Bad Experience With Hdk1

"I found the ad and said i would take the knives.Someone then posted and said that was a heck of a deal on the GS. HDK1 then realized he undervalued the knives and decided to pull them three days after i said would take them.
Thats not how you do business."


The knives were posted f/s sale April 1st.What are we talking about here,over a month later you want to hold him to that ad that he could have easily forgotten about?
I hardly ever see something for sale that long.When I sell,if no one was interested the knives either get traded,go on ebay or I pull the ad and keep them.Once in awhile I forget to edit my ad. Anything can change in that pretty long time that elapsed.I'm sure that you had to search pretty deep to find the thread after over a months time,and he probably forgot to edit it,or let it be since it was buried probably at least several pages.
In anycase,The above quoted statement is a big assumption on your part as to what happend.Although it would be nice if HDK1 would jump in here in his defense,so we can all stop assuming.
How do you explain that he didn't answer your e-mails prior to "heck of a deal post" Why would he ignore your e-mails before he new that he undervalued the knives prompted by the other members post??
Now I'm not trying to argue for the sake of argueing here,or enjoy giving you a hard time.I'm just concerned to see someones rep being tarnished that may have a valid explanation.Does HDK1 even know this post exists,so he may chime in here?
 
Ok.This is my last post on this.Hurt feelings hardly.Just relaying a poor experince i had with HDK1.I assumed that's what this forum was for.And its not how i would have handled it, if i were selling the knives.And if i did pull the same stunt i would have expected the potential buyer to post the same about me. As far as the e-mails, we both have AOL so i can check the status of e-mails.
I guess i learned a couple of things though. Knives listed in the classified forum are just maybe for sale, depending on the whim of the seller.Saying you will buy a knife does'nt mean anything either.I think i'll go see what knives are for sale that i'm interested in, tell the seller i'll take it then e-mail him three days later saying i changed my mind.Cant wait for all th posts backing me up saying i did't do anything unethical.
 
You missed the point of what everyone is trying to say. I see that you are still here, so I'll make my point again. I see a knife for sale, I make a post in the thread and email the guy. I receive no confirmation on the thread I'm looking at, and receive no response email from the seller. Then, I find out that the seller removed the items for sale. Okay, yeah, it could be seen as a prick move on the sellers part to not respond on the post to me. If he saw my emails and didn't respond, then thats a prick move too.

However, you don't know for sure that he received your email. An online server can report all it wants, it doesn't mean he saw it. Another family member might have seen it.

If HDK1 had replied to you and offered to sell those knives, and later decided not to, I would agree with you whole heartedly and would take it into consideration when I trade with him.

I can understand that you feel slighted, but I don't see it that way in this case.

I do know that if you email sellers in these forums wanting to buy certain knives, and then decide not to get specific knives, without a valid reason(one seller has worked with me when I got into money troubles and I am very thankful to him), you will be named in the GBU forum again. Dealers are here to feed, clothe and house their kids. Collectors are here to have a good time, and make some money for their habits. Join us and have a good time, don't ruin the fun for yourself over nothing.
 
Sleyer, if you really want the knives, why not make an offer of their fair market value? Maybe he'll sell them if he gets what they're worth.

The way it sits right now, people could make an incorrect assumption that the only reason you're PO'd is because you didn't get the chance to take advantage of a guy who didn't know the value of what he was selling.
 
I think you guys are roughing up Sleyer a bit much here. I believe he's made some very valid points and am a bit confused by the strong contrary positions some have taken. I don't want to get into the point-counterpoint of this situation, but I do have a point to make....

A guy with a low post count like Sleyer get's no benefit of the doubt here and I think we ought to give him some. I think a person is well intentioned until he proves definitively otherwise. I also think people should keep their word even if they screwed up when they gave it. I have no doubt that hdk1 is a great guy that screwed it up a bit and I feel equally sure that Sleyer is a good guy with good intentions that legitimately feels he's been wronged. I bet that a bunch of you guys that have posted in this thread have had good experiences with hdk1 and none with Sleyer that may be partially influencing your positions.

I've had nothing but good experiences with everyone I've bought from on these forums and I've bought a lot in my short tenure here. I look forward to continued good deals and I hope the "comraderie" being shown to hdk1 doesn't have the unintended consequence of running off a good potential compadre like Sleyer.
 
silenthunterstudios said:
Do we have a link to the original ad posted by HDK1?

Found it

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=341365
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Thanks for providing the link, I gotta admit I don't see how HDK1 did anything wrong here. There was no acceptance and no contract of any form between them, prior to the withdrawal for whatever reason. The man just simply decided not to sell and I don't see that he has to give anyone a reason. Is there anywhere where he told the other party that he accepted his offer and then canceled it?
 
Slatts said:
I think you guys are roughing up Sleyer a bit much here. I believe he's made some very valid points and am a bit confused by the strong contrary positions some have taken. I don't want to get into the point-counterpoint of this situation, but I do have a point to make....

