440C - To Buy or Not to Buy? A steel snob's dilemma

Seriousbladeno1 said:
Cobalt, I will not prefer to bring the name the company you mentioned into discussion, for simple reason of preventing any arguments here that may lead to closure of this quite interesting thread.

Rather we shall focus on topic and wait for proffesional explanation in this case - if 440C can or can not be differentially heat treated. As one of the the comments above explain, it is difficult and very precise process, however it seem to be possible to achieve with correct procedure requiring more than HT of usuall carbon steels
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Rather you should focus on the original question, Seriousbladeno1... which is:

"Would you buy your ideal knife if the steel wasn't your ideal steel? Also, how many folks like and use 440C without issues?"

I could care less what can or cannot be done with whatever steel flavor comes up. Riz asked a question... answer it or don't.

If you want a technological discussion on differential heat treating, go start your own thread. Don't muck this one up.

Likewise, if you want to jump in and defend a bunch of troll posts, let me give you some advice.... don't.

Riz, I'd love to see that review between the Strongarm, TOPs and old Buck Special. If you decide to do it, please do a thread on it.
 
KingMC said:
Yes, according to DUK's website, they have a 'double heat treat' with the spine being a different hardness than the edge, on 440C steel. I'm not buying any of it, considering their questionable business tactics, but I'm not buying their knives so it really doesn't make that much difference.

Seriousblade is a big proponent of DUK and their knives if you've seen his past threads started here.
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I would like to see knife makers who have worked lots of 440C chime in here and state if they have tried or heard of others doing DHT. I agree, DUK is a little bit shady, but you never know, they may have something.
 
Cobalt said:
I would like to see knife makers who have worked lots of 440C chime in here and state if they have tried or heard of others doing DHT. I agree, DUK is a little bit shady, but you never know, they may have something.
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They are more than a bit shady. The are banned here.
 
I don't know really anything about steel or heat treating, but I do buy lots and lots of expensive knives. That said, I would not hesitate to buy a 440C blade if I liked the design and it was cheap. Worst case scenario, I spent a few dollars on a (relatively) cheap knife that I can give away.
 
New steels all the time, even improved heat treat protocols. Not so many years ago, 440c was a high end steel. ATS-34 was a custom maker steel. We don't see as much of either of them these days.

DUK was banned, we don't need to be advertising for them. There was too much shady information. Who owned them, who made them, not worth pretending they have any credibility left. But if anyone asks, we really don't need to shut down the question. We don't need to answer it, either.
 
Esav Benyamin said:
The worst trolls don't just spread misinformation. They spread dissension. I might as well close this thread, now that Gaston444 has trashed it.

His knowledge of steel is worthless, but his babbling will sink into new members consciousness, distorting their learning.

We are on the verge of removing another troll.
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Why not ban him right now ?
Might calm him down in the future when he comes back
 
This is way beyond my understanding, but here 'tis

Discusses DHT for 440C and reply by fairly famous maker includes:
Paul Bos differentially tempered two ATS-34 swords for me a few years ago. He vowed never to do it again though. It is my understanding that he fully hardened the steel, then drew the spine hardness by holding the edge in running water and heating the spine as hot as he could get it with a torch. When he was done tempering, I believe it was Rc59/60 at the edge and Rc50+/- at the spine. With the CPM steels that are now available, I'm not sure you gain anything by trying to differentially temper anything else. CPM-3V is tougher at Rc59 than most steels are at virtually any hardness.
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http://www.knifenetwork.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9988
 
Cobalt said:
The troll you know is better than the troll you don't.
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Eh, our mods are top shelf. They could just ban all the trolls, which is what they tend to do for us now. :thumbup:
 
Quiet said:
Eh, our mods are top shelf. They could just ban all the trolls, which is what they tend to do for us now. :thumbup:
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Actually, they have been doing that for the 18 years I have been here amd before. Some trolls take longer to discover than others, bit eventually they all get found.
 
The funny thing for me about this thread is I am old enough to remember when 440C was the trendy new steel for knives.
 
I've been in this game long enough to remember when 440C was considered a premium steel. If it's properly heat treated and has good geometry you will be hard pressed to know the difference from any of the latest CPM steels. Just my opinion and I would never shy away from it in a design I liked.
 
Esav Benyamin said:
New steels all the time, even improved heat treat protocols. Not so many years ago, 440c was a high end steel. ATS-34 was a custom maker steel. We don't see as much of either of them these days.
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I remember those days. I still like those steels.
 
To the OP'S primary question

There will always be a snobery related to steels as to everything else... Steel junkies will always be hooked up to the latest, most expensive steels that proclaim to have best possible performance of these days....

However, there will also be a tons of guys who are not willing to pay sky high money and prefer to stick with proven premium steels,that has been tested and that 440C righteously became....

It's been mentioned widely and quite often that this steel is surely not the one to be underestimated and depend on HT this steel can reach very high scores even against new super steels that could be number of times more expensive per same unit.....

Does anyone need to feel he /she have inferior knife, because it's been made out of older, cheaper steel? That is entirely up to each individual.... There are people who feel like kings in 30 years old Lincoln limousine and there are those, who would feel insecure being driven by 1,5 years old Maybach and feel like that car have been outdated...

Does that mean the old Lincoln limo is best car today? No it doesn't, is it a bad car? I don't think so, because it have been once on the top of the richest people list car,,,,,

Same apply to other example with Maybach is it best car today? Probably one of the best for certain purpose,,, is it outdated and something to be worried about? Could snobery affect someone to not buy it? Yes of course, there are individuals like that and always will be... ...
 
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