Are most knives today too thick.

[bdmicarta]

Most of the knives I grew up using were thin slip joints.

Same here. The most recent one that I have used was handed down to me by my father many years ago after he broke the end of the main blade.

My wife bought some cheap folding paper windowshades and they come with a cheap fixed blade knife to cut them to length. The knife is thin carbon steel, maybe a 2" blade with a thin molded plastic handle. I thought it would be interesting to sharpen it and use it as a utility knife. I was cutting a corrugated cardboard box with it and broke the blade. It's possible that the metallurgy or heat treat is suspect, but otherwise I want a significantly stronger blade for my normal use which means thicker.

I'm in the "in between" camp. Most folders I like in the 3.5-4" range have blades that look reasonable to me. Some of the "hard use" fixed blades around 6-7" seem too thick for me. One exception is my ZT 0561. It has a pretty thick blade at the spine but the part that seems excessive to me is the thickness behind the edge and this seems to reduce its ability as a slicer.

 

[rogerxd45]

i have noticed overly thick knives as well. I dont like thick EDC folders, it takes more force to cut through stuff. sure there are situations where i would be more comfortable with a thicker knife (heavy chopper) but for over 99% of my use i want a thin blade. I love my 2mm mora, it slices like a dream. I plan on sending off a couple of my knives for a regrind to thin out the blade to make them better suited for my needs. for an EDC i want my knives to be .125" or less i like blades that are about 3/32" or 0.09375"
I have some 0.070" 1095 steel i plan on making a nice paring knife out of. It will also be HT to a higher hardness then most. this will make it less tough but a well cared for paring knife does not need to be tough as it will only be used for slicing not any hard use stuff that could break the blade

i think the main reason for thick knives is simply because a thicker blade gives customers the impression of a better, higher quality knife. thin blades can give people the impression that its a cheap low quality knife,

 

[Jhansenak47]

This right here is the answer you are looking for... yes, a thin knife can do the job, but how many can do the job daily for years and still preform well afterwards...

Till metals exist that can withstand that kind of daily abuse in wafer thin blades, adding thickness is the only way to add durability...as long as broken blades = bad press and less knives sold, makers will overbuild to preserve their own reputations....

I'd come a lot closer to buying a knife advertised as " unbreakable, able to handle ANYTHING you throw at it " than I would one advertised as " Thinnest knife you can get and still get by, for awhile, if you baby it "

Without giving actual dimensions it is pretty easy to make generalized statements. What is wafer thin?
The old green river knives are around an 1/8" thick and served for over a century. Thinner than 1/8" is great for fillet knives. Thicker than 1/8" is the tendency of hard use knives.
Thick enough has to be contrasted against too thick.

 

[Cobalt]

Bodog, after looking at the damage to the edge when cutting the rim of the can, there is no doubt that it was caused by the 8 dps angle. No matter how tough a steel is, that thin an angle is just to thin to do hard work with without expecting damage. There is little metal behind the edge to support the edge during hard work. 15 dps is a great compromise for all around use and still slices well. As for cutting cans, they really do offer very little resistance and even the rim isn't that hard and I would bet that the thicker edge would not have had any damage at all.

The advantage to a thicker blade only comes in heavy use like chopping where weight is important. Prying as well. It just depends on the use.

 

[fencepost]

If the world of knifes had only thick blades I would say yes, but blades come in all thicknesses so I would have to say no. I have blades from 3/8" to 1.0mm.
my 1.0mm is a great knife for delicate food items and garlic, the 3/8s is great for railroad modeling, splitting shingles, and railroad ties.

 

[Trollbane]

Fairly modern, 1,7 mm spine!

EKA, Swede 88

It seems to be a cultural thing as well. Most knives from or aiming at the US market seem to be overbuilt now a days. Strength seems to be an utterly valid selling point. Also it's interesting to see the whole "tactical" and selfdefence discourse which seems to be closely related. From my cultural horizon it is a very strange way of looking on knives and their use.

