Are people influenced too easily when it comes to knife steel?

LostCause said:
So, why fix something that's already working?
Waste of money... but youtubers said so 🤣
. ...
Old steels aren't to be underestimated,...
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reputable manufacturers build stuff to a technical specification.
if one actually reads and understands what exactly its
made to withstand and
possible physical limitations are,
things would work better for the end user.
having said that, knifegeeks are
obviously going to fall for upgrades
in their pursuit of perceived improved capabilities.
product improvement is
in the end, a business strategy.
folks often like to think they are ahead with "new toys".
 
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As I’ve gotten deeper into the hobby, I’ve enjoyed learning more about steel. I don’t understand half of it, but that’s why it’s interesting. Maybe I’ll get to half some day.

I also admire manufacturers that partner with steel mills to keep innovating. But I too enjoy sharpening, and have never made steel type my first priority. Who cares what somebody else thinks about what you like?
 
Smithhammer said:
Two of my faves as well.


Agreed. I've lived in parts of the world where people do far more with a simple $20 carbon steel knife than most people who have convinced themselves they need a "super steel."
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Just to echo this sentiment: you likely live currently in a part of the world where, at one point, people did significantly more with a simple carbon steel than most people do with any modern super steel in the context of knife-related chores.
 
I wonder if a lot of the steel stuff is driven by stores like BladeHQ or KnifeCenter and their YouTube videos. They are companies and need to sell their products but if you read their sections on steels, they list what they consider to be premium steels. You don’t want to be a sap and buy something in VG10, right? The word premium gives people warm fuzzies knowing they part something special.
Being new to knives this last year I fell prey to the marketing of these companies before I started using and sharpening. If you are someone that uses a knife all day long cutting cardboard or other slicing tasks then a high end steel that holds an edge well would be of benefit. But if you’re like me and basically open an Amazon package a few times a week, spending $200 or more on a pocket knife doesn’t seem justified.
I worry knife makers are making more pocket jewelry than anything else. Everyone wants a beautiful knife to show off on social media.
In addition, I grow weary of these EDC channels on YouTube. People spend hundreds of dollars on junk just so they can parade it on their channel to get views.
 
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LostCause said:
I've got in touch with more knife enthusiasts (which is both, good and bad depending how you look at it).
And they've all started trying to talk me into retiring my current EDC for something better, something in M390, Elmax or other high end steel as apparently 1095 sucks, especially on small fixed blade...

1095 retains it's edge good enough for me and gets scary sharp in less than few minutes, even on pocket sharpeners. I love that, and it can handle hard use too.

So, why fix something that's already working?
Waste of money... but youtubers said so 🤣

Same as dude that was texting me yesterday about how brittle D2 is and how dumb are people who think it's actually good steel...
While I could hear hits from the kitchen as my mother basically batoned D2 leatherneck through pork spine at the same time as I was reading texts about how chippy D2 is 😂

And another dude who had a knife he used for like a year and then sold it for super cheap as he saw JoeX video about it and it broke "too easily" on that particular video...
He lost all his trust in his knife he had over a year just because one video...


Old steels aren't to be underestimated, and it'd be a lot better if people put their things to use more.

That's just my opinion tho...
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The “old steels” that have been around for decades are perfectly serviceable, I agree. Assuming the heat treat, geometry, and sharpening job are good, a good 1095 blade will do everything I ask of it. To borrow a saying from gun guys, “It’s more accurate than I am.” I suppose the knife is sharper than I am?

That being said, I think there is sufficient cause for excitement regarding new steels. If we showed off the extreme rust resistance of H1 steel to a blacksmith from the middle ages, I say he’d probably be impressed. I also appreciate excellent edge retention, even if I have no serious need of supersteel performance 99% of the time. Every time innovation prevails in the knife world, which is a rather niche community, it makes me a little happier.

But to answer your question, I’d say yes. Introduce a new steel that outperforms the current “best,” knife nuts will be absolutely all over it. 😄
 
For me I prefer stainless because I’ve had some bad experiences with carbon/ non stainless knives.
I have several fixed blade knives in Bucks Bos 420hc that perform very well and keep a good edge and more recently some in s35vn and 3v that are superb. For my folders which I use the most I want higher edge retention like cpm 154, s30v, s35vn, s45vn and 20cv. I don’t have any problems keeping them sharp and they perform well and above the older steels.

