Americans to pay millions to recapture battle flags

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Four rare battle flags captured during the American War of Independence by a British officer have been returned after more than two centuries to be auctioned.

The regimental colours seized in 1779 and 1780 by Lt Col Banastre Tarleton, who remains one of the conflict's most controversial figures, have already aroused huge interest among American military historians. They are expected to fetch between £2.3 million and £5.8 million at Sotheby's in New York next year.

nflag22a.jpg


The colours of Col Buford's crushed Virginia troops

Until recently the flags had hung in the Hampshire home of Capt Christopher Tarleton Fagan, the great-great-great-great nephew of the lieutenant colonel.

Capt Tarleton Fagan, a former Grenadier Guards officer, said: "I am very sad to sell them. They are an important part of our family history and we have had them for 225 years. However, there comes a time when their value is such that one can no longer afford to insure them."

Only about 30 American revolutionary battle flags have survived, all of which, apart from the ones to be sold at Sotheby's, are in museums and in most cases only fragments remain. The ones captured by Tarleton are in excellent condition and their history is well documented. One is the flag of the 2nd Regiment of Continental Light Dragoons, raised in Connecticut by Col Elisha Sheldon, who were defeated by Tarleton in Westchester County, New York in July 1779. The other three flags were seized the following year in a still controversial battle in the southern United States.

nflag22b.jpg


Col Sheldon's Connecticut dragoons fell to Tarleton in 1779

Tarleton crushed a Virginian regiment under Col Abraham Buford at Waxsaws near the border of North and South Carolina. Accounts of what happened next differ. According to the Americans, Tarleton ordered his men to slaughter more than 100 revolutionary soldiers who had already surrendered. But the British officer maintained that his horse was shot after a truce was declared and pinned him to the ground.

"His troops thought he had been killed and the loyalists among them ran amok," said Capt Tarleton Fagan.

The killing of the Virginian troops led to Tarleton being called "Bloody Ban". The Americans also coined the phrase "Tarleton's quarter", which meant that no prisoners were taken.

After the war ended Tarleton took the four battle flags back to England. Buford's main flag, made of gold silk, has a painted image of a beaver gnawing a palmetto tree, while the two smaller, plainer ones would have been battalion standards known as ground colours.

While Tarleton was reviled by his enemies, the British public proclaimed him a hero. He was immortalised in a portrait by Sir Joshua Reynolds which depicts the captured American flags lying at his feet.

tarleton.jpg


Lt Col Banastre Tarleton

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2005/11/22/nflag22.xml

maximus otter
 
I wonder who'll buy them? Museums might be interested in them for historical value, but I would imagine British museums would want them more than American ones. I sure wouldn't spend any money buying back a symbol of defeat.
 
Paying to recapture the flags? I say screw that and we go over there and take them by force. Why pay for what we rightfully own?
 
The Battle of Cowpens, when most of Tarleton's force was captured or cut to ribbons by a much smaller force of colonial militia, was the beginning of the end for him.
 
It will be interesting to see who ends up purchasing them. Maybe one of the British Royals will pony up the dough to keep them in the UK.
 
He is the basis for the anti-hero "Col. Tavington" in Mel Gibson's "The Patriot".
 
RH said:
He is the basis for the anti-hero "Col. Tavington" in Mel Gibson's "The Patriot".

Another of Mel's period epics, following on from Gallipoli and Braveheart, all renowned for their historical accuracy. :barf:

maximus otter
 
maximus otter said:
Another of Mel's period epics, following on from Gallipoli and Braveheart, all renowned for their historical accuracy. :barf:

maximus otter

ROTLMAO, I seem to recall there were some French soldiers in the final scenes of The Patriot. Did they have any impact on the war or can the British defeat solely be attributed to Benjamin Martin and his trusty tomahawk? :D
 
maximus otter said:
Another of Mel's period epics, following on from Gallipoli and Braveheart, all renowned for their historical accuracy. :barf:

maximus otter
Ahhh, now you've done it
258878892
I think the movie is more accurate than what you hear.:D
 
Cindy, Cindy.
We know you--don't pretend that you will let historical accuracy be of concern when it might block a glance at Mel's blue-painted tuchus.

:D

And Maximus-admitting that the French contribruted to a British defeat must be at least as painful to you as admitting that the Colonials whipped their butts.
 
If anyone is interested I'm organizing a raiding party to retreive our American flags and deal the dirty English dogs a blow to their egos. I may even take a crap on Buckingham Palace's lawn and bungy jump off of Tower Bridge dressed as the Queen while I'm at it. Who's with me?!!!! :p
 
K.V. Collucci said:
I may even take a crap on Buckingham Palace's lawn and bungy jump off of Tower Bridge dressed as the Queen while I'm at it. Who's with me?!!!! :p

Good luck explaining why you have Dr. Martens indented backwards on your forehead, when you get back ... empty handed :D
 
shaldag said:
Cindy, Cindy.
We know you--don't pretend that you will let historical accuracy be of concern when it might block a glance at Mel's blue-painted tuchus.

:D
I dunno what a tuchus is but I have Braveheart on DVD and can blow it up really big inside the blue square...off to the dictionary again.:thumbup: Hey is it before the first battle scene?
 
tuchus is yiddish for "hindquarters". I don't know ol' Mels behind was shown or painted blue in the movie, but given your admiration for the kilt, I thought it might be appropriate.:D

In any event, if you substitutute mullet for tuchus, the sentiment of my post will still work.
 
K.V. Collucci said:
I may even bungy jump off of Tower Bridge dressed as a Queen. Who's with me?

Err... no-one, K.V.

I may even have to increase my meds to erase that image.

shaldag said:
And Maximus-admitting that the French contribruted to a British defeat must be at least as painful to you as admitting that the Colonials whipped their butts.

shaldag,

It was the Americans who "contributed" to the narrow defeat of Britain's incomparable armed forces!

Butt-whipping indeed!

"The War of Independence plays such an important part in American popular ideology that references to it are especially prone to exaggeration and oversimplification.

...it was also a world war (the Americans could scarcely have won without French help)."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/state/empire/rebels_redcoats_01.shtml

maximus otter
 
Ill join the raiding party...If they all look like the drag queen that took em the first time...all we will need to bring is a few box sets of the best of Queen and a gerbil and a tube of astroglide....:D
 
Guess I'd bid $10, but only due to their historical interest. They might make interesting conversation pieces hanging in my library. But if they're more than $10, I'd rather have a nice framed picture.

Best Wishes,
Bob
 
TorzJohnson said:
I sure wouldn't spend any money buying back a symbol of defeat.

It's not a symbol of defeat, it's a symbol of the rebellion. Besides, we still won the war, even if they did grab a bunch of flags from us.
 
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