I honestly don't understand the whole discussion about breaking knives and locks. Never done it and probably never will. But I like the diversity the topic and solutions brings. But from a practical standpoint? Well...not really for me.


/ J

 

[Cobalt]

Fairly modern, 1,7 mm spine!

EKA, Swede 88

It seems to be a cultural thing as well. Most knives from or aiming at the US market seem to be overbuilt now a days. Strength seems to be an utterly valid selling point. Also it's interesting to see the whole "tactical" and selfdefence discourse which seems to be closely related. From my cultural horizon it is a very strange way of looking on knives and their use.

I honestly don't understand the whole discussion about breaking knives and locks. Never done it and probably never will. But I like the diversity the topic and solutions brings. But from a practical standpoint? Well...not really for me.


/ J

I'd love to see the side view of that knife and if it is a scandi grind. How wide is the blade?

Honestly, I have zero use for a knife that thin except in maybe slicing tomatoes and onions.

 

[Trollbane]

Unfortenately it's hollow grind these days. "Swede 88" used to be a scandigrind. The steel is Sandvik 12C27. The blade is 2 3/4" and 23 mm wide. The knife is very light and weighs in at merely 2.2 oz.


I don't have many knives either that thin!
It's thinner than both Opinels and SAKS. Mostly posted it as an example. It's strong enough for most tasks except for woodworking. You can harm the edge if you loosen the edge from a piece of wood since it is so delicate.

/ J

 

[Cobalt]

Ok, I like that knife and I didnt notice it was a folder. Very nice.

 

[K.O.D.]

I agree with the OP on so many modern folders being too thick. Its only going to get worse as more and more people are joining the ranks of the tactifools wanting heavy duty folders that look cool and want to use a folder beyond its intended use.

Its a threefold issue:

People wanting bombproof folders
The popularity of metal handles (Ti especially) and therefore framelocks
The popularity of flippers

Personally, I can't stand overbuilt knives, especially metal handles. The fact that I love flippers puts a damper on my choices.

More and more I want to go away from metal and synthetics like g10 or frn, and more towards carbon fiber and wood.

 

[shqxk]

Edge thickness is more importance in my opinion... FFG 1/4" spine thick with 0.012" edge will cut better than 3/16 with 0.04" edge in most task.

 

[d00mtr33]

I think it really depends on whag kind lf knife it is and its intended purpose. I love to carry an edc knife thats ground at 0.010 and thinner for my daily cutting tasks. I enjoy my Krein regrind elmax para 2 at 0.005, Nilakka gen 1 tbats just as thin if not thinner, gec bullnose in O1 I thinned out to undef 0.010 and fantoni dwellef in 19c27 thats tnat thin. But I would want a lil more heft behind the edge in my choppers, 0.020 to 0.025 should handle jyst about anything you can think of and some. Like someone above said, companies try to put in some insurance in their knives to lower returns/warranty work by running their knives thicker and softer than optimal. They have to make it strong enough for the weakest link, a user who doesn't know a lot about knives and might try chopping a cinder block for some reason. I get it but fir me amd im sure a lot of members here who know proper knife techniques it might be a lil frustrating to get a knife that's below it potential.

Example, I recently bought a spyderco Bradley air, a great lil edc knife that surprisingly fits prettg well in my xxl hands. It a 2.5 inch, thin stock of m4, thin titanium linerlock and yet its ground at about 0.020 behind the edge a lot of bigger spyderco knives. Why? The steel has decent toughness, its a small knife that I can't see what you could try to do with it to require that much edge thickness but being that tjick sacrifices cutting ability. It would be a incredible edc knife at about 0.010 or a lil less, but now its just an ok edc knife.

Its things like these why theres a lot of custom makers out there. Unlike spyderco, benchmade, kershaw or other companies they can talk to the customer one on one and figure out what you want. My friend is a custom maker and his knives are ground kinda like spydervos, in the 0.020 range but you can talk to him and ask for a thinner or thickef knife depending on what you want.