Yes I have used the old school steels like 1095 and others and some were very good but after trying s30v I was convinced to upgrade and I don’t regret it at all. Maybe a lot of people can do well enough with the older steels and that’s fine, I have nothing against that. If I find that the premium super steels work better for me it doesn’t mean I’m a snob. I don’t collect them just to be able to say I have them, I use them and yes they perform much better.

It’s kinda like the difference with old school vehicles and newer models. Improvements have been made and we are the better for it. I still enjoy looking at the older vehicles and driving them but I’d rather take a newer model for a long road trip because they are safer and I can travel in comfort with air conditioning and other improvements that make it more enjoyable and less stressful.

I think the so called snobbery can go both ways old vs new and both for the wrong reasons. If you’re happy and satisfied with what you use that’s all that matters but it sure is a blessing to have the choices that are available to us.
 
It is easy to get all caught up in the newest blade steel, I know it has happened to me, but a knife is more than blade steel. Ergonomics are much more important, at least to me, than what type of blade steel is used. If someone has found a knife that suits their needs then that is great.
Sometimes good enough is exactly that, good enough. Not every knife needs to be made out of the latest supersteel to give great service.
 
LostCause said:
I admit I don't need 5mm thick full tang knife in 3V. I never even baton.
But I got it at good price, it holds the edge great, sharpens easily on diamond, no corrosion issues and it's tough as hell. So I don't need a 3V knife, but I do want it and this knife is therefore my favorite.
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I agree with the gist of your original post, but I feel like you are chiding others for what you are doing yourself. Objectively speaking and in absolute terms 3v is a better knife steel than 1095 in every category except ease of sharpening. Even ease of sharpening you disregard when saying that 3v sharpens easily on diamond stones as do many other steels that are also better than 1095 for knives. There are many, many excellent knives made out of 1095 class steels and if 1095 works for your use, that is great, but this in no way makes 1095 a good knife steel, just good enough. There are many steels that are just better for knives. Even without going to exotics 52100, AEB-L and even 1080+ or 80crv2 are better for knives than 1095.

Like you said you don't need a 3V knife, but you want it. It is same for the others and modern steels are objectively better for knives. Knife is so much more than the steel, but this doesn't make all steels equal.

Part of the problem is that most makers don't optimize knife design to the steels used. They basically use the same geometry and just change the steel. In such scenarios modern steels can't show off their benefits fully. You would see the differences at the limits though.
 
Once upon a time even 6K Stellite was exotic. And SM-100. Now they are consigned to the dustbin of history. I personally like Damascus. I like the idea of it and the look of different Damascus patterns. I like carbon and SS Damascus. And I love Damasteel. So shoot me.
 
I remember buying a piece of that Stellite in the 80's and took it to a knifemaker friend to make me a knife and he laughed and laid it on a shelf and said sooo D2 or 154 cm. 😁
 
Locutus D'Borg said:
Once upon a time even 6K Stellite was exotic. And SM-100. Now they are consigned to the dustbin of history. I personally like Damascus. I like the idea of it and the look of different Damascus patterns. I like carbon and SS Damascus. And I love Damasteel. So shoot me.
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I agree. I like all kinds of blades. I have a matching set of Damascus Pakistani knives, a Bowie and a hunter folder with stag scales. They measure 55 - 60HRC at the edge bevels but I'm not sure what steel they are. I like them and I'm keeping them. I've had them about 10 years or so and there's not a speck of rust on them. I keep them oiled.

Damascus-3a.jpg
 
000Robert said:
But super-steels are here. Why not take advantage of them?
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I have nothing against them, I just already have 1095 knife and I doubt I would notice too much difference if I bought a more expensive knife. It never went dull on me in single day of use, it's extremely easy to sharpen, and I had no rust issues so far.

Biggest difference I'd notice is my wallet being lighter, and I'd maybe even be scared to really use something I paid that much.

