BCMW ht 3V chopping tests

BCMW 20160702 ht results

CPM-M4 69rc - https://www.alphaknifesupply.com/zdata-bladesteelC-M4.htm

Elmax 65rc - https://www.alphaknifesupply.com/Pictures/Info/Steel/Elmax-Typical.gif

S110V 65.5rc - https://www.alphaknifesupply.com/Pictures/Info/Steel/CPMS110V-DS.pdf

CTS-XHP 67.5rc - https://www.alphaknifesupply.com/zdata-bladesteelS-CTSXHP.htm
*14dps - passed whittle AB & bone but loupe level micro chips on nail

CPM 10V 69.5rc - https://www.alphaknifesupply.com/zdata-bladesteelC-A11.htm

edges to be tested...

edit to add:
rTAjiZZ.jpg
 
Last edited:
Thanks, Chris!

LOL, I've a pile of 52100 & W2 prepared (ready for hardening) blanks in that profile. Feel great in hand and aggressive cutting.

Chris "Anagarika";16240922 said:
Luong, M4 at 69 HRC?!!! You keep surprising us! :eek:

I like the new profile of Elmax & M4. Looks like a SUV ;)
Click to expand...
 
What is this 2-4.5rc over mfg's max hrc mean?

Now take a leap of trust - otherwise, exit thread here & write off, done wasting time.

bluntcut said:
BCMW 20160702 ht results
CPM-M4 69rc - https://www.alphaknifesupply.com/zdata-bladesteelC-M4.htm
Elmax 65rc - https://www.alphaknifesupply.com/Pictures/Info/Steel/Elmax-Typical.gif
S110V 65.5rc - https://www.alphaknifesupply.com/Pictures/Info/Steel/CPMS110V-DS.pdf
CTS-XHP 67.5rc - https://www.alphaknifesupply.com/zdata-bladesteelS-CTSXHP.htm
*14dps - passed whittle AB & bone but loupe level micro chips on nail
CPM 10V 69.5rc - https://www.alphaknifesupply.com/zdata-bladesteelC-A11.htm
...
Click to expand...

In my other threads, I posted about weaving matrix and talked about hardness relative to macro & nano indentation test. Once matrix in ideal condition where nano hardness is not far off from macro hardness, other things just fall in place.

For high alloy steels, RA (retained austenite) is a symptom of dis-ordered (high dislocation and lousy structure) matrix. I believe BCMW current ht produces 90+% ideal matrix, consequentially RA now estimated to be less than 3%. Also this matrix will strengthen embedding of carbide, preventing commonly seen premature carbide pop-out/fall-off.

Not too late to take the blue pill... :p

*** Invitation ***
1) 2 knife makers/nuts near Santa Barbara (must be at least 2 but no more than 3)
2) bring knives with known hrc, some sharpening gear and hard to whittle materials (desert ironwood, hinges, etc...)
3) hrc test file if have it

Meet me at Goleta Beach. Have fun cutting stuff with my R&D blades(maybe the beach itself - sand LOL). Of course, try to sharpen it afterward :thumbup:

With consent of all parties - video & share this event.
 
Last edited:
bluntcut said:
Thanks. I've tested zwear & spectrumwear here & there but not with my latest ht yet. High alloy steels with low carbon% are not on my radar now and foreseeable future.
Click to expand...

Understood. Thats sad, because it would be so nice to see a concrete difference between those "super tough" steels.

Good job anyway!
 
I shot a video testing edges of high alloy steels with high rc but 'DOH!' now I know once the camera in the sun for ~14 minutes - it lost focus due to over heating. A whopping 29 minutes video but half is fuzzy :grumpy:

Toward the end of the video - I whittle thin metal tube. Here is the closeup

sfHaPSx.jpg


29 minutes video ... uploaded.

CPM154 65.5rc, 20CV 65rc, CPM 10V 69.5rc, CTS-XHP 67.5rc
CPM Rex 121 67.5rc, S100V 65rc, CPM M4 69rc, Elmax 65rc

Whittle: oak, bamboo, lignum vitae argentine (LVA)
Chop: oak, LVA

Thanks for watching & listening and comments.

https://youtu.be/b21Rg8D97Ig
 
Last edited:
8670 steel - https://www.alphaknifesupply.com/zdata-bladesteelC-8670.htm

First ht attempt got only ~60rc - considered as fail ht.

Today ht - got 64rc yay!

