A reality check for most makers

meddiver said:
Thank You Kevin. I certainly am not attempting to disparage anyone, but I am attempting to make an effort to show that there are many wonderful makers in the world, and as an example if I were to attempt to speak of the
current cabals ideas for "ABS" makers in for example Spain,and attempt to impose those ideas, I would be given a blank look at best, and quite likely be met with hostility.
This forum does seem to represent a wide variety of makers, collectors but it remains a "big frog in a small pond".
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Tell us about your interest in custom knives, and what makers you might own, before I offer my own input on your statements, if you don't mind?

As far a being the "common man"...we are ALL "common men". Sure, Peter G can play the piano, do martial arts, and speak convincingly in more than New Yawk English, but he is still "common"....his voice is as valid as any....and he has, for the most part, superb taste in fine forged knives.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
 
Kohai999 said:
Tell us about your interest in custom knives, and what makers you might own, before I offer my own input on your statements, if you don't mind?

STeven,
I'm not attempting to have anyone emulate me, nor am I trying to impose my
ideas upon anyone here, so if we meet at a show we're both attending, I'd be pleased to show you photographs of what I own, perhaps share stories, but in a posting such as this, it is not my intent to create my own glee club.

I admire the craftsmanship of many people's work which I have seen in shows, by their owners, or by the makers themselves. I am NOT a collector, nor do I make claims to being an expert in this field.

I am asking what I feel however is a valid question. I do know how any organization must have standards , but my doubt remains the same, if you have not held, at first hand, a makers work, how can they be summarily dismissed as a great maker. Also as I'm certain most would agree, as any individual hand crafted article quality fit, and finish can change, and as Les Robertson wrote, he finds newer "MS" makers, or "JS" create better work at times than older established "MS" makers.

Anyone can turn out something that is just not up to expectations, so is that maker yet one of the best because that maker is on the "top fifty maker list" ?

Once again, I am not attempting to argue. I seek however that those here who do claim expertise to teach us who do not claim expert status, why these things are to be accepted and found believeable.

Thank you
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To some people here, the knife exists by itself. It's presentation value, and artistic merit, precision, etc.. the focal point. I've been giving some thought lately to an old notion, Ed Fowler describes the human hand as asymmetrical. This is true, and the knives which feel best to my grip have irregularity. (This won't win any prize, in a contest against knives where everything is judged on minutia and precise form. To me it doesn't matter. The philosophy is "user first".

My kids are taking fencing. There is a type of grip, it is unusual in shape. Hard to figure anyone actually seeing it and thinking it would work. But, holding it, you begin to see- it allows one to hold the foil
with the minimum effort.. its called the orthopaedic grip. This sort of thing would be laughed at, if you put it on a knife. But, it works for its purpose.

I guess what I'm really saying, experimenting and innovation comes in many ways, and "top 50" can be judged in a lot of ways. Not just who makes the most perfect or popular thing ever created. Something that "works" is a good category.

This rant might be off the topic, but i truly can't figure out what this thread is about. (???)

Meddiver brings up some good points.

One of the reasons i like Tai Goo's knives/philosophy - you don't have to follow a mould. His style is complete freedom.
David
 
:thumbup:
freedom>style
 
Ask 100 different people who they think are the best 50 knifemakers in the world and you are going to get 100 different lists. It is quite likely that a few makers would make it on to most of the lists, but agreement on the top 50 knifemakers is not going to happen.

Which makers are relevant is an individual decision.

Is the work of most custom knifemakers not worth collecting? Probably, but who am I to say? Is it not worth critiquing? There I disagree with Peter. In my opinion it is not the top fifty makers (whomever they may be) that would benefit from having their knives critiqued.
 
I read Keith's post, and then reread the initial post in this thread.

1. I don't know if it is 'the truth' that the work, (complete body of work?) of a 'majority' of knifemakers is not worth critiquing or collecting.
We usually have no idea who's waiting in the wings as the next Loveless or whomever, and everyone starts somewhere. Just because you suck now, doesn't mean you can't receive helpful criticism on Bladeforums- from masters- and become that zeitgeist. Some of our culture's most influential modern artists were generally despised during their lifetimes, as they weren't producing what people wanted them to produce. They had the 'freedom' to think way outside the box. Collectors and/or investors should know the fundamental importance of diversification! Some start ups are risky! But...

2. I don't think that there was any intention to disrespect anyone, however, pointing out what was pointed out could easily be construed as condescending and possibly derogatory- if you are a sensitive kind of person who takes other people's 'way' to seriously. I for one am impressed by the lifespan of this thread and think that the strong language really helped give it legs. Things that help us think and type are good.

3. I think this statement speaks for itself, and I cannot add anything further to it by way of interpretation;

"The same fifty:cool: top:cool: makers get mentioned:thumbup: here on the Forum;) by the snobby;) collectors;), time and again, for one reason:thumbup: and one reason:thumbup: only. :DTHEY DO THE BEST WORK:D."
 
2knife said:
To some people here, the knife exists by itself. It's presentation value, and artistic merit, precision, etc.. the focal point. I've been giving some thought lately to an old notion, Ed Fowler describes the human hand as asymmetrical. This is true, and the knives which feel best to my grip have irregularity. (This won't win any prize, in a contest against knives where everything is judged on minutia and precise form. To me it doesn't matter. The philosophy is "user first".

My kids are taking fencing. There is a type of grip, it is unusual in shape. Hard to figure anyone actually seeing it and thinking it would work. But, holding it, you begin to see- it allows one to hold the foil
with the minimum effort.. its called the orthopaedic grip. This sort of thing would be laughed at, if you put it on a knife. But, it works for its purpose.

David
Click to expand...

Second point first- There was a thread a while back about fighting knives over int he makers section. The orthopaedic grip was actually promoted as a bonus for the "ultimate" custom fighter. along with a long clip, full handguard, etc.

First point: I've made definitively LH and RH knives. I *can* do perfectly even handles but I spend most of my time making them roughly match and then fine sanding and filing until it feel good in the hand. That often results in a bit of asymmetry. (That being said, i'm not a fan of overly fitted handles on field knives where you grip shift too much. It's fine for a butchers filet, though)
 
If I was to buy knives as an investment, I would look more at the maker than the knife itself. If I was buying a knife to be used as a knife
I would look at quality, not the maker or where it came from.
We've all walked through those flee marts where they have tables of cheap knives and swords. Some of us have stopped and looked, usually surprised at just how flimzy they are. But if we were to find a well made knife of good steel and quality on that table at a great price would we think ourselves to good for it ? If I liked it I'd buy it.
But that's just me. I collect what impresses me not what I think others will like. Isn't that what collecting is about ? My faverite would remane my faverite even if no one else here liked it.
I make knives and they sell just fine for me. I have a small homemade forge, a small list of repeat customers, and a small thing in my head called a conscience. If someone isn't satisfied with a knife I've sold them I have them send it back and I refund their money.
Do you collect for yourself or do you just have a need to impress others ?
Is this the real question here ?
Hope this brings some smiles.
Mike
 
when i first got introduced to this wonderful knife community i was a brand new enthuisiest. i always loved knives but didnt no sh...it about metals/stock removal.etc...
when i started searching the top names would always come up. i jumped on the wagon. now after awhile I feel i went through a fad. i still respect the so called tops but i have a much greater interest in new names designs. i feel alot more heart in the not so well known. i see through their eyes much easier than i can a hyped up expert although many re very humble. its the hole spetrum of the art. -and it will keep going like that forever and ever and ever and ever lol
 
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