A Look At The Kershaw 1760 Skyline (What was TNP thinking???)

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I received two Skylines in the mail yesterday both with Damascus steel and so far I'm loving them. Ya the "thumbstuds" suck but I prefer a flipper anyway and never bought these with the intentions of using the studs. Took me a couple trys to get the wrist flick master because my other knifes with flipper are AO but after I figured the wrist flick out I'm very happy. Very lightweight and the Damascus is gorgeous!!! I haven't cut anything with them yet not even paper but both of them came shaving sharp. The bald spots on my left wrist prove that haha. Lockup is tight no blade play at all and both blades are nicely centered in the handle when closed. The liner lock is easy to disengage and has a nice lockup. This post had me worried but I'm glad I bought them now one for me one for my dads birthday. I will say one of them opens a tiny bit easier than the other at first but after opening and closing the stiffer one several times it loosened right up without touching the pivot screw or anything.
 
They are without a doubt blade stops!!!

Calm down. No one is denying that. However, some have put forth the notion that they are NOT thumb studs, and that they're only function is as a blade stop. As is clearly demonstrated in the specifications I've listed from Kershaw themselves, they are indeed thumb studs in addition to whatever other function they have. Period. End of debate.
 
The studs are first and foremost a blade stop, but can be utilized to open the blade as well. I've found that detent strength can vary with all flippers, thus:
A weaker detent will assist in the ease of using the thumb studs, but make using the flipper more challenging. Experienced technique will be needed.
Stronger detents can make the studs very difficult to use, but will assist greatly when flipping the knife.


In either case, practice can make the Skyline both a perfect flipper, and manual thumbstud opener as demonstrated in jonnyfgrooves video.
 
YES!! Thomas W approves of my flipper technique. :D :cool:

One more thing. I think that the liner protrudes just a hair in front of the G-10 scale, and that is where the actual contact happens to stop the blade when open. I don't think the studs/stop pins hit the G-10. Very cool design...
 
YES!! Thomas W approves of my flipper technique. :D :cool:

Look, most folks that don't know flippers, are new to the genre, all look a lot like the OP. Very infant technique, a little whiskey finger, kinda expecting the knife to do more than their effort. Not realizing some know-how and skill is necessary for the piece to really flip and to bring out the knife's full potential.

Good part is that the learning curve is fast, and most can get it down in no time.

Your technique jfg was outstanding. :thumbup: You could teach a class! :)
 
Good part is that the learning curve is fast, and most can get it down in no time.

One of my sons got his first Skyline when he was 12. He figured out how to open it correctly in about 5 minutes.
 
Yep, Johnnyfg is right on the money:thumbup:

While I know that it's good to revisit information from time to time to keep everybody up to date, the discussion over the Skyline's blade stops/thumbstuds and the technique necessary to properly operate a manual flipper folder have been discussed at length for a couple of years now.

Don't you guys know why Kershaw makes so many killer assisted openers? It's for silly guys who can't figure out how to open a flipper properly!:p:D

In all seriousness, while the Skyline might not make the hall of fame......it without a doubt excels in it's class. It's a great small folder that can do a lot of tasks. It's tough for it's size, easy to open, slim for the pocket, great usable blade profile, etc. I have one of the very first ones to come off of the assembly line and it still sees tons of pocket time.
 
I love the Skyline! It represents a very good knife at a great pricepoint. I agree that the thumbstuds/blade stops are useless for opening the knife, but I always use the flipper, so that's not an issue for me. The Skyline is my "go to" knife around the house. I've beat on it and it just keeps comin' back for more.

- Mark
 
Hey Guys,

I did a video talking about the Kershaw 1760 Skyline, and bring into question why The Nutnfancy Project (TNP) on YouTube gave this knife "Hall of Fame" status. Have a look and let me know your thoughts:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4xAfr0mFqFo



Here is my response that I also posted on Youtube (You deleted it within 2 minutes of my posting it and blocked me):

WHAT?!?! Your opinion differs from another opinion?!?! Nutnfancy loves the knife and in his mind it is a hall-of-famer. You don't like it - what the heck is your point?

Second, man-up and flick that blade out. My five year old could get that blade out with more authority than you demonstrated.

Third, "I can't pull this out of my pocket with one hand..." You have got to be kidding me. I recommend some light weight training.
 
