- Joined
- May 9, 2000
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- 29,205
I wonder if you can take those rounded point, children's scissors onto an airplane? Decent ones of those will work fine for opening blister packs.
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Airplane Legal?
- Thread starter csbjr
- Start date
- Joined
- Apr 27, 1999
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- 6,117
The official TSA website has the standard list of what is allowed and disallowed. Round nose children's safety scissors are allowed.
http://www.tsa.gov/interweb/assetlibrary/Permitted_Prohibited_7_24_2003.pdf
http://www.tsa.gov/interweb/assetlibrary/Permitted_Prohibited_7_24_2003.pdf
But even so, each screener is allowed to make their own decisions, using the rules only as a guideline, so they can disallow anything they want, anyway. You are still trusting the judgement of an individual who very well may not have been given adequate training.
Chief_Wiggum
Gold Member
- Joined
- Jan 19, 2003
- Messages
- 327
Last I checked airports are still in America. Therefore you still have rights.
Now granted you can't just go running around like an idiot, but certainly I think "doing what you're told" compromises some personal freedoms that you have a RIGHT to.
Speaking of idiots, my sister encountered one at an airport while passing through security at an airport. The guard there had apparently little experience with women and their feminine accessories, because he seized her eyelash curler as a "weapon."
Yes. A weapon.
He had no idea what it was and therefore said it had to be a weapon. It was an expensive item and my sister asked a more senior, female, security person to come over and 'splain things to the guy. My sister got to keep her eyelash curler.
I don't know about you, but the ordinary experience of growing up should clue everyone in on what eyelash curlers are.
Am I wrong on this?
In some cases the frontline security troops need a great deal more education and training.
Not quite. It looks like, well, I don't know how to describe it. It look like a very small pair of tongs with pieces of rubber that you grab the eyelashes between. Then you squeeze the handles together and hold for a few minutes. It's used to get all the eyelashes curling upward in a certain fashion. Growing up with a sister and being married, I simply got used to seeing them around.
- Joined
- Apr 6, 2003
- Messages
- 1,913
I'm not sure I understand why someone has a hard time understanding they give up their rights when they enter at the checking terminal and metal detectors [ for the benefit of the whole communities safety while on planes ].
I bet someone will eventually have the brainpower to stand there and yell, "It's my right to bring that knife on a plane", "you can't take that away from me and deny me my rights".
To which I would reply.
"Thats right, and those are the only rights [ the ones we say you have ] when you want to fly in the US".
Giving up rights? How far does that person take their rights or the depriving of same? It's not rocket science to figure out after 9-11 that FAA and the TSA have determined certain items, normally not illegal, will be considered so while flying and so restricted.
Chief_Wiggum: You have the right, the right to remain silent. You give up your rights at the gate. Don't like it, don't fly. I don't like it and I'm driving my A$$ to Idaho from Mass. next month. That way I retain my rightsto self defense in MY vehicle.
Would it be any different if you were thumbing on the road, someone stopped to pick you up and said you can't ride with them if you don't throw that soda away. Are they denying your rights to possess a soda?
I guess so. But when you fly on anothers plane, not yours, where others like you are also flying, you are subject to the owners restrictions. If you don't like them, fly another airline or walk, drive, take a bus, cab, whatever other mode of transport you can find.
They are not depriving you of your rights. It's thinking like this that propagates ridiculous policies [ by some who will argue they have the right to do what they want ].
Brownie
I bet someone will eventually have the brainpower to stand there and yell, "It's my right to bring that knife on a plane", "you can't take that away from me and deny me my rights".
To which I would reply.
"Thats right, and those are the only rights [ the ones we say you have ] when you want to fly in the US".
Giving up rights? How far does that person take their rights or the depriving of same? It's not rocket science to figure out after 9-11 that FAA and the TSA have determined certain items, normally not illegal, will be considered so while flying and so restricted.
Chief_Wiggum: You have the right, the right to remain silent. You give up your rights at the gate. Don't like it, don't fly. I don't like it and I'm driving my A$$ to Idaho from Mass. next month. That way I retain my rightsto self defense in MY vehicle.
Would it be any different if you were thumbing on the road, someone stopped to pick you up and said you can't ride with them if you don't throw that soda away. Are they denying your rights to possess a soda?
