Benchmade does not condone the Ganzo rip off of the Axis lock!

[shinyedges]

We're going to need a tally system to keep up with how many times duane is wrong LOL

duane your nit picking over the patent is pointless... this thread isn't about patents it is about claims and statements you made that turned out to be as true as the letter C is straight... acknowledge you made some statements that were wack and move on... as a wise man once said..

"read more and post less"

 

[craytab]

https://www.google.com/patents/US57...ved=0CBsQ6AEwAGoVChMIq7_m2PLWyAIVyeMmCh3N_wKW

Your number is a continuation. Not a patent number. Read the paragraph after description. Notice the priority date is still 1996.

You gave us a continuation number after the maintenance fee was paid. The patent number to the continuation number you gave is still the same. It does not update the patent fresh and new to 2010.

That number is not a patent number or an application number.

It's on the knife and it leads to the most current information on the patent and it does give them new patent protection starting at the filling date (2010). You also said I showed a patent for a lock BM doesn't use and then you claim it is not a patent. Well which is it? Oh, and they clearly use it.

We're going to need a tally system to keep up with how many times duane is wrong LOL

I count that as at least strike five and that is just in this thread, hell two in his last post.

 

[shinyedges]

I count that as at least strike five and that is just in this thread, hell two in his last post.

there are quite a few in the 5160 thread too... he might be up to... just throwing a number out there.. 15.. LOL

 

[Duane Sanders]

I don't know and don't care what his motivation is, honestly.

I just see someone making a claims not backed up by evidence (that it would cost less than the tooling for one line to squash this Chinese company through the legal system), and also making a claim that is contradicted by evidence that he gave himself.

Its odd.

Whatever. Dude wants to buy knives with "shady" locks...that's on him, not anybody else. Free country.

No motivation fellow knife user. We both have the same goal. I just don't trust it is a copy. Just because someone online says its a rip off copy illegal don't mean anything. They told me they go after people who copy it, and do not go after similar designs that are not a copy.

Why would they go after others, and let another slide? I got that answer straight from them.

I have no problem with his opinion but his opinion is not law and obviously is not Benchmades opinion. He is free to fund a legal pursuit against any and everyone who uses the similar locks benchmade does not go after. Like Shirogorov and Ganzo, atleast Ganzo does not lie and say they have a licensed version. Benchmade made it clear they do not license anyone to use it.

From other people's history here it looks like more of a geopolitical thing than a patent violation issue. If not they would be as furious that Shirogorov uses a similar design. One they lie about having a license to do so.

On a very side note I was talking to my brother about this and he has hundreds of knives. He never heard of the Ganzo so he ordered half a dozen of their axis lock knives and gave me one to run through the ringer. I've had it 5 days now. It's been used pretty hard so far. Only quality flaw is the pivot screw loosens quick. Fixed that with loctite the first day. It's been solid since.

I am not being easy on it. If I get a failure or some sort or flaw shows up I will let everyone know in a new thread. If you never hear about it you will be safe to assume it's doing very well under above average hard use. The steel in the blade does out class the Rat 1. Earlier this week visiting my son we worked on some fat wood for fire starting, the rat1 developed a nice chip in the edge. G10 scales on the 727 are grippier than the FRN rat1 scales.

 

[B.F.U]

Personally I see no ethical dilemma whatsoever about functional low-cost replicas, they aren't exactly flooding the market, they're competing with $10-$30 knives and not the $75-$300 knives real Benchmades are judged against, it's not even Benchmade's design, the lock is now pushing twenty years old, and the Ganzos I've seen really do stand up to other lower cost folders.

I greatly appreciate having the option to buy from a line of knives that use the lock I am most comfortable with and have obvious cost-cutting measures that I am ok with, such as the unmilled liners, heavy omega springs, sometimes sharp jimping, and lack of Loctite.

I like that a lot more than most of what's available from 'American' manufacturers in that price range. Most of the time it's outsourced if it's under a hundred bucks anyway, so what's the point in nutfluffing over whether someone buys a replica of a knife that's still in production?

I'll take one of a few Ganzos over a Gerber, CRKT, or even a Cold Steel any day.

Them's dangerous words here, pal. People love intellectual property rights.

Not trying to add anything to this argument than the fact that I'm amazed this post hasn't received negative reactions.

 

[Duane Sanders]

We're going to need a tally system to keep up with how many times duane is wrong LOL

duane your nit picking over the patent is pointless... this thread isn't about patents it is about claims and statements you made that turned out to be as true as the letter C is straight... acknowledge you made some statements that were wack and move on... as a wise man once said..

"read more and post less"

I like you. Straight to the point.

That other guy. All he has to do is look at the text where the number he gave is not an application number or a patent number. The patent date still stands at 1996 no matter what he says. He claims there is a patent for 2010 and there just may well be one. He just needs to find it first. Then post it.

 

[marcinek]

Why would they go after others, and let another slide? I got that answer straight from them.

Yes, the ones that they feel are not in violation they do not pursue. But there are ones in violation, that they are only able to pursue a few of. Read your own post.

And what does your testing of one of these Ganzos have to do with anything?

Honestly, it sounds like all of this is just convincing yourself that this is all OK.

Really, you don't have to publicly convince yourself of anything ... why bother? You think what they are doing is OK? Good for you.

And you don't seem to be doing a great job of convincing anybody else its OK.

To each his own I guess.

 

[Duane Sanders]

It's on the knife and it leads to the most current information on the patent and it does give them new patent protection starting at the filling date (2010). You also said I showed a patent for a lock BM doesn't use and then you claim it is not a patent. Well which is it? Oh, and they clearly use it.




http://www.google.com/patents/USRE41259


I count that as at least strike five and that is just in this thread, hell two in his last post.

It is not a patent number as stated in the description

DESCRIPTION
This application is a 371 of PCT/US98/07509 filed Apr. 14, 1998 which is a continuation-in-part of Ser. No. 08/679,122 Jul. 12, 1996 now U.S. Pat. No. 5,737,841.

Note the patent number. Then look at the patent date.

Publication number USRE41259 E1
Publication type Grant
Application number US 11/147,469
PCT number PCT/US1998/007509
Publication date Apr 27, 2010
Filing date Apr 14, 1998
Priority date Jul 12, 1996
Fee status Paid
Also published as EP1071546A1, 7 More »
Inventors William J. McHenry, Jason L. Williams
Original Assignee Mentor Group Llc
Export Citation BiBTeX, EndNote, RefMan
Patent Citations (50), Referenced by (17), Classifications (5), Legal Events (2)
External Links: USPTO, USPTO Assignment, Espacenet

Notice on top where it says publication number. It's not a patent or application number.

 

[craytab]

No motivation fellow knife user. We both have the same goal. I just don't trust it is a copy. Just because someone online says its a rip off copy illegal don't mean anything. They told me they go after people who copