Bark River Knives... Heat Treat, Edge Retention and A2???

[meanwhile]

I will second this statement. Bark Rivers warranty isnt even in the same ballpark as ESEE and the Busse family of knives.

Nor do those companies encourage theri fan bois to attack people with broken knives. I remember a thread on knife forums where someone complained that being sent back a mutilated - the blade shape had no relation to the original - knife, and the idiots told him that he should be grateful that his knife was now "a custom".

None of them offered to buy it of course - because the thing was virtually bloody useless and he'd been cheated of $200.

 

[Big Mike]

I agree with the majority here and give Bark River Knives a thumbs-up. :thumbup:


I love their A2, and have often beat the hell out of some of their bigger blades.

Warranty issues have been handled professionally, with any shipping expenses refunded.

I have also used their Spa treatment to have a few blades refurbished, a very nice option.


I usually take a Bark River along when I know I'm going beat on a knife.





Big Mike

 

[Sulaco]

I guess I got in to the game late, after all the hoopla over poor QC and bad warranty experiences. I've had a dozen or so, and still own and use/daily carry 3 or 4 more and have only had to deal with Bark River once for a warranty issue.

I had a Bravo-1, rampless A2 which had some funky grinds on the pommel. It was basically ground a bit uneven one side to the other. The handle had a tad bit of "off-sidedness" overall. It wasn't bad and definitely didn't detract much from usefulness, but either psychologically, or realistically, I could tell a little in use. I never developed hotspots or anything, but I went ahead and shot mike a PM over on knifeforums.com anyway.

He immediately (it was around 11PM EST) responded and said to send it in attention him. Granted, it did take him some prodding to get around to messing with it, but he had one of his guys try to sort it out and decided it was better off replaced. He had a vendor send him one, checked it out and sent it to me. It's perfect in every way.

So I guess I'm one of those rare exceptions, but based on my experience, I can recommend Bark River without reservation.

 

[meanwhile]

I guess I got in to the game late, after all the hoopla over poor QC and bad warranty experiences. I've had a dozen or so, and still own and use/daily carry 3 or 4 more and have only had to deal with Bark River once for a warranty issue.

I had a Bravo-1, rampless A2 which had some funky grinds on the pommel. It was basically ground a bit uneven one side to the other. The handle had a tad bit of "off-sidedness" overall. It wasn't bad and definitely didn't detract much from usefulness, but either psychologically, or realistically, I could tell a little in use. I never developed hotspots or anything, but I went ahead and shot mike a PM over on knifeforums.com anyway.

Cynically, given that BKRT have refused to replace knives with much worse problems, one can't help wondering if you got a replacement because your faulty knife was one they could try to pass off on someone less discerning...

 

[CWL]

If you insist on expanding that: MS is a convicted felon with a reputation for encouraging his fan bois to attack people who report problems with his products, and a search of this forum will find a host of complaints from customers and his own dealers.

I don't understand why you keep going to this point. If he is, then he's paid for his crime and is working again in the world, running a company and selling products to people who like them.

I'm not a felon nor have been accused of any felonies, but I know there are others here who have paid for their earlier mistakes but who lead productive lives nowadays. You obviously have a personal issue with MS, but leave the "felon" part out of your attacks. I'm sure that you've done things in your past that you aren't proud of.

 

[Sulaco]

Cynically, given that BKRT have refused to replace knives with much worse problems, one can't help wondering if you got a replacement because your faulty knife was one they could try to pass off on someone less discerning...

My knife came from an authorized vendor. I don't believe it was some sort of second-hand reject. Of all the others I've owned or now own, this was the only one with any sort of issue and believe me, I'm super picky. Especially when money is involved.

I believe you have made your point, numerous times, even just in this thread. Perhaps it's time to move on?

 

[MatthewSB]

For every story about someone who was unhappy with warranty service from BRKT, there are thousands of people with fantastic knives who've had impressive service from BRKT.

Ignore those who have an unreasonable hatred of any knife company, they're not telling you the whole story.

Bark River makes custom quality knives that are beautiful and tough. I've tried for years to find something better, and cannot find a suitable replacement for my Bravo 1. It's the only sub $200 knife I've ever had that can handle whatever I need it to, from cutting down boxes to building a shelter, and look and feel sooooo good doing it.