I guess so. But when you fly on anothers plane, not yours, where others like you are also flying, you are subject to the owners restrictions. If you don't like them, fly another airline or walk, drive, take a bus, cab, whatever other mode of transport you can find.
They are not depriving you of your rights. It's thinking like this that propagates ridiculous policies [ by some who will argue they have the right to do what they want ].
Brownie
- Joined
- Dec 14, 2000
- Messages
- 1,058
"BTW, on my last trip, they confiscated my screwdriver."
I think that should read "stole", because that's exactly what they're doing. The only reason it continues is because we all bend over and let them have their way with us...
Security, my ass...
I think that should read "stole", because that's exactly what they're doing. The only reason it continues is because we all bend over and let them have their way with us...
Security, my ass...
- Joined
- Apr 6, 2003
- Messages
- 1,913
You have any idea how many people you could kill with the screwdriver in about 30 seconds of rampage?
Think about it. And you did not have it stolen, you gave it up so you could conform and fly that trip. They are not confiscated, they are denied entrance to the plane, you voluntarily agree to surrender the item so you may continue on your journey.
Having just read the FAA report of what is and isn't allowed and the ruling of such items found at the gates/terminals. The law says if you even have a restricted item on you and they find it during a search you can be placed under arrest. The screeners have the leeway to let you "rid yourself of the item", or they may not and CAN have you arrested for even having it at the gate to begion with.
You voluntarily give it up, they are not stealing from you. Your choice, rid yourself of the item and fly, or walk away. They are not forcing you to take the plane or hijacking people to the airports to make you fly.
You fly, obey the rules [ no matter how ridiculous you may think they are ]or don't show up at the gate and then have an attitude about having a restricted item taken from you.
When you ride the bus, they tell you no smoking. Do you then berate the bus driver or the company because they are violating your rights?
Didn't think so. How about when you enter a restaurant thats non smoking? You bitch to the manager that he's violating your rights?
Didn't think so.
Same with the airlines, you don't want to give up your rights, no problem, don't fly. You want to smoke and have dinner, go somewhere else or don't smoke. There is no difference at all.
You surrender your rights [ they are not taken from you ]. As YOU are the person who decides to fly, go to screening and surrender the item before boarding, how is that a violation of your rights". You are under no obligation to fly, your choice as well.
Brownie
Think about it. And you did not have it stolen, you gave it up so you could conform and fly that trip. They are not confiscated, they are denied entrance to the plane, you voluntarily agree to surrender the item so you may continue on your journey.
Having just read the FAA report of what is and isn't allowed and the ruling of such items found at the gates/terminals. The law says if you even have a restricted item on you and they find it during a search you can be placed under arrest. The screeners have the leeway to let you "rid yourself of the item", or they may not and CAN have you arrested for even having it at the gate to begion with.
You voluntarily give it up, they are not stealing from you. Your choice, rid yourself of the item and fly, or walk away. They are not forcing you to take the plane or hijacking people to the airports to make you fly.
You fly, obey the rules [ no matter how ridiculous you may think they are ]or don't show up at the gate and then have an attitude about having a restricted item taken from you.
When you ride the bus, they tell you no smoking. Do you then berate the bus driver or the company because they are violating your rights?
Didn't think so. How about when you enter a restaurant thats non smoking? You bitch to the manager that he's violating your rights?
Didn't think so.
Same with the airlines, you don't want to give up your rights, no problem, don't fly. You want to smoke and have dinner, go somewhere else or don't smoke. There is no difference at all.
You surrender your rights [ they are not taken from you ]. As YOU are the person who decides to fly, go to screening and surrender the item before boarding, how is that a violation of your rights". You are under no obligation to fly, your choice as well.
Brownie
Exactly.
However, I don't like it, but I must fly.
If there were any viable mass transportation alternatives in the US, I'd never set foot in an airport again. If I want to go crosscountry in hours rather than days, air is the only way to go.
This country has built itself on air transportion, not bullet trains.
I can fly to Las Vegas in a few hours. I checked out how long it would take by Amtrak. We're talking DAYS.