To sum up, yes I do think that mosg knives are too thick today. But im not the guy running a knife company andthere are reasons why they do what they do. It also comes down to picking a right tool for the job, a 63 hrc m390 chefs knife ground to 0.005 isn't the best choice for a chopper, sure it can do it for a bit but for how long? Just like a 1/3 inch busse battle mistress is the best choice for a paring knife. Just sayin

 

[Yalius]

I suppose if I have the time and opportunity to match a knife to what I'll be cutting-- and have ready access to a backup just in case-- I could go as thin as possible. But to be honest, in cases where I'm not in complete control of what I'm attempting, I'd rather have a bit thicker blade that takes more effort to cut with than try to work around an inch-long half-moon snapped out of a more efficient cutter.

Of course, I'm not typically skinning, slicing, or doing fine work. I'm punching through drywall, cutting off the lower edge of a deck railing, cutting a bush out of the way, or hacking my way through insulation or a moisture barrier. When I'm underneath a house, I don't have the luxury of picking and choosing my tool. Better safe than sorry.

 

[Fireform]

If the work you do requires a beefier blade, then by all means. Many people seem to have fallen for the idea, though, that they will have to hack their way out of the trunk of a car someday, and are afraid their pocketknife will invite ridicule if it's not up to the task.

An ordinary stockman is not the perfect choice for field dressing a deer, but it is more than capable of the task. A friend of mine once stuck a wild boar hog with his little Queen slipjoint. I rarely am in a situation where I can't get an axe or saw if that's the tool for the job, and either one will get through a log faster than a sharpened crowbar.

 

[Czechmate]

I suppose if I have the time and opportunity to match a knife to what I'll be cutting-- and have ready access to a backup just in case-- I could go as thin as possible. But to be honest, in cases where I'm not in complete control of what I'm attempting, I'd rather have a bit thicker blade that takes more effort to cut with than try to work around an inch-long half-moon snapped out of a more efficient cutter.

Of course, I'm not typically skinning, slicing, or doing fine work. I'm punching through drywall, cutting off the lower edge of a deck railing, cutting a bush out of the way, or hacking my way through insulation or a moisture barrier. When I'm underneath a house, I don't have the luxury of picking and choosing my tool. Better safe than sorry.

What do you carry that does all of those tasks with ease? Just curious...

User error; .220 thick 52100 blade with a lean FFG grind & thin behind the edge:

Convex recurve regrind FTW:

The user of this knife also changed his gorilla-like habits LOL... :foot:

 

[Yalius]

What do you carry that does all of those tasks with ease? Just curious...

User error; .220 thick 52100 blade with a lean FFG grind & thin behind the edge:

The user of this knife also changed his gorilla-like habits LOL... :foot:

I wouldn't say with ease, it's more of a chore that's better than the alternative of crawling out from the crawlspace and hunting down a more appropriate tool. And it depends, sometimes an 0561, an 0200, or a Junkyard Dog. Today it's a Leatherman E55b. Might be a Benchmade 551 tomorrow. I like a bit of variety, but prefer something abuseable.

 

[bdmicarta]

Edge thickness is more importance in my opinion... FFG 1/4" spine thick with 0.012" edge will cut better than 3/16 with 0.04" edge in most task.

Sounds like comparing a Bark River Bravo 1 with a Swamp Rat Ratmandu.

 

[Bob Leedy]

Speaking to the original question, yes, many of today's popular production knive blades are far too thick for general use. Especially on folders, the pivot will break way before the blade. It seems to me that thick blades on anything other than a dedicated chopper are more a fashion statement than a matter of function. To each his own.

 

[stabman]

So I suppose we've resolved it all now...and it has been established that the answer is:
- "YES!"
- "No!"
- "Maybe."

 

[stabman]

Especially on folders, the pivot will break way before the blade.

If you look for where folders actually break, it turns out you are wrong.
LOTS of broken blades; almost zero broken pivots.

What people "know" is the weakest point is not always correct.