Aggressive dogs outdoors

Back when, for a *very* short time, i worked as a LEO, i encountered lotsa watch/guard dogs. Mostly in a fenced in yard, but ocassionally i had to enter. I can tell you with absolute confidence that Pepper spray works beautifully in a canine discouragement roll.

As a hiker, i now carry bear spray - an amped-up version pepper spray and i can tell you that if a dog gets too aggressive it's gonna get a shot across the snout (which is all it takes to send Barky into a fit of wimpering). I'm a dog-lover myself, but outta control is outta control and i won't put up with it.
 
I used to go for jogs out in the sticks all the time. Unfortunately, one of the locations where I would jog past had three loose dogs, two austrailian shepards and one heeler mix. Every time I'd jog past this place, the trashy woman would be sitting on her porch as she watched her dogs come racing out of her yard at me. It didn't matter if I ran on the opposite side of the road or even slowed to walk to quietly tip toe past her house, the dogs always came. As long as I faced them, they just stood there and growled, barked and came within inches of biting me. No matter how many times I screamed at the woman to control her dogs, she'd calmly call them and finally screamed back at me, "Well find some place else to run ####hole!". Mind you I lived in a place that only had four total roads, one paved, the others dirt. this one was dirt, was somewhat scenic and had little to no traffic. Well after her comment, I started picking up a handfull of rocks before I arrived in her area. One day they came charging out and I nailed on on the snout which sent him running. It seemed to make the other two more mad and I almost got bit. The woman had the nerve to scream at me about hitting her dog and threatened to call the Sheriff; which I had already done three times (they wouldn't do anything, just suggested I run somewhere else). Then one day I was running past while the woman wasn't home, the heeler mix came running out towards me alone from behind and I didn't see him. He bit the #### out of the back of my calf and I bled like a stuck pig. I got on the cell and called the Sheriff again. His response?, "Don't you have a huge Rottweiler? Why don't you jog with him and if her dogs come out, let your Rott handle business" I think he was joking but I thought, good Idea. So I went back home, leashed my Rott and limped back down the road. I guess the heeler mix now had the taste of blood so he came running back for a second helping. This time however, he was greated with an over protective 110 pound Rottweiler. I figured, he'd be too slow to catch the heeler or if he did, he'd just mess him up a bit. I was wrong. The stupid heeler mix, came charging at my Rott as I let him off the leash like he was going to beat up my Rott. To make a long story short, in less than about 10 to 15 seconds, the heeler was a mangled mess of ground meat. I thought, "Crap, now what?" I just pitched the remain up in her yard and went home. I praised my Rott for a job well done and relayed the story to the sheriff. His response, "well I guess the dog won't be biting you anymore."
 
I've always owned dogs, lots of mutts, a couple labs, a Shepard -rot mix and now have a beagle mix (she's close to 50#). All were well behaved and caused no trouble. I've had a couple run ins with dogs I though would attack in the woods, picked up stout limb and held my ground ...maybe a few steps towards them and they change there mind. The worst encounters have been on side walks in a little town! My Wife (pregnant at the time) and I were taking a walk, when two BIG mastiffs came up and started circling ,snarling slobbering..growling, owners nowhere in sight! My wife is afraid of dogs so they were mostly eying her, I did my best to keep in between her and the dogs and when they kept it up, I told her to calmly walk away I'd keep them busy..one way or another. I kept stayed in between her and the dogs, I yelled at them, one turned and walked but the other jumped at me...I'm 6'4" and this dog was BIG!! Head like a Thanksgiving turkey big lol he snapped at me a few times and I told him "Your a big old bastard...but I ain't scared of you!" ( Thats actually what came to mind at the time) I just waited it out hand on my pocket knife and eyes locked on him I was strangely calm for the situation and I think that is what kept him from biting me. If it were a smaller dog I would have probably kicked it in the ribs but I wasn't sure what effect that would have on a 200# dog! Luckily he finally got bored of me waiting for him to make a move and trotted off. I think if it would have been someone with more fear or of smaller stature like my wife it would have ended deferentially.
I've also had Rottweilers and German shepherds barrel after me walking back roads but none concerned me as much as the Mastiffs!
 
I hate bringing my dog out for hikes when I'm with my dad. He insists on letter Badger off leash. I think it's stupid, irresponsible, and not safe for anyone--he could get hurt, we could get hurt trying to save him, he could hurt someone else, someone else could hurt him.

I hate when people say their dogs don't bite, but that phrase--"Don't worry, he doesn't bite"--is so ingrained into people's heads now that they don't even realize what it means. I was walking my dog around the neighborhood once and this weird lady who is obviously afraid of dogs stands back and asks me if he bites. I say, "Yes, well all dogs bite."
She tries to clarify herself, "I mean, is he a biter?" I'm still resisting trying to give into that phrase since it does not make sense, perhaps my own zealous crusade in trying to get rid of the phrase from America one pedestrian at a time.
So I respond, "He has teeth, so yes, he bites."
Now she's angry that I'm being "sarcastic" with her, and she walks the other way.

