to later learn the lighter gun discouraged them shooting it by the recoil.
Limp wristing would have no affect on most of the gas operated semi auto shotguns in the market now, but that is still your call. I'd advise you going to a rental range, shooting what you are considering first, then draw you own educated opinion. Another thing, for Home defense, you do not need 00 Buck or 000 Buck shells, but at the usual distances involved, a load of #5 shot will do in a former bad guy as well as the buckshot. The largest shot I have in either of my home defense shotguns is #4 Buck. Once you settle on a shotgun, take it out somewhere you can experiment some, take a couple of scrap pieces of plywood, some old jeans, etc, and you will be amazed at the damage even bird shot does at 8 yards. Smaller shot equals less penetration, but there will still be enough for your purpose. Keep us informed on what you end up with, and how it works for you and your wife.
 
I'm a part time deputy sheriff. I often carry a Mossberg "Defender' which comes with both stock and pistol grip and in either 12 or 20. Seven rounds of 00 buckshot in the Mossberg are a real comfort factor. Also, as a gunsmith, I believe Mossbergs to be one of the best pump shotguns on the market for reliability and a fairly reasonable price. It's damned rare to get a Mossberg into my shop needing repairs and I can't say that for Remingtons, Winchesters, and some others.
 
Old CW4 said:
I'm a part time deputy sheriff. I often carry a Mossberg "Defender' which comes with both stock and pistol grip and in either 12 or 20. Seven rounds of 00 buckshot in the Mossberg are a real comfort factor. Also, as a gunsmith, I believe Mossbergs to be one of the best pump shotguns on the market for reliability and a fairly reasonable price. It's damned rare to get a Mossberg into my shop needing repairs...
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Nice post and quite the endorsement.

I also find the safety position is more user friendly on the Mossbergs. :)

Take a Saturday afternoon, as noted in a previous post, and have her handle a few.
Remember though, some salesmen may have a bias or agenda. ;)
 
IMO I would not get a shotgun with only a pistol grip. Much harder to shoot accurately and much harder to handle. As for the 20 Gauge, it would make a fine home-defense choice, but not for the reasons you believe. It will penetrate every bit as much as a 12 Gauge but the recoil is significantly less and it would most likely be easier for your wife to handle. I would consider a Remington 870 Youth Model with an 18 inch barrel. It has a shorter stock and with the short barrel would be manuverable in tight spaces such as the home.
 
I would like to thank all of you for your opinions and your help.

What I will try to do (schedule and kids permitting) is take my wife out and let her handle both the Remy 870 Tactical (short barrels, 12 ga.) and the Mossberg 500 or 590 if I can find it. At some point I will post back about what we decided on.

With the craziness we are seeing and what happened in New Orleans (firearm confiscation) I am reluctant now to trust my home defense to only a handgun. In the unlikely event that NY goes even more crazier, and confiscates handguns during a natural disaster, I will not leave my family defenseless.

Thanks again to all. I'll check back often to see if anyone else has something to add.
 
I've had my Mossberg 500 [mariner coated version] since the late 80s. Eventually replaced the pistol grip with the 'speedfeed stock'. That being said, I do believe in home defense the pistol grip has a place maneuvering around corners and narrow hallways.

ps: Never have had a problem with it and after 11 1/2 years on my sailboat in a 100% salt air environment - no corrosion!:thumbup:
 
MSgt said:
I've had my Mossberg 500 [mariner coated version] since the late 80s. Eventually replaced the pistol grip with the 'speedfeed stock'. That being said, I do believe in home defense the pistol grip has a place maneuvering around corners and narrow hallways.

ps: Never have had a problem with it and after 11 1/2 years on my sailboat in a 100% salt air environment - no corrosion!:thumbup:
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The Mariner is a beautiful looking shotgun. :thumbup:

The 590A1 Compact is very similar, and probably more suited to what we're looking for.
 
For a new shooter I'd recommend a double-barrel Coach Gun with exposed hammers instead of a pump. "Only" 2 shots, but practically idiot-proof -- and you can get a 5-round bullet band for the full stock. As long as the barrels are a fraction of an inch over 18" you're good to go. :thumbup:
 
If you like the safety position of the Mossberg, be aware it isn't the most useful if you slap a pistol grip on it.

IMO, the speedfeed stock is the better option for a Mossberg.
 
Well, just to bring this to an end ........

I picked up a Remington 870 Police today. Yeah, I know, the thread says pistol grip 20 gauge :o, but you guys got me athinkin' and I believe I made the right choice here.

No bells or whistles, just a solid steel receiver, rifle sights, speed feed synthetic stock, 4 shot tube. Got some reduced recoil slugs for the range to let the wife try it, and some 00 buck for the home.

Thanks to all for their insights and thoughts. I agonize over these decisions and need to hear from other folks to help with the process.

So .... any ammo suggestions for home defense that will reduce wall penetration and still be effective? :D
 
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