Bearings VS Washers

You know, it's all like "proving" so-and-so is the "best steel," which somebody seems to try once in a while.

They always have some cockamamie "experiment" or bar graph. Same thing here.

Really, if you have a side on the bearings vs washer debate, great! Share it. Argue for it! That's exactly what we do here. (I like turtles.)

But don't come in here with your "proof" unless you are hard core, know what a controlled experiment is, and are ready for some serious peer reviewers crawling up you butt. Like a guy like @Ankerson is. Or like Spyderco went for with their Mule series...they are "for" controlled experimenting.
 
Let's begin by defining what basically an experiment is..

Take a look at the steps of the scientific method:

  1. Make observations.
  2. Formulate a hypothesis.
  3. Design and conduct an experiment to test the hypothesis.
  4. Evaluate the results of the experiment.
  5. Accept or reject the hypothesis.
  6. If necessary, make and test a new hypothesis.
Based on this simplistic description the op only fulfilled the first one, an observation was made. I worked in the semiconductor industry for many years and one of our problems was when we shipped overseas the lexan and plexiglass doors would get hazy by the time they received and unpacked the parts for assembly.

I wanted to know why so I took dozens of equal sized pieces of plexiglass and lexan some were stored out in the open, some stored in the open after cleaning with DI water, some after cleaning with each of the different cleaners used. Then we wrapped some in stretch wrap, some after using cleaners, some immediately after cleaning some after waiting to completely dry before wrapping. Some stored in a warehouse, some in a clean room and even some in an unheated warehouse. It took me a week to prep for the experiment and a week prior to write it all out to insure what I did was repeatable by anyone and would give the same results.

What I found out was the guys wrapping the benches were wiping the lexan and plexiglass with di water and immediately wrapping the plastic in stretch wrap. Now as best as I remember since this was 20 years ago and I was no scientist and had to have it explained to me after I showed my results to engineering, the environment of the di water would pull ions from both the stretch wrap and the lexan acting as a medium and over time the polished clear plastic would develop a haze the more the ions got pulled into the di water, he said kinda like a chrome bumper pits and oxidizes over time given the right conditions.

I woulda had more respect for the post had the OP said I stuck 3 knives in a bunch of different stuff and I think this is what happened. His cardboard notations mean nothing, how fine is fine, how fine is extra, extra fine? Also he'd have been more interesting had he at least replied once.

You can say all he wants to do is share info but one sided and without responding to any comments or questions is not sharing or opening up discussion. It's sayin' "..this is what I think and I don't have to prove anything to anybody or answer any questions, if you don't agree, too bad."

That type of posting does less for this community and hobby than questioning the validity of someones comment and supposed "test/experiment" results.

Now I'm no scientist or engineer, just a lowly mechanic who got to deal with the end results of other people's supposed theories and experiments. I know what I like to see in an experimet, lots of relative data and pics, explanations of how the end results were achieved and the ability to reproduce the identical results myself as I don't put much faith in scientists and engineers anyway ;) .
 
I guess I'm not so interested in proving one is better than the other. Which is better doesn't mean anything to me. It just gets frustrating when you see people who have admittedly never used a knife equipped with bearings condemn them with overwhelming conviction. Often saying the users just look at their knives. IMHO that is the ONLY merit the tests (term used loosely M marcinek ) in this thread have. That bearings may not be as detrimental to a knife as some may imply.
 
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PURPLEDC said:
I guess I'm not so interested in proving one is better than the other. Which is better doesn't mean anything to me. It just gets frustrating when you see people who have admittedly never used a knife equipped with bearings condemn them with overwhelming conviction. Often saying the users just look at their knives. IMHO that is the ONLY merit the tests (term used loosely M marcinek ) in this thread have. That bearings may not be as detrimental to a knife as some may imply.
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I have both, use both and like both, the only bearing I ever had a problem with was the CRKT Ripple, the IKBS set up with the hidden stop pin on the ripple doesn't fair well with lint and other soft materials that get caught in the recess for the stop pin and There's no way to get it out without disassembling the knife. On the other knives you can clear the path to the stop pin and the back if the tang. On the Ripple the lint prevents the blade from opening completely and the liner lock can't fully engage but that wasn't a bearing failure. Again I own and use both and see the advantages of each but I'm not throwin' out any "empirical" evidence and claiming it's anything other than an unproven opinion.