I am thinking about picking up a bravo 1.5 in a2. I've had a few of their knives over the years with no complaints but remember hearing about heat treat and edge chipping issues. Any thoughts and/or experiences? Also how does their a2 hold up?

A2's edge retention, compared to 3V or S35VN, is lame, but it is very easy to sharpen. I use it when I want to be able to touch an edge up in the woods or on the trail.

3V's edge retention is incredible, but it is a bit more difficult to sharpen.

S35VN's edge retention is incredible, but it is incredibly hard to sharpen. I use it when I'm going anywhere near saltwater, or when I want a knife that stays shiny and doesn't patina from contact with my hands.

 

[Stickinc1]

There warranty is great, had chipping from an overly thin edge and they ground out the chip, resharpened it for me and shipped it back to canada no charge

 

[Will Power]

Have owned several, not had any issues with the steel (although some have arrived less than keen) at all.I believe their steel IS good.

However, when it comes to the handles, the fit&finish my experiences have sometimes not been satisfactory: Bocote peeling away from the tang after a year of careful use, pins falling out, stabilized wood with pits&holes in it (was rudely told it was part of the 'character' and if I must be difficult and picky then send it in ) I did send it in, got back a knife with completely different type of wood&colour, no explanation, gimping near enough ground off-badly, result not the knife I wanted or paid for, nor a knife I could ever sell or giveaway(too mutilated). The mantra about their warranty is rather compromised by this eternal refrain of "Send it in" sending them in appears to be rather frequent too....

Many of their knives are nice to look at as well, but I find most of them far too thick for my liking. I've moved on from BR, other knives I've found much more reasonable and you don't have to endure the fanboi fanfare either.

But, we all have different experiences and this is worth bearing in mind.

 

[meanwhile]

I don't understand why you keep going to this point. If he is, then he's paid for his crime and is working again in the world, running a company and selling products to people who like them.

I probably wouldn't if the felony was an isolated incident. But we both know that Jerry Fisk of all people has said MS ripped him off, and there have been complaints from dealers - and many, many complaints of warranty claims being settled less than fully. So when people say that he is a trustworthy guy, the answer is no - there is a consistent pattern of that to me indicates the need for caution.

You obviously have a personal issue with MS, but leave the "felon" part out of your attacks.

I have no personal problem - I've never met him, or corresponded with him, or even shared a thread with him. However, I do not like the way that he encourages his "fan base" (or at least tolerates) - and possibly paid shills -to attack people who have problems with BKRTs, so he lives on my NON-personal list of Bad People. When MS starts reigning fans in, and replaces/refunds on bad knives consistently, then this will change.

Oh - and he should probably pay Fisk (and I believe there are a good number of others) that money he owes if he wants people to really trust him.

I'm sure that you've done things in your past that you aren't proud of.

I've not committed a felony; I've not ripped America's possibly-greatest living knife maker; I haven't ripped off my own dealers; I don't promise a lifetime warranty on knives and interpret this as "I will butcher your mis-made knife to a stub and send it back to you"... I've not lived, really, have I?

 

[meanwhile]

Have owned several, not had any issues with the steel (although some have arrived less than keen) at all.I believe their steel IS good.

The A2 knives seem a reasonably safe buy... Well, I wouldn't buy one - but comparatively so. The 12c27s... a lot of evidence says "Stay away!"

However, when it comes to the handles, the fit&finish my experiences have sometimes not been satisfactory: Bocote peeling away from the tang after a year of careful use, pins falling out, stabilized wood with pits&holes in it (was rudely told it was part of the 'character' and if I must be difficult and picky then send it in ) I did send it in, got back a knife with completely different type of wood&colour, no explanation, gimping near enough ground off-badly, result not the knife I wanted or paid for, nor a knife I could ever sell or giveaway(too mutilated). The mantra about their warranty is rather compromised by this eternal refrain of "Send it in" sending them in appears to be rather frequent too.....

People who let bugs and dirt get in epoxy are not going to be scrupulous about sourcing dried-out wood and competently stablized woods - especially when they cost more. The other problem with BKRTs are the reports of chipped edges, which are probably due to over-aggressive post HT grinding - a grinding wheel can do a lot of damage just in final sharpening.