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Kai USA gets a lot of credit when it comes to the growth of the flipper genre. We currently have patents that cover assisted opening in conjunction with a flipper, and for over a decade have countless models that have used this useful combination. The A/O category is recognized, and been popularized today primarily because of our output. The true talents of Ken Onion should also be documented with this statement.

A lot of our SpeedSafe pieces that incorporate a flipper also have “studs”. Sometimes patterns that have these studs along with a flipper get commentary on how difficult they are to utilize when deploying the blade. In every one of these instances, the studs’ primary function is that of a blade stop. Because there are so many manual folders that open only via the thumb stud, consumers have been programmed over the years, and anything outside of that programming gets confusing. They have difficulty distinguishing and understanding that these studs have functions that are different from what they are used to. Understandably, they have questions about the usefulness of the "stop-studs". Now theses stop-studs can work as a way to open a knife, albeit a bit more challenging than a conventional thumb stud. For every consumer that says stop-studs don’t function at all, there are ones like jfg that have little issues. Sometimes you have to look at an intended tool and realize it’s slightly altered from our comfort zone of what we've grown up knowing. Not bad, just different. Put in the time required to comprehend these differences, and the effort to conform, usually there are little problems.

As we’ve taken our A/O-flipper popularity to the manual stage, we’ve encountered similar debates about thumb stud/stop-studs. We’ve made manual flippers with a thumb stud, with a stop-stud, and without any at all. All brought on confusion and minor complaints.

Personally I believe a flipper should be pure, and without a stud of any kind. The knife is then shown to be what it really is, and there is only one way to open it. Occasionally a particular pattern prohibits an internal stop pin, and stop type studs have to be be implemented. Sometimes we want a piece with dual opening roles.

We’ve not done a great job educating with all of this, so hopefully this aids in going forward.
 
I have a Skyline and think it is a definitely a best buy on knives and a love the flipper opening. In fact Kershaw makes some of the best flippers on the market. After a little practice I like them more than thumb studs or holes in blade. Most can be opened without wrist flipping just take a little practice. Also, I come from the old school and thumb studs interferes with blade lines. Somehow a blade looks better without T/studs. And I have had T/studs catch on my jeans and slacks pocket a few times because most companies put T/studs on both sides of the blade. Just my 2 cents.
RKH
 
Sheepdog, he did that to me too. The funny part is then he claims that 99% of the responses he gets from people agree with him. That would be true when he deletes/disregards everyone that disagrees with him. Hilarious.
 
Thanks for the perspective Thomas. I hope it clears some things up for some folks:thumbup:

Kai USA gets a lot of credit when it comes to the growth of the flipper genre. We currently have patents that cover assisted opening in conjunction with a flipper, and for over a decade have countless models that have used this useful combination. The A/O category is recognized, and been popularized today primarily because of our output. The true talents of Ken Onion should also be documented with this statement.

A lot of our SpeedSafe pieces that incorporate a flipper also have “studs”. Sometimes patterns that have these studs along with a flipper get commentary on how difficult they are to utilize when deploying the blade. In every one of these instances, the studs’ primary function is that of a blade stop. Because there are so many manual folders that open only via the thumb stud, consumers have been programmed over the years, and anything outside of that programming gets confusing. They have difficulty distinguishing and understanding that these studs have functions that are different from what they are used to. Understandably, they have questions about the usefulness of the "stop-studs". Now theses stop-studs can work as a way to open a knife, albeit a bit more challenging than a conventional thumb stud. For every consumer that says stop-studs don’t function at all, there are ones like jfg that have little issues. Sometimes you have to look at an intended tool and realize it’s slightly altered from our comfort zone of what we've grown up knowing. Not bad, just different. Put in the time required to comprehend these differences, and the effort to conform, usually there are little problems.

As we’ve taken our A/O-flipper popularity to the manual stage, we’ve encountered similar debates about thumb stud/stop-studs. We’ve made manual flippers with a thumb stud, with a stop-stud, and without any at all. All brought on confusion and minor complaints.

Personally I believe a flipper should be pure, and without a stud of any kind. The knife is then shown to be what it really is, and there is only one way to open it. Occasionally a particular pattern prohibits an internal stop pin, and stop type studs have to be be implemented. Sometimes we want a piece with dual opening roles.

We’ve not done a great job educating with all of this, so hopefully this aids in going forward.
 
Sheepdog, he did that to me too. The funny part is then he claims that 99% of the responses he gets from people agree with him. That would be true when he deletes/disregards everyone that disagrees with him. Hilarious.