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Anyway, point is, keep your dogs leashed if you're not in your own private area. It's way too assumptive and asking way too much of other people if you think they'll somehow know your dog is "the best dog ever" when they've never met it before.
 

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I grew up on a gravel road in a rural area and as it happened, the 2 roads that our farm was on (comprising a corner) formed part of a triangle that was connected to a busy, 2-lane highway. People would turn onto one of the gravel roads and drive the mile or so to the intersection of the other gravel road and drop off their unwanted canine. They would then turn onto the other gravel road and back to the highway (think about a right-triangle - the base and upright are the gravel roads and the angle is the highway).

Well, over the years there came to be a semi-large feral dog population in our "neighborhood" (roughly a 2-miles radius around where we lived) running/killing deer, calves and other livestock. Since everyone in our "neighborhood" knew each other and their dogs, we started shooting these feral/stray's on sight. It was sad because i love animals and dogs particularly, but when left/abandoned, dogs are animals and do what they need to survive. It's the negligent owners in these situations that are truly in the wrong.

Pets, even with their owners nearby, considers itself part of it's "family pack" and will "defend" the pack - it's their natural instinct. If the owner has not trained their dog properly, who knows what the dog will do? Everyone *thinks* they know how their dog will respond, but there are so many unknown situations it best to keep 'em leashed if there's possibility of encountering other people. Owners need to keep control of their dogs and keep watch over them - it's just a basic responsibility.

I've had several dogs over the years and am humble enough to admit that they can be unpredictable - even normally "docile" or "loving" dogs can get freaked out. Irresponsible owners, usually the thug-types who own "tough" dogs, who refuse to train their dogs need stiffer penalties for even the slightest trangression. Hit 'em where it hurts the most- right in the wallet and take their dog if the situation/circumstances warrant.
 
Rowdy dogs get on my nerves - well, their owners do

I was watching some fool the other day with a Ridgeback off the leash, encouraging it to chase squirrels in the park. That'll be a kid next i thought

And a friend of mine got bitten by a pitbull. I swear to this day that she genuinely thought it was her own fault for not giving the dog room. The owner was all apologies, and even said please don't tell the cops as he did this before and he'll get put down if they find out. Too right, it should get put down. Still wouldn't tell the police. I got pretty, but it didn't help matters at all

It takes less than a second for a snappy dog to take the face right off a kid, playing or not. I don't understand how people don't get that

Mind you, we've always had Staffs, and I know you can't keep dogs permanently controlled
 
Sure we can. I've rained guard dogs. One of them was our own Boxer. Very effective protector, very gentle around normal people. But he could smell drink or drugs a block away, and got ... alert. Nevertheless, he answered to us without hesitation.

You need to be patient, repetitive, rewarding, and serious. Dogs are genetically programmed to respond to this.
 
+1^ Codger_64 and +1^ Esav -

It is our responsibility to train and control our dogs. So when irresponsible people's dogs do terrible things, it's not just the dog's fault - the owner also needs to be 'educated' (after their dog is put down).
 
As far as never met a douche bag with a small breed dog. The people with the small dogs are the ones I almost always have trouble with. They let their dogs run loose barking at you and they totally ignore it. Its like they think because its little its not bothering you while its barking and nipping at you. I have small dogs doing this all of the time while the owners do nothing, just like parents with their yelling, screaming and crying kids. I cant remeber the last time that a large dog threatned me, its always someones small dog.
 
crossada said:
I've never met a douche bag who owned a small breed dog. They always own large breeds with agressive reputations. Too bad douche bags have to exist as the problem would most likely disappear overnight.
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As far as never met a douche bag with a small breed dog. The people with the small dogs are the ones I almost always have trouble with. They let their dogs run loose barking at you and they totally ignore it. Its like they think because its little its not bothering you while its barking and nipping at you. I have small dogs doing this all of the time while the owners do nothing, just like parents with their yelling, screaming and crying kids. I cant remeber the last time that a large dog threatned me, its always someones small dog.
 
fmajor007 said:
+1^ Codger_64 and +1^ Esav -

It is our responsibility to train and control our dogs. So when irresponsible people's dogs do terrible things, it's not just the dog's fault - the owner also needs to be 'educated' (after their dog is put down).
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Civil and criminal liability is a good educational tool... for those tools. There are many ways for responsible pet owners to restrain their animals. Training and socialization are primary. Physical restraints are secondary, but equally important. My service dog will not jump up on people. Primarily because he has been trained not to. Secondarily because I restrain him so that even if he decides to ignore his training, he does not have the opportunity to do so. I employ the same methods to keep him from relieving himself in the house. Or running away.

I am reminded of the last street festival dog show we attended together. There were hundreds of people and dozens of dogs. While we awaited our turn for judging, Jake was sitting beside me next to a trash can overflowing with half-eaten food. A member of the local humane society came over and reminded me that Jake was sitting next to a can of food. "He does not get into trash cans and does not eat people food." He paid no attention to the can at all other than the markings other dogs had left on the side of it. That is his training. But he was also physicaly restraind on a leash in case he forgot his training. The very idea that we can not always control them is false. It does take forethought and effort though.