My wife wants to travel overseas. That means I will be de-tooling myself. I don't like it one little bit, but I intend to get some intense tranquilizers from my doctor. I will be de-tooled, de-bladed, defenseless, and demoralized (just how security wants you), but I won't know it and won't care after I take a nice big sleeping pill / tranquilizer. I will simply be one more smiling, compliant fool.
The truth is, almost any object can be used to kill a human. I bet that Mike Tyson could kill just as many people with his bare hands in 30 seconds as someone with a screwdriver. But it would be pretty silly to confiscate his hands.
I don't think that just because an object could be used to murder is a good excuse to ban it. I do feel that the ban on guns and knives is a good idea (it makes people feel safer) but that is where it should end. If security would use some common sense and trust that a grandmother with a "potentially" dangerous nailfile, a man with a "potentially" dangerous mini-screwdriver, or a woman with a pair of "potentially" dangerous eyelash curlers is going to use the tool as designed instead of to kill, we would be a lot better off. Just because something has the potential to kill does not mean that it will be used in that manner.
Just my .02
Gollnick
Musical Director
- Joined
- Mar 22, 1999
- Messages
- 29,258
Let me be clear: I used the wrong word, "Confiscated." I'm very sorry and I owe an applogy to the TSA people.
I was denied permission to enter the secure are with my screw driver. I was given the choice of going back and checking it as baggage or otherwise arranging for it, perhaps mailing it, OR of voluntarily surrendering it and immediately proceeding on. I elected to surrender it.
Many, many years ago, I worked for a company that then hired a fellow who is a friend of mine to this day as a technician. His previous employeer had these screw drivers printed as tradeshow giveaways. When they went bankrupt, they shafted all of their employees out of three weeks pay. When the court-appointed supervisor opened the facilities up so that employees could retrieve their personal effects, most retrieved three-weeks-salary worth of "personal effects." The court-appointed supervisor was sympathetic. At the end of the day, there wasn't much left in the building.
"Excuse me, but we're just here for PERSONAL effects."
"This is my personal fire extinguisher."
"Oh. Well then carry on... or out as the case may be. Excuse me, but are you sure that's your PERSONAL photocopier?"
"Absolutely." (nudge, nudge, wink, wink).
"Then let me help you. You might hurt your back lifting that alone."
You get the idea. Among the loot that Richard offed with were cases and cases of these screwdrivers. He gave me a box of something like a hundred of 'em. So, aside from the sentimental attachment, it having been a gift from a friend, and the great story associated with it, I wasn't to upset to forfeit my screwdriver.
As Mr. brownie0486 so correctly points out, boarding a commercial air flight is not a right; it is a privilege. If you won't want to comply with the established rules and restrictions, if you want three carry-on bags or if you want to carry on a knife, then there are other travel options (including air travel options) available to you.
I was denied permission to enter the secure are with my screw driver. I was given the choice of going back and checking it as baggage or otherwise arranging for it, perhaps mailing it, OR of voluntarily surrendering it and immediately proceeding on. I elected to surrender it.
Many, many years ago, I worked for a company that then hired a fellow who is a friend of mine to this day as a technician. His previous employeer had these screw drivers printed as tradeshow giveaways. When they went bankrupt, they shafted all of their employees out of three weeks pay. When the court-appointed supervisor opened the facilities up so that employees could retrieve their personal effects, most retrieved three-weeks-salary worth of "personal effects." The court-appointed supervisor was sympathetic. At the end of the day, there wasn't much left in the building.
"Excuse me, but we're just here for PERSONAL effects."
"This is my personal fire extinguisher."
"Oh. Well then carry on... or out as the case may be. Excuse me, but are you sure that's your PERSONAL photocopier?"
"Absolutely." (nudge, nudge, wink, wink).
"Then let me help you. You might hurt your back lifting that alone."
You get the idea. Among the loot that Richard offed with were cases and cases of these screwdrivers. He gave me a box of something like a hundred of 'em. So, aside from the sentimental attachment, it having been a gift from a friend, and the great story associated with it, I wasn't to upset to forfeit my screwdriver.
As Mr. brownie0486 so correctly points out, boarding a commercial air flight is not a right; it is a privilege. If you won't want to comply with the established rules and restrictions, if you want three carry-on bags or if you want to carry on a knife, then there are other travel options (including air travel options) available to you.