I don't have 150€ to spend at the moment 😅
ace said:
I agree with the gist of your original post, but I feel like you are chiding others for what you are doing yourself. Objectively speaking and in absolute terms 3v is a better knife steel than 1095 in every category except ease of sharpening. Even ease of sharpening you disregard when saying that 3v sharpens easily on diamond stones as do many other steels that are also better than 1095 for knives. There are many, many excellent knives made out of 1095 class steels and if 1095 works for your use, that is great, but this in no way makes 1095 a good knife steel, just good enough. There are many steels that are just better for knives. Even without going to exotics 52100, AEB-L and even 1080+ or 80crv2 are better for knives than 1095.

Like you said you don't need a 3V knife, but you want it. It is same for the others and modern steels are objectively better for knives. Knife is so much more than the steel, but this doesn't make all steels equal.

Part of the problem is that most makers don't optimize knife design to the steels used. They basically use the same geometry and just change the steel. In such scenarios modern steels can't show off their benefits fully. You would see the differences at the limits though.
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Point of this thread is that they are trying to talk me into buying another EDC knife because there are way better options than 1095, while 1095 is good enough for me.

Striving for better is what is driving this industry, but we as regular people have to know when our desires and capabilities aren't really matching.

Being happy with small things really is a good thing if you are broke 🤣

But, the point of this thread is how people are quick to dismiss old steels completely over something they see or read online.

No doubt modern "super steels" are way better than old steels, but you still don't have to spend a fortune to have a good knife that will serve you well.

At the end of the day, a majority of people would always have newest and greatest super steels if they could afford them (myself included). But as I don't have spare money at the moment, I cannot justify splurging on a better knife that will bring me basically no noticeable difference in day to day use.
 
LostCause said:
I cannot justify splurging on a better knife that will bring me basically no noticeable difference in day to day use.
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It's not really "better" then, is it? :)

I agree. As I indicated in my previous post in this thread, the old-school steels work just as well as the flavor-of-the-week supersteels for 99% of my cutting and chopping requirements. For those requirements, I absolutely do not notice ANY difference in my choice of steel.

The remaining 1% of my requirements involve prolonged use with a requirement for edge retention. I concede that many of my premium steel knives will hold an edge far longer.
 
LostCause said:
I have nothing against them, I just already have 1095 knife and I doubt I would notice too much difference if I bought a more expensive knife. It never went dull on me in single day of use, it's extremely easy to sharpen, and I had no rust issues so far.

Biggest difference I'd notice is my wallet being lighter, and I'd maybe even be scared to really use something I paid that much.

I don't have 150€ to spend at the moment 😅

Point of this thread is that they are trying to talk me into buying another EDC knife because there are way better options than 1095, while 1095 is good enough for me.

Striving for better is what is driving this industry, but we as regular people have to know when our desires and capabilities aren't really matching.

Being happy with small things really is a good thing if you are broke 🤣

But, the point of this thread is how people are quick to dismiss old steels completely over something they see or read online.

No doubt modern "super steels" are way better than old steels, but you still don't have to spend a fortune to have a good knife that will serve you well.

At the end of the day, a majority of people would always have newest and greatest super steels if they could afford them (myself included). But as I don't have spare money at the moment, I cannot justify splurging on a better knife that will bring me basically no noticeable difference in day to day use.
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Super steels appeal disproportionately to the collector segment of knife consumers. Those whom focus on using knives as opposed to collecting them are less concerned. Then there is a third segment: collectors of budget knives. I fall into this last category. About 50% of my interest derives from use, and the remaining 50% is collector related. At some point I will probably break down and buy a CPM s35VN knife, but not sure when. Out of curiosity for the most part.
 
I'm sure the average Roman soldier had a "crappy steel" knife by our standards but had much more use, and needs for type of use (slicy, tough work, repeated constant use, detail work ect.) Every single day. Not saying there's no use for modern steels, hell I love owning them. But taking that into consideration, knocking someone else's use of an infinitely better steel than that soldier just because it isn't the absolute latest is kinda bullshit.
 
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