A guy with a low post count like Sleyer get's no benefit of the doubt here and I think we ought to give him some. I think a person is well intentioned until he proves definitively otherwise. I also think people should keep their word even if they screwed up when they gave it. I have no doubt that hdk1 is a great guy that screwed it up a bit and I feel equally sure that Sleyer is a good guy with good intentions that legitimately feels he's been wronged. I bet that a bunch of you guys that have posted in this thread have had good experiences with hdk1 and none with Sleyer that may be partially influencing your positions.

I've had nothing but good experiences with everyone I've bought from on these forums and I've bought a lot in my short tenure here. I look forward to continued good deals and I hope the "comraderie" being shown to hdk1 doesn't have the unintended consequence of running off a good potential compadre like Sleyer.
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I didn't even notice Sleyer's post count,didn't take it into consideration when replying to his thread here.Why should I give him the benefit of the doubt over the other member,based soley on his assumptions and jumping to conclusions? HDK1,doesn't deserve benefit of the doubt? I P.M.ed HDK1 in hopes he would respond here.It is apparant that no matter what I say,it will not change Sleyer's opinion,nor will he consider that he may be wrong about what happend.I was trying to suggest some other possibilities as to what may have transpired,since he has no proof to back up his claim of unethical business etiquette.Looking at this situation with an unbiased opinion,it really just looked to me like someone was pissed off at not being able to get an extrodinary price on some knives he wanted real bad.That is my honest observation,and I'm not the only that feels that may be the case.I'm sure Sleyer and HDK1 are both good people,and wish both of you luck in future dealings here at Bladeforums.
 
Slatts said:
I think you guys are roughing up Sleyer a bit much here.

A guy with a low post count like Sleyer get's no benefit of the doubt here and I think we ought to give him some.
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I do think that sleyer's intention was to warn other forum members of a situation that he felt needed to be brought to our attention. It is just that in my opinion he over reacted in stating that hdk1 had gone back on a deal. There never was a deal.

The lack of communication on hdk1's part is something that I would find very upsetting myself. To me, communication is a very important part of the deal making process. If what has happened to sleyer had happened to me, I would probably make the same decision not to do any further deals with hdk1 just like he did. However, I would not feel that I had been screwed out of a couple of knives that should have been mine. That would only be the case if HDK1 told me the knives were mine and then backed out of the deal. Even then I would just write it off as a deal gone bad and move on.

By the way, hdk1 has only been a member of Bladeforums for a couple of months and doesn't have much more of a post count than sleyer does. What has been posted here has nothing to do with supporting the long time member over the new guy.
 
Sleyer,

BTW I didn't mean to offend you with my previous post. "Hurt feelings" was probably a poor choice of words and I was not taking HDK1's side over yours. I don't know either of you.

The point to my original post was- It isn't a deal until both sides call it a deal.

I have emailed people on knives in the past within minutes of the knife being posted but didn't get them because someone, or several people, emailed even quicker than I did. Sometimes I got an email back letting me know, sometimes I found out because they changed their post to SOLD. That's just the way it goes.
 
sleyer said:
According to your analogy anyone can pull a knife from the classifieds
even after someone makes the commitment to buy.
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If you sent him money then you have commited to buy. You did not. So unless he responded to you he has the option as a seller to pull his knives if he wishes.
I think you're just bitter because you didn't get what you wanted and decide to stir the pot and ruin any chance this guy has should he decide to sell in the future.
 
K.V. Collucci said:
If you sent him money then you have commited to buy. You did not. So unless he responded to you he has the option as a seller to pull his knives if he wishes.
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Hmmm . . . Been doing deals around here for a few years now and I gotta admit to being a bit perplexed by those of you who agree with the above quote. On first glance, it seemed to me that, regarding the deal in question, it was HDK1's bad (minor in the grand scheme of things but a seeming breech of forum etiquette nonetheless).

Anyway, for future clarification sake, let me see if I understand how things are supposed to work around here.

So, on this "for sale" forum, a seller who posts an item(s) "For Sale" can do so without incurring any obligation to actually sell the item(s) in question regardless of whether or not a prospective buyer has expressed interest.
(And I'm not referring to a prospective buyer’s "offer" here but a transaction where the seller says, "for sale for "x" amount" and the buyer says "I'll take it.")

Seems that many here feel that the sellers "commitment" to actually complete a sale remains open-ended until the buyer receives a communication from the seller stating that he/she is willing to finalize the transaction in accordance with the terms the seller has already proposed. :confused:

IMHO, a "For Sale" post is a good faith commitment to sell just as an "I'll take it" post is a good faith commitment to buy. Both seller and buyer have the opportunity and obligation to consider other options prior to posting. Otherwise, a prospective buyer should have every right to back out of a deal without consequence if, after having thought it over or for whatever reason, he/she decides to rescind an agreement to buy.

Anything less seems strangely convoluted.
 
