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Munky88 said:
There are two types of crime. Crimes committed without thinking, an act of passion. Or planned crimes committed when they think they can get away with it. Neither of which would be dissuaded by harsher treatment.
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Wrong. Sorry. There are also those who commit crimes because jail is the easy road. I don't know or care how it is in BC, but we have criminals down here who get out for a few months and go right back in. Many times, these are jerkoffs avoiding child support, etc. They have found that life within a prison is easier than life outside. If they were punished more severely for their indiscretion, I would say that many of them would not be repeat offenders. Of course, purely psychotic (meaning those with a few "screws loose") people will commit their crimes regardless of consequence.

Also, a harsher treatment will dissuade crimes in a number of cases. I cannot find the resource right now, but I did a paper on corporal punishment and found that places like Singapore had lower rates of criminal mischeif because the punishment (usually caning) was shift and severe.
 
luckykitty said:
True, that is language developing - though to me it probably will look strange for a long time ... seems to be easier to accept change in my first language ...


A person willing to take another persons life (or person's life) outside combat ... (but let's leave that aside).

And no, I do not believe in determent. Most people think they won't get caught anyway. A murder is planned, and people go to great lengths to develop and execute plans that are meant to keep all attention from them. So they think they will never ever be arrested let alone judged for what they are about to do. (They often do make mistakes, and are caught, but that is not what they intend, thus a death penalty will not keep them from doing what they plan.)
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If you knew the penalty for drugs was death, I doubt you would deal drugs, yes?
 
dougo83 said:
Wait...where the hell are you getting this nonsense from? How does punishing a criminal for their crimes equal murdering innocent children? Here's the answer so you don't hurt yourself: IT DOESN'T. Lay off the drugs, fool.



I really would like to see evidence of diplomacy solving even one conflict in the history of mankind. Now, I am not a history buff, so I may have missed it while sleeping through class. Remember, a treaty is usually the result of something else, not the start. The Japanese would not have surrendered if the US had not shown that they were willing and able to decimate the entire country. After all, they didn't surrender after having two horrendous bombs dropped on their country. Aside from that, this is dealing with an enemy that does not want to negotiate, agree, or settle. They have made it abundantly clear that they want blood. They have made it even more clear that they are willing to die for their beliefs and see it as honorable. I see no reason not to oblige them.
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It was a half joking reply to mean, when he stated we should not have to hold soldiers to a higher standard then that of where they're deployed.

Diplomacy solved all the conflicts that never happened.

but you want war storys, so I'll point to something relevant, Afghanistan.
Had the US gone into Afghanistan guns blazing Osama would have gotten exactly what he wanted. Pictures of Americans killing Muslims. This would have united the Muslim extremists against America. Result would not have been pretty

Instead what they did was send in special forces to the northern tribes. They sent them with briefcases of money and satellite phones. They raised an army of Muslims, the Norther Alliance, to fight the Muslim extremists, dividing them. It started well, since then the plan has faulterd a bit since then. But what they need to do In Afghanistan is concentrate on key areas of diplomacy turning the people against the Taliban.
 
luckykitty said:
And no, I do not believe in determent. Most people think they won't get caught anyway. A murder is planned, and people go to great lengths to develop and execute plans that are meant to keep all attention from them. So they think they will never ever be arrested let alone judged for what they are about to do. (They often do make mistakes, and are caught, but that is not what they intend, thus a death penalty will not keep them from doing what they plan.)
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This is flawed logic based on the asinine assumption that you can read a criminal's mind. Since you cannot, let's just leave this argument behind. The facts show that, in some cases, harsher penalties lead to a drop in crime rates. I mentioned Singapore and I will track down the source when I get home. Also, look at how states that allow private citizens to carry weapons have lower crime rates than those that don't. The simple fact is that criminals are less likely to perpetrate crimes in areas where they know they can be killed for their actions.

As far as execution stopping a murderer: it may not stop the first one and that is most certainly tragic. However, killing them will definitely prevent a repeat.
 
I don't deal drugs, cause I have other means of generating income, and I like generating my income without harming others, and I think dealing drugs harms others.

So even if I had limited means of generating income I'd think of something other than dealing drugs, no matter if that was illegal or not.
 
Munky88 said:
Diplomacy solved all the conflicts that never happened.
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This is a pure logical fallacy. It prevented things that didn't happen? Then who's to say it would have happened in the first place? The Cuban Missile Crisis is one of the few times where I have heard of conflict being avoided by diplomacy. It was still little more than a pecker-measuring contest.
 
