Are "High End" production knives worth it? The video

bearcut said:

Baseline:
Cheap Chinese folder- $10-15
RESULT: A barely usable knife or an unsafe POS, it depends. Most people feel they get their moneys worth, if barely.

An inexpensive knife- $25-$45 (CRKT, low end Spyderco, BM, Kershaw etc).
RESULT: Huge difference. The knife should function reasonably well. Most people feel they get their moneys worth. There is some satisfaction and pride in these purchases. Almost no buyers remorse or diminishing returns here.

Low to mid grade folder- $50-100, (Spyderco, BM, Kershaw, CS, etc.)
RESULT: Really big difference. Now you are getting very good construction and higher end blade steel. People are happy with these offerings, they get a good product that could last many, many years. No buyers remorse, and almost no diminishing returns on this class.

Mid to high end production folder- $ 125-250: (Al Mar, ZT, Fallkniven, Emerson, Spyderco, BM, etc)
RESULT: People start to see what the fuss is all about. These are nice knives. A person jumping from a $60 folder will immediately see the difference and understand why he paid so much for the knife. These are knives that you could hand to a total non-knife person and they would probably comment on how nice a knife it is. These are so close to high-end offerings that there is really no practical need to spend anymore for a superb quality folder. Lot’s of pride of ownership involved with this class of folder. Material quality, and construction, is top notch. Blade steel is near, or at the highest level available. The average person knows they paid a lot for the knife, but probably feel they got their moneys worth and would recommend them to others. Probably not too much buyers remorse if the person could afford it in the first place. Diminishing returns are more prevalent at this point.

High end Production folders- $300-500: ( CRK, Strider, Hinderer, etc.)
RESULT: These knives are the epitome of production craftsmanship. Everything (should) be tight, smooth and strong.

But, there is not that much immediate difference between this price point and the $125-250 price point.You could hand one of these knives over to a non-knife person and they may comment on how nice the knife is. If you told them how much it costs, they would probably be shocked and think you were crazy for paying so much for a knife.

You are not getting twice the knife for the money. Most of the cost involved for these knives are for things you can’t even see; tight tolerances, warranty, prestige. Spyderco, Kershaw/ZT and BM make several knives that are more exciting, different, and fun than these knives, for a lot less money. Things you can see in other words.

A person going from a $60 folder may truly wonder why the heck he paid so much for a knife that may not seem all that great. The quality may be obvious, but not for the extra $300 they just dropped. The knife may have annoying traits, (Strider break-in), be much thicker and heavier than he is used to, (Hinderer), or may just seem plain and unexciting compared to his other folders, (CRK). There may be major buyers remorse.

Bottom line, buy what you like, with a design that appeals to you. Forget about the price.
Bragging rights only last so long.
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Can't believe I missed this. This is a fantastic summary.
 
kurodrago said:
I agree completely:thumbup:




Personal opinion can vary, FACTS can't.
Nobody talking about scientific test or scientific journal :rolleyes:
That's quite a statement. Can you offer up some proof to back you up?
Do you have any scientific journal:confused::D
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If you cant prove a FACT through scientific means or research that can be repeated consistently, with a methodology that can be distinguished as credible and with peer review, it is not a fact. When a hypothesis is tested through qualitative, or quantitative research that hypothesis becomes a fact.

Here is some proof you can find for yourself and investigate for yourself.

Yin, R. 2009. Case study research: Design and methods– Applied Social Research Methods Series. Volume 5. Sage, London.

Babbie, E. 2005. The Basics of Social Research, Third Edition. Belmont, California: Thomson Wadsworth.

http://www.nrf.ac.za/

Research can be defined as the search for knowledge or as any systematic investigation to establish facts.

Do I have a scientific journal....why yes....you can take one out at a research library if you want to read one, I have a heap that I can get from the academic institution I am affiliated with. There are scientific journals in every field of study. Here is a simple list of a view.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_scientific_journals
 
gotta say some'n.....

it's funny when peeps say cheap POS knife they gotta qualify it as being Chinese....

just saying if the same cheap POS quality knife WERE made in the USofA, it will prolly set ya back 50 buckaroobanzais and it'll still be a fittydolla American POS.....

case in point: (i won't mention it, but it's S30V US-made POS and what a POS it is at fittydolla)

Love'm Sebenzas though......i figger mo than twice the machinin and finishin goes into them than into knives at half the price...

So there y'all
 
marthinus said:
If you cant prove a FACT through scientific means or research that can be repeated consistently, with a methodology that can be distinguished as credible and with peer review, it is not a fact. When a hypothesis is tested through qualitative, or quantitative research that hypothesis becomes a fact.

Here is some proof you can find for yourself and investigate for yourself.

Yin, R. 2009. Case study research: Design and methods– Applied Social Research Methods Series. Volume 5. Sage, London.

Babbie, E. 2005. The Basics of Social Research, Third Edition. Belmont, California: Thomson Wadsworth.

http://www.nrf.ac.za/

Research can be defined as the search for knowledge or as any systematic investigation to establish facts.