You'll fine there's plenty of comments on the page with disagree with my assessment. Profanity laden, personal attacks are deleted however.

The vast majority of all comments received however were in agreement.
 
Thomas,

First of all, thanks for weighing in.

A lot of our SpeedSafe pieces that incorporate a flipper also have “studs”. Sometimes patterns that have these studs along with a flipper get commentary on how difficult they are to utilize when deploying the blade. In every one of these instances, the studs’ primary function is that of a blade stop. Because there are so many manual folders that open only via the thumb stud, consumers have been programmed over the years, and anything outside of that programming gets confusing. They have difficulty distinguishing and understanding that these studs have functions that are different from what they are used to. Understandably, they have questions about the usefulness of the "stop-studs". Now theses stop-studs can work as a way to open a knife, albeit a bit more challenging than a conventional thumb stud. For every consumer that says stop-studs don’t function at all, there are ones like jfg that have little issues. Sometimes you have to look at an intended tool and realize it’s slightly altered from our comfort zone of what we've grown up knowing. Not bad, just different. Put in the time required to comprehend these differences, and the effort to conform, usually there are little problems.

As a company representative, I certainly understand this response. However, I respectfully disagree.

I will admit that based on my experience with the Skyline as well as the SOG Mini Vulcan, I'm just not a flipper guy. I prefer thumb studs - it's simply a matter of personal preference. The beauty of a knife like the SOG Mini Vulcan is, it offers both options. Both are designed an executed on the Mini Vulcan in such a way that they're both legitimately functional. The same cannot be said of the Skyline, IMHO. Had they been, then no "customer education" would be necessary.

Personally I believe a flipper should be pure, and without a stud of any kind.

I think the Skyline would have benefited from this sort of a design philosophy. Put the blade stop only on one side, and don't make it look like a thumb stud.

Sometimes we want a piece with dual opening roles.

Options are a good thing. I like options. :thumbup:

We’ve not done a great job educating with all of this, so hopefully this aids in going forward.

Start with a good design and execution of that design, and the need for this level of education is largely negated. :)
 
I will admit that based on my experience with the Skyline as well as the SOG Mini Vulcan, I'm just not a flipper guy.
First off I'll say I'm not trying to be offensive with any of my reply here.

Right away your video proved the above out John, both with your knife vocabulary and technique.

I prefer thumb studs - it's simply a matter of personal preference. The beauty of a knife like the SOG Mini Vulcan is, it offers both options. Both are designed an executed on the Mini Vulcan in such a way that they're both legitimately functional. The same cannot be said of the Skyline, IMHO.
I know where you're coming from here John. Your knife skills are fairly elementary, and you are comfortable with what you know. Not all thumbstud openers work the same. A liner lock with a thumstud vs. a frame lock with a thumstud are two different animals. If you try to open them identically, you will struggle with the frame lock, as your grip will put pressure against the lock thus rendering it nearly impossible to open. New users get comfortable with one style, they like it and it works of them. Any knife that goes against that comfort zone and that they can't fluently use on the first time is frustrating, and "not as good" as what they've been programmed for.

Others graduate and understand in more detail the intended use of specific features. Out of the box, they see the piece for what it is, have experience enough to envision (I'll speak specific to our topic here), that these Skyline studs are those of a blade stop. A seasoned knife user understands the build, and the intention, can conform to the knife, and enjoy it from that standpoint.
Had they been, then no "customer education" would be necessary.
Customer education isn't necessary with the true enthusiast. As I said, they see it right away, process what's in there hand, move forward with that knowledge, wisdom, and enjoy with big smiles on their face.

Most that get there first manual thumbstud opener, have issues. Opening it via these studs are foreign at first. Many people really struggle with their grip and dexterity with these one hand openers. A short learning curve later, and it's second nature. It's the same with other "non-traditional" openers, it's just a short learning curve to level up.

Hell it took me literally hours to get down the most simple opening move with the Kershaw E.T. I was so pissed about this damn knife moving me to use my hands differently, taking my mind completely out of it's little box it was so comfortable in. Butterfly knife as well. I'm sure glad I stuck with it, and appreciated the knives in ways I never thought.

I'll stereotype a little bit here and say that some folks that own (spent their own money) on more than one knife, think they are some sort of an expert when in fact they're not. They are at an elementary stage of which they are in a bit of denial about. Some graduate, some don't. Some want to move forward, some don't. Some make video's, some don't. It's all cool, but let's not fool ourselves.