Chuck @ Alpha Knife Supply didn't give me a freebie - more like a beat up me for free deal:p Chopped thick aluminum & thin metal tube for ~7 minutes - edge got dulled but hey where are those micro chips. '10 minutes later' of abusive lousy chopping technique against 5 gals bucket handle. Wow one strong & tough steel.

rDDGj38.jpg
 
I knew this steel is tough but too soft for my liking. However at 64rc in spite of high strength, its toughness surprised me. A quick chip making chops turned into hardest swing session I can muster - the metal backing jumped off the wood chopping stump almost every single strike. I am sure my lousy swing with a lot of lateral generated those chips but I am glad to be done (after another 5-10 more chops). Now, I am curious how my 67rc W2 would compare to this 8670 blade at chopping this hardened wire.

Twindog said:
Thank you for these tests, Luong. Amazing information.
Click to expand...
 
BCMW's ht attributes above that you have read/watched (whilst keeping a healthy rational skepticism) are based on my Crystal Weaving Foundation(CWF). CFW has graduated into a small contribution to science. It will open a door to go outside of the current industry ht box/room - a broad area and depth to be explored by all of you.

Science Freedom - details of CFW 'how' & 'why' are to be widely presented and it should be easily replicated & applied. Applicability will stretch across the entire steel industry, as cutlery/edge-tool is a sector in it.

Best regards,
==Luong
 
Science Freedom - details of CFW 'how' & 'why' are to be widely presented and it should be easily replicated & applied. Applicability will stretch across the entire steel industry, as cutlery/edge-tool is a sector in it.
Click to expand...

Luong - I'm so looking forward to learning a few details on this fabled CFW HT method. As I mentioned to you in comment on YouTube video, I'm really looking forward to trying this method myself using AEB-L and DI.

KEEP UP THE GREAT WORK!!!

Ken H>
 
I was able to watch it OK. It was a VERY IMPRESSIVE demo of 3V at 65 hardness. I am in Arroyo Grande about 100 miles north of Santa Barbara.
I could make it down to Goleta Beach. I am in the middle of an eucalyptus tree area and when the wood dries and ages it is REALLY tough to cut.
I have multiple axes and a maul to cut and split the wood but it is a lot of work to do it. I do not wish to destroy any of my big chopper knives on
the eucalyptus.
 
Ok,you can tell the blade edge was way thin from the bending of the edge at 12:28 min it was very noticeable. The good thing is that there is no chipping. I would love to see a little more metal behind the edge to see how the steel reacts to pure compression impact, instead of the flex that it obviously got from these impacts. It should hold up considerably better.
 
Spot on:thumbup:

I use ripple & chips to infer into matrix microstructure. My assessed/extrapolated this blade might be at border line of RA% from optimal range.

Cobalt said:
Ok,you can tell the blade edge was way thin from the bending of the edge at 12:28 min it was very noticeable. The good thing is that there is no chipping. I would love to see a little more metal behind the edge to see how the steel reacts to pure compression impact, instead of the flex that it obviously got from these impacts. It should hold up considerably better.
Click to expand...
 
There are quite a few fallen dried eucalyptus trees in my area. Dried eucalyptus wood is hard+dense and bindy tough.

Right now, I only have 65rc W2, 65rc D2 and few older generation choppers on hand. I'll do some more testing soon, maybe I will post a public invite in this thread http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/1409721-Heat-Treatment-Crystal-Weaving-Foundation
It would be fun for one or 2 of you to collect a small BCMW test blade.

Area FiftyOne said:
I was able to watch it OK. It was a VERY IMPRESSIVE demo of 3V at 65 hardness. I am in Arroyo Grande about 100 miles north of Santa Barbara.
I could make it down to Goleta Beach. I am in the middle of an eucalyptus tree area and when the wood dries and ages it is REALLY tough to cut.
I have multiple axes and a maul to cut and split the wood but it is a lot of work to do it. I do not wish to destroy any of my big chopper knives on
the eucalyptus.
Click to expand...
 
bluntcut said:
Spot on:thumbup:

I use ripple & chips to infer into matrix microstructure. My assessed/extrapolated this blade might be at border line of RA% from optimal range.
Click to expand...

I am one of those that thinks that lower Rc can actually hurt the toughness of some knife steels. The S steels and the chipper steels tend to want to mash on impact. Steels like that can perform much better at higher Rc, where they resist chipping even at high Rc but don't mash much. Problem is when they let go, they really go. Of course without an enhanced HT it is irrelevant. This is where you and Nathan are pushing things. Sure makes for great reading. I will probably read this thread over several times to get all of the information within it. good stuff
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top