Do I have a scientific journal....why yes....you can take one out at a research library if you want to read one, I have a heap that I can get from the academic institution I am affiliated with. There are scientific journals in every field of study. Here is a simple list of a view.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_scientific_journals
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For facts... this Thread is enough for me.
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=543407&highlight=noss

The Sebenza is extremely over priced and over rated in my opinion. Sanrenmu does the job at fifty times less money!
I'm still wondering if Sanrenmu knive are the rip off or Sebenza knive are the rip off:confused::yawn::D
 
marthinus said:
If you cant prove a FACT through scientific means or research that can be repeated consistently, with a methodology that can be distinguished as credible and with peer review, it is not a fact.



Do I have a scientific journal....why yes....you can take one out at a research library if you want to read one, I have a heap that I can get from the academic institution I am affiliated with. There are scientific journals in every field of study. Here is a simple list of a view.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_scientific_journals
Click to expand...

Third word in and you likely left an apostrophe off... and we should take you as an authority for scientific research principles? Perhaps you meant 'cant' - - to deviate from a norm? As a noun it could have meant 'hypocritical jargon' - more appropriate.

Lighten up - this is a hobbyist forum - it is supposed to be fun. As far as journals, the janitors at the college where I taught had collections of journals - as well as texts - did that make them professors? It likely made them ready for the next book buyer - or paper drive.

Back to the big buck knives... I eagerly look forward to Friday's impending arrival of my Wilson Combat's variant of the CRK Umnumzaan... My first CRK and at over twice the cost of my previous most expensive knife. I'll have to tutor a slew of folks in algebra, etc to cover that thing... I'd better like it. Thanks to the OP for the video - it helped!

Stainz
 
Stainz said:
Third word in and you likely left an apostrophe off... and we should take you as an authority for scientific research principles? Perhaps you meant 'cant' - - to deviate from a norm? As a noun it could have meant 'hypocritical jargon' - more appropriate.

Lighten up - this is a hobbyist forum - it is supposed to be fun. As far as journals, the janitors at the college where I taught had collections of journals - as well as texts - did that make them professors? It likely made them ready for the next book buyer - or paper drive.

Back to the big buck knives... I eagerly look forward to Friday's impending arrival of my Wilson Combat's variant of the CRK Umnumzaan... My first CRK and at over twice the cost of my previous most expensive knife. I'll have to tutor a slew of folks in algebra, etc to cover that thing... I'd better like it. Thanks to the OP for the video - it helped!

Stainz
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Exactly. I did not mention 'FACTS' or stated 'FACTS' of a certain knife company. I stated that 'FACTS' that are not done to a scientific measure is inconclusive. That is my opinion because of my background. Everything has to be taken with a bit of salt. As to my apostrophe.....well oops. English is my second language that I speak of 4 so I do miss an apostrophe here and there.
 
This thread is drifting off track from the discussion of knives.

Let's keep it on track from here on out.
 
kurodrago said:
For facts... this Thread is enough for me.
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=543407&highlight=noss

The Sebenza is extremely over priced and over rated in my opinion. Sanrenmu does the job at fifty times less money!
I'm still wondering if Sanrenmu knive are the rip off or Sebenza knive are the rip off:confused::yawn::D
Click to expand...

Knife seems to do fine for its intended purpose and design:
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=608769&highlight=green+beret
 
singularity35 said:
Buy what you want.
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The second part of that quote was uncalled for (does not matter that I agree) ;).

The first 4 words are pretty powerful though.

We have folks from all over the world, from all walks of life. There are people here with knife collections that are worth more than houses and automobiles.
To condemn someone who has knives that cost 30 bucks is as silly as condemning those who might have a knife worth 20K. That 30 dollar knife can bring as much usefulness as the thousand dollar + knife.

Why should it matter to anyone else if both knives are enjoyed.
 
Bastid said:
The second part of that quote was uncalled for (does not matter that I agree) ;).

The first 4 words are pretty powerful though.

We have folks from all over the world, from all walks of life. There are people here with knife collections that are worth more than houses and automobiles.
To condemn someone who has knives that cost 30 bucks is as silly as condemning those who might have a knife worth 20K. That 30 dollar knife can bring as much usefulness as the thousand dollar + knife.

Why should it matter to anyone else if both knives are enjoyed.
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You're right, sorry. Post edited.

I actually do like the value and quality for the money that my persistence and tenacious give me. What I meant was that a personal opinion is exactly that and others may not share it.
 
The teen with the 2 or 3 dollar knife who comes here represents the future of our hobby and community more so than someone 50+ year old like me who might happen to have more disposable income to spend. Let's not run them off because they purchased something and they enjoy it.

Let's also not run off folks who spend what we as individuals deem as too much money on a knife when a 5 dollar knife will do the same job. We are better than that as a community.
 
People buy what they can afford and or like.

The reasons for that are theirs alone and their choice. :)

All knives are good, just different. :)
 
So-Lo,

About your signature pic. Tell me that's not your newborn son with an open Sebenza in his hand!! :eek:
 
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