Again, it is a shame because BKRT do make perhaps the prettiest production knives, usually with good handle designs. But this whole thing of extreme loyalty from fans is just silly and wearing: BKRT is a company that makes knives, not a spiritual or political movement. Distorting reality in their favour to write off a litany of complaints and to claim that one of the least useful warranties in the knife industry is the absolute best is just bizarre.

 

[tiogatires]

Soooo, now all of a sudden the haters show up?

 

[CWL]

So when people say that he is a trustworthy guy, the answer is no - there is a consistent pattern of that to me indicates the need for caution.

Then just say that you think MS is untrustworthy.

 

[tiogatires]

Just an FYI, I have searched the forums here and really didn't find too much. I did, however find a ton of very positive reviews online in regards to the Bravo 1.5. Please expand on your posts as I am interested in hearing it. Please though, no bashing or hating for the sake of it. If you don't like the brand explain why!

 

[meanwhile]

Quote Originally Posted by meanwhile View Post
So when people say that he is a trustworthy guy, the answer is no - there is a consistent pattern that to me indicates the need for caution.
Then just say that you think MS is untrustworthy.

So.... you think that an unsupported accusation is better than facts, logic, applied to those facts, and evidence..? I think we have very different value systems here!

 

[meanwhile]

Just an FYI, I have searched the forums here and really didn't find too much. I did, however find a ton of very positive reviews online in regards to the Bravo 1.5. Please expand on your posts as I am interested in hearing it. Please though, no bashing or hating for the sake of it. If you don't like the brand explain why!

What do you want me to expand on? I don't think anything more needs saying on the warranty, which is my main objection. It's this simple: a warranty should mean if you get a bad knife, you get your money back or a good knife of the model you paid for. Grinding down a bowie to a stilletto and returning it to the customer is NOT a warranty, it's adding insult to injury. For other stuff like build problems you might be better off watching this and reading the comments:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X3RmYD3_DMk

As for the Bravo, it's pretty and possibly useful, but it was the Rogue River I was going to buy when I did my background checks and decided BRKT wasn't a company to be trusted. A real shame, because the knife merges usability and respect for genuine history in an imaginative and unique way in the bowie market.

 

[tiogatires]

I don't even know Jerry Fisk or fis...

 

[Luis G.]

Didn't really want to post but about 7 months ago~ I bought a Bravo 1.5 in S35VN.
Had horrible grinds and the edge was being damaged too quickly, dealer told me to talk to BRKT. I got handed me not a very talk explaining to me that every knife owner should know how to sharpen a knife otherwise why own a knife, and that I would have to remove material because it was probably overground when they sharpened it. If I take the time to repair it, I would grow a bond to like the knife and love it.

I explained to them that I had bought the knife new not even 2 days earlier, there wasn't much to love because the knife's grinding was completely off, and the edge was botched to heck. I could understand if I had used it extensively, all I did was make about 3 little tinder sticks, with 3 cuts before the edge chipped, and rolled. That knife cost me close to $300...
They never offered to look at, or repair, or replace the knife and hung up on me telling me they can't help me despite me keeping cool and calm about their botched up knife.

I talked to the dealer, and was refunded by them promptly. They complained to me about them sometimes having to take back knives more frequently than other makers because BRKT would refuse warranty.

 

[Dan57]

Soooo, now all of a sudden the haters show up?

The haters, (who refuse to acknowledge that a company can do anything right,) are just as bad as the fanboys (who refuse to acknowledge that a company can do anything wrong.)
I don't have anything personal against Mike Stewart, and I respect him because of his skill as a designer and knowledge of the knife industry. But it really bugs me when people simply refuse to believe the multiple, reliable accounts detailing the s*!t he's pulled in the past. What's wrong with enjoying the knives while still acknowledging that the man and company behind them are less than perfect?

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...nyone-have-any-problems-with-Bark-River/page5
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...k-Jack-knives-I-could-not-talk-about-til-now-
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/585934-Bark-River-has-taken-16-000-of-My-Money
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/687173-Whats-the-truth-about-the-Bravo-1

 

[CWL]

So.... you think that an unsupported accusation is better than facts, logic, applied to those facts, and evidence..? I think we have very different value systems here!

You mean like when you call him a felon when you tell people that BRKT won't honor their warranty?

Where is the relevance?

At most, shoddy business practices would be a civil matter, not criminal. So what does a past felony have to do with your argument?