I think the Skyline would have benefited from this sort of a design philosophy. Put the blade stop only on one side, and don't make it look like a thumb stud.
Not trying to upset you here John, but you're showing your novice side with quotes like these. A knife build has to be a certain way, and to produce the Skyline as you describe would be an epic fail.


Options are a good thing. I like options.
We like options as well, and understand customers do to. As jonnygroove proved in his video, the Skyline can pose a dual threat. It can for you as well. Can we look for you to put some time into the piece and do us up another video showing how much you've conformed to the knife?

Start with a good design and execution of that design, and the need for this level of education is largely negated. :)
Experience, understanding, and will willingness to change assists as well.:)
 
First off I'll say I'm not trying to be offensive with any of my reply here.

If you're being sincere here, you've failed in an "epic" way as you say.

I know where you're coming from here John. Your knife skills are fairly elementary, and you are comfortable with what you know.

Others graduate and understand in more detail the intended use of specific features.

Customer education isn't necessary with the true enthusiast. As I said, they see it right away, process what's in there hand, move forward with that knowledge, wisdom, and enjoy with big smiles on their face.

Instead of saying "we surely could have improved these thumb studs) you've chosen to imply I'm not a "true enthusiast" (whatever that is) and that my skills are so elementary that I lack the capacity to truly appreciate this product. Base on the short video and our exchange here, I hardly think you're in any position to accurately gauge my "knowledge and wisdom." Unless of course you simply assume that anyone who isn't absolutely thrilled with your products is an idiot.....

I'll stereotype a little bit here and say that some folks that own (spent their own money) on more than one knife, think they are some sort of an expert when in fact they're not. They are at an elementary stage of which they are in a bit of denial about. Some graduate, some don't. Some want to move forward, some don't. Some make video's, some don't. It's all cool, but let's not fool ourselves.

Wow.....just wow. Firstly, I've never claimed to be an expert in knives. I like to share my opinions in videos. Period, dot, end of sentence. I actually learn a lot about the products I review in the process of writing reviews and recording videos about them. I'd wager that if I'd only showered the Skyline with unmitigated accolades, it wouldn't have mattered how poorly my technique was in opening the knife or that I called the flipper a pusher. My expertise, or lack thereof, wouldn't have been questioned methinks....

Secondly, the implication here is that if I had achieved this lofty level of knife expertise of which you speak, I'd have the capacity to appreciate a flipper. What an incredibly condescending point of view. That attitude precludes the possibility that I've tried and mastered the "pressure build" technique and concluded that for my use, I prefer thumb studs. We're talking about opening knives here, not flying F-35s....or even riding bicycles for that matter....

We like options as well, and understand customers do to. As jonnygroove proved in his video, the Skyline can pose a dual threat. It can for you as well. Can we look for you to put some time into the piece and do us up another video showing how much you've conformed to the knife?

See, there's that sanctimonious attitude again. Padawan learner that I am, I tend to see a knife which requires me to conform to it to be less than optimally designed.

Experience, understanding, and will willingness to change assists as well.:)

Characteristics such as the ability to say "we're not perfect" and "we can do better" as well as the capacity to not blame our shortcomings on the (imagined) failings of others are also helpful.
 
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You'll fine there's plenty of comments on the page with disagree with my assessment. Profanity laden, personal attacks are deleted however.

The vast majority of all comments received however were in agreement.

Funny, my comment was not a profanity laden personal attack yet it was still deleted.
 
Thomas, your post was not offensive in the least. In my opinion it was with considerable care specifically not to offend but to inform. I learned a lot from it.

I bought a Skyline for my son for his birthday and since his birthday is some time off; he is now getting a used Skyline. I hope I can clean it up because I had his name engraved on the blade.

Wonderful knife! It is obviously at one end of the use spectrum for a 3" blade. An EDC knife is 99.9% carry and this one is superb. Thin, light yet grippy and strong enough for 99% of the use an EDC gets. Criticism of the thumb studs/blade stops can only be from one not trying the flipper. Criticism of the flipper I suspect might come from one used to the excellent Speed Safe system in many Kershaws. It took me about 5 flips to master it with or without wrist flip. I can't imagine a 3" blade knife being made with more bang for the buck as an EDC.
 
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