Munky88 said:
It was a half joking reply to mean, when he stated we should not have to hold soldiers to a higher standard then that of where they're deployed.

Diplomacy solved all the conflicts that never happened.

but you want war storys, so I'll point to something relevant, Afganistan.
Had the US gone into afganistan guns blazing Osama would have gotten exactly what he wanted. Pictures of Americans killing Muslims. This would have united the Muslim extremists against America. Result would not have been pretty

Instead what they did was send in special forces to the northern tribes. They sent them with briefcases of money and satellite phones. They raised an army of Muslims to fight the Muslim extremists, dividing them. It started well, since then the plan has faulterd a bit since then. But what they need to do In Afghanistan is concentrate on key areas of diplomacy turning the people against the taliban.
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guns blazin? to hell with the guns, we were dropping daisy cutters all over the place. we went at them from all sides. I remember seeing some night footage of them using a gunship to gun them down on foot as they were running away!

nothing diplomatic about that!
 
luckykitty said:
I don't deal drugs, cause I have other means of generating income, and I like generating my income without harming others, and I think dealing drugs harms others.

So even if I had limited means of generating income I'd think of something other than dealing drugs, no matter if that was illegal or not.
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your missing my point, the fact that you would understand the stiff penalty would discourage the action to begin with!

I am not in any way calling you a drug dealer!
 
mean said:
guns blazin? to hell with the guns, we were dropping daisy cutters all over the place. we went at them from all sides. I remember seeing some night footage of them using a gunship to gun them down on foot as they were running away!

nothing diplomatic about that!
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They did give air support. But not as wide spread as I think you imagine. Actually Osama probably got away because they didn't give enough. They thought they had him on a hill but wanted the Mujaheddin to take him instead of blowing him up.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northern_Alliance
 
dougo83 said:
This is flawed logic based on the asinine assumption that you can read a criminal's mind.
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So papers published on criminals in Germany are asinine?

Jumping to conclusions is as well ...

Crime rates in Germany are very low as well, and they are sinking.

As to the low crime rate in Singapore ... they have a lot of man power in policing. And that is what keeps crime rates down more than anything else.
 
Munky88 said:
They did give air support. But not as wide spread as I think you imagine. Actually Osama probably got away because they didn't give enough. They thought they had him on a hill but wanted the Mujaheddin to take him instead of blowing him up.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northern_Alliance
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osama got away in the back of an ambulance. this is a well known fact now. he has been on dialisis for many years. this was his method to get thru roadblocks as emergency vehicles were not being stopped.
 
luckykitty said:
So papers published on criminals in Germany are asinine?Ahh...papers that are able to read minds. Sweet! Where do I pick them up?

Jumping to conclusions is as well ...

Crime rates in Germany are very low as well, and they are sinking.

As to the low crime rate in Singapore ... they have a lot of man power in policing. And that is what keeps crime rates down more than anything elseReally? Having a police force that is less than 1% of the total population prevents crime? I hardly think so. However, getting beaten for vandalism seems a more likely deterrent.(Yes, I am aware that the US has an incredibly small police force relative to population. Something like 0.2%. .
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again with the 5 character thing

Sigh...gotta get back to work...
 
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mean said:
your missing my point, the fact that you would understand the stiff penalty would discourage the action to begin with!

I am not in any way calling you a drug dealer!
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No offense taken, didn't really think you called me a drug dealer.

I guess introducing the death penalty for drug dealing would make a change, but I doubt it would be a change for the better. One might think in the lines of organized crime and disposable drug dealers.
 
If you want to know what is on a criminals mind, you gotta ask him, there is no other way.
If you killed him already, you'll never know. And if you ask him directly after the trial you'll get a different story than 10 years later ...

And 0.7 or 0.6 % of the population is a lot more 0.2 - more than doubles your chances to get caught.
 
Now to something completely different:
peanuts said:
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april-scott-lingerie-01.jpg


taryn-southern-20081023003453362-00.jpg
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How come there is so much bitching, moaning, complaining, arguing, finger pointing, name calling, and general adolescent behavior in the RAT forum lately? :confused: :confused: :confused:

Seriously guys (and gals)...I enjoy coming to the forum to talk about knives, gear, and survival stuff. But I find myself coming in less and less because of all the stupid posts. And trying to ask a simple question gets your shit jumped so fast that nobody will even answer the question cause they are too busy jumping on the band wagon.

I have a question about the RAT Pack knives, but that seems to be a forbidden topic now days. I try searching through the different threads and all I see is bickering.

Its starting not to be fun anymore.... :thumbdn:
 
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