Now there's nothin' wrong with opinions as long as they're presented that way and not as some type of fact based conclusion.
 
I have decided that I am right, and y'all are wrong.

I'm not sure exactly what I'm right about, but because it's me, I must be right, which means y'all are wrong.

I'm sorry it has to be that way, but because I'm the greatest being to walk the earth, it can be no other way.

Now, back to shopping at trolls 'r us.
 
both work in the right applications of my typical use. thats all i care about.
 
T. Erdelyi said:
I have both, use both and like both, the only bearing I ever had a problem with was the CRKT Ripple, the IKBS set up with the hidden stop pin on the ripple doesn't fair well with lint and other soft materials that get caught in the recess for the stop pin and There's no way to get it out without disassembling the knife. On the other knives you can clear the path to the stop pin and the back if the tang. On the Ripple the lint prevents the blade from opening completely and the liner lock can't fully engage but that wasn't a bearing failure. Again I own and use both and see the advantages of each but I'm not throwin' out any "empirical" evidence and claiming it's anything other than an unproven opinion.

Now there's nothin' wrong with opinions as long as they're presented that way and not as some type of fact based conclusion.
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I think you missed the part where im infallable, walk on water and my opinion becomes written fact before i even know what that opinion is . :D Seriously though i get what you are saying. My comment wasnt aimed at someone like you who actually forms an opinion through first hand experience. I respect that even if we dont agree. You know the type im thinking of though. The guy with three days membership. Creates a thread slamming this or that because his vast knowlwedge of nothing doesnt paint an immediately clear picture. And instead of experimenting they just create a rally cry thread condemning something expecting everyone to acknowledge their epiphany as knife knowledge supremacy just because they brainstormed for ten minutes on the can. The only interesting thing being that their brainstorming and squatting produced the same end product. :poop: :D
 
Mo2 said:
haters and trolls. its the way you are posting and its ruining it for the rest of us.

if you want to dispute it, tell everyone how it should be done, and DO IT YOURSELF to prove it instead of bashing and trolling.

The take away is that the guy that did the experiment found that he prefers bearings as its easier for maintenance as he found out first hand with the test he did for himself.

its like we must all be MIT scientist or from nasa to do anything.

i think the take away from it from my perspective is that, one is not better than the other, but that ball bearings are not as bad as most people make them out to be, especially for getting sand etc in the pivot and maintenance. nothing more than that.
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Unfortunately you are wasting your breath w these people .they get off on this stuff and then they go and giggle about it together . It's unfortunate because it can turn off the newbies. We want newcomers to stay so this forum gets bigger and better. I think some of these guys have been here so long they are just doing this out of sheer boredom and or lack of imagination. Sorry to hijack, I honestly like both bearings and washers ,can you believe it!!!
 
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PURPLEDC said:
I think you missed the part where im infallable, walk on water and my opinion becomes written fact before i even know what that opinion is . :D Seriously though i get what you are saying. My comment wasnt aimed at someone like you who actually forms an opinion through first hand experience. I respect that even if we dont agree. You know the type im thinking of though. The guy with three days membership. Creates a thread slamming this or that because his vast knowlwedge of nothing doesnt paint an immediately clear picture. And instead of experimenting they just create a rally cry thread condemning something expecting everyone to acknowledge their epiphany as knife knowledge supremacy just because they brainstormed for ten minutes on the can. The only interesting thing being that their brainstorming and squatting produced the same end product. :poop: :D
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I read somewhere on the internet that you are a poopoo head Purple. It must be true, it was right there on Wikipedia.

I like bearings, I like washers. No denying bearings are generally smoother. There are knives with washers that are every bit as smooth as my bearing knives. My BM 940, Onslaught, and Hogues come to mind.

So the question is more is it worth it to use bearings? The answer is probably why not?
 
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