Likewise he did not mark (relieve himself) on the can. He relieved himself when I took him to a grassy area nearby and gave him the command.
 
We have six dogs. Two of them have been hiking companions, and are always kept leashed. We do not take them to public areas such as grocery stores and the like, but do take them with us when walking about town and such. They are the least aggressive dogs imaginable, but they never come off the leash and they are always observed closely.

I've known many dogs that "weren't biters" until they met that one odd situation where their normally good socialization got pushed a bit too hard. One of our dogs is completely submissive..... to adults. Not to children, small children, the loud, running, jumping, yelling kind of child. She (the dog) never goes off our property, and if a neighbor or a relative with a small child comes to visit, we start out the visit with a "child socialization" session where the dog is placed on the ground with the child near, until the dog submits.

But we don't have small children, and visiting children are rare, so we don't take chances and she stays on the property.

Andy
 
Codger_64 said:
Civil and criminal liability is a good educational tool... for those tools. There are many ways for responsible pet owners to restrain their animals. Training and socialization are primary. Physical restraints are secondary, but equally important. My service dog will not jump up on people. Primarily because he has been trained not to. Secondarily because I restrain him so that even if he decides to ignore his training, he does not have the opportunity to do so. I employ the same methods to keep him from relieving himself in the house. Or running away.

I am reminded of the last street festival dog show we attended together. There were hundreds of people and dozens of dogs. While we awaited our turn for judging, Jake was sitting beside me next to a trash can overflowing with half-eaten food. A member of the local humane society came over and reminded me that Jake was sitting next to a can of food. "He does not get into trash cans and does not eat people food." He paid no attention to the can at all other than the markings other dogs had left on the side of it. That is his training. But he was also physicaly restraind on a leash in case he forgot his training. The very idea that we can not always control them is false. It does take forethought and effort though.

Likewise he did not mark (relieve himself) on the can. He relieved himself when I took him to a grassy area nearby and gave him the command.
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and that is proper canine contol (K9?). We can indeed control our dogs 100% of the time by limiting their options.

What we cannot control is their *desire*. However, good training and discipline plus a leash does give 100% control.
 
fmajor007 said:
and that is proper canine contol (K9?). We can indeed control our dogs 100% of the time by limiting their options.

What we cannot control is their *desire*. However, good training and discipline plus a leash does give 100% control.
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Leash, check cord, electronic leash, fence, electronic fence, enclosure as secondary means... yes. But their desires can be channeled much more than most people think. It just takes more time and effort in training that the majority of people are willing to invest in pets. How many people do you know who invest, in cash or time equivilant, $20,000 in training for their dogs? Very few would be my guess.
 
This is posted in WILDERNESS & SURVIVAL SKILLS, The wilderness has wild things. Dogs included.

I do not like strange dogs barking at me.

I understand your complaint, and I wish people trained their animals to behave.

If dogs running around and barking(on wilderness trails not parks) makes you nervous, carry pepper spray, a stick, or a gun.

If you still don't feel safe, what are you options, stay home on the couch and talk about the outdoors, Because there will always be bad dog owners.
 
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Interesting encounter. Perfect example of an ignorant owner.

I was walking down a main street today, on the sidewalk, man coming toward me with a big Shepherd with about 3 foot of leash free. Dog on his right, me on his left, dog lunged across in front of him, barking and leaping at me. I shouted at the dog -- twice -- to back him down, man stood there like he didn't know what to do.

I walked off cursing at him. He just waddled on, not saying a word through through the whole thing.
 
My neighbor commented tonight that yesterday his dog bit a kid, but it was the kids fault for running past him and the dog from behind, I restrained myself from telling our neighbor and friend that it was his fault. This guy has said before that his dog bit a kid at a different base, and that it had been the kids fault.

It is always the owners fault and unless a kid is causing real harm to a dog and knows that it's actions will make the dog mad, it's still the owners fault for not having the dog in a place where it has the option to respond before its owner can kick the kids butt for being a moron.

I've kept from posting here because I have a harsh view on human / animal interaction, if you want a guard dog, you need to be responsible for it, if you have a "fur-kid" you need to grow up and control it.

The bottom line to my post is that people are stupid, they (mostly) don't even have their dogs trained for recall, they have dogs that they treat like spoiled kids, in public or in the wild I have zero tolerance for dogs that behave aggressively, in private it's tough to explain why 'your' dog should be restrained until I spend time with it and my kids just to make sure that my kids won't have their faces ripped off at best or at worst die in front of me while I knew I could have prevented it.... the hard part is the owners who mostly think their dogs are incapable of violence.

Lack of personal responsibility is what drives these encounters, as always when possible in the wild try not to travel alone and try to travel armed to deal with at least moderate threats, that's 'your' personal responsibility.
 
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