K.V. Collucci said:
If you sent him money then you have commited to buy. You did not. So unless he responded to you he has the option as a seller to pull his knives if he wishes.
I think you're just bitter because you didn't get what you wanted and decide to stir the pot and ruin any chance this guy has should he decide to sell in the future.
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You're kidding, right? So what you're saying is that there's really no deal until somebody shows the money? What the heck happened to "my word is my bond"?

I think this pot needed some stirring. Unfortunately for Sleyer, I think this thread has done more damage to his ability to move forward than he has done to hdk1.
 
As far as I am concerned a deal is a deal when both people have agreed to the deal. Money doesn't have to change hands, but there has to be an agreement by both parties that a deal has been struck.

Even when someone makes a deal with me to purchase one of my knives, I don't consider it locked in stone. If they contact me and tell me that something came up and they aren't going to be able to follow through on their part of the deal, then I'm okay with that. Life happens.
 
Keith Montgomery said:
As far as I am concerned a deal is a deal when both people have agreed to the deal.
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Yes! I agree completely. Here's my simplistic example....

Seller says, "Here's a knife that I want $125 for".

Buyer says, "I'll take it."

Bingo! and with that simple exchange both the buyer and seller have agreed to the deal. That's what happened here! They don't have to exchange any more information like their children's birthdays, favorite Star Wars episode, or the color of their mood rings to ensure the deal is done.

If either party backs wants to back out of the deal, they should only do so after asking permission of the other party. Most people will deal with the turn of events with aplomb, but they are not compelled to do so legally or ethically for that matter. I've seen many rulings at court hang in the balance based upon a verbal contract only. But there has to be some damage shown to the person requesting reparations. Sleyer has no had no real damage other than being pissed off at what he views as a bullshit/chickenshit (okay I said it) turn of events.

So that brings us to the first point made. Sleyer felt wronged. He posted his feelings. His feelings are real. HDK1 screwed up (and I hope he agrees that he did). And my point is this....IF YOU WANT TO SELL, BE ABSOLUTELY SURE THAT YOU WILL FOLLOW THROUGH ON THE DEAL WHEN YOU HAVE AN ACCEPTANCE OF YOUR SALE OFFER. I can't stand limp handshakes or wishy-washy traders and personally will not deal with people that exhibit either proclivity.
 
clearly this is a spurious complaint

regardless of whether you consider hdk1 wishy washy (or not) for withdrawing the sale, i commend him for his restraint in not replying to this lame thread and turning it into the typical "flame fest" these sort of threads usually degenerate into
 
NOTHING is written in stone UNTIL BOTH PARTIES come to a MUTUAL AGREEMENT!

THAT DID NOT HAPPEN, THUS, THE KNIVES BELONG TO HDK1 AND HE CAN DO WHATEVER HE SO CHOOSES WITH THEM!





negative16.jpg
:rolleyes:
 
bandaidman said:
clearly this is a spurious complaint

regardless of whether you consider hdk1 wishy washy (or not) for withdrawing the sale, i commend him for his restraint in not replying to this lame thread and turning it into the typical "flame fest" these sort of threads usually degenerate into
Click to expand...



:p :eek: :p :rolleyes: :p :eek: :p
 
OK, example number 30.

You walk into a store in the mall, any store, and tell a clerk that you want to buy item A.

Is item A yours? No. Does the store have to sell you item A? No. They do so because they want your money but most businesses reserve the right to serve who they want to serve. You may be able to cry discrimination but you had better be able to prove it.

If you buy something on eBay the seller isn't even required to sell it to you just because you bid on it, and even if you pay. They just can't keep the money if they decline the sale.

None of these situations are nice, but life isn't always nice. Now if a seller/retailer does this over and over they are cutting their own throats and people will stop doing business with them.

If sending an email gives a prospective buyer a "right" to the merchendise then what happens when two, three, four people email at once?

As has been said over and over again in this thread, what HDK1 did was not cool, but it was not unethical.

What about all the people that email me saying they want a knife I have posted for sale, but then change their minds? It hasn't happened often but it has happened to me and I haven't even sold a ton of stuff here.

I am not taking a side in this only trying to explain the situation as I (and apparently several other people) see it. The real point is that both parties involved here are new members and I am all for giving BOTH of them the benefit of the doubt here because nobody was hurt. Nobody got ripped off. Nobody broke a rule. If somebody was ripped off I would be all for an e-stoning of the offending individual, but otherwise I think this should have been worked out in emails between the parties involved.
 
Here goes, my post count is nil and has no bearing on the weight of my logic. Legally, nothing probably wrong with what hdk1 did. Ethically, makes him look like what I see the majority of our society slowly devolving into, an excuse making, mamby pamby, wishy washy, opportunistic person whose word means absolutely not a thing. Credibility and steadfast honesty and decency means occasionally taking the hit for your mistakes in an effort to save face in the long run, the decision to pull the knives w/out contacting the potential buyer was wrong and, in the long run, detrimental, and that's my two cents, not that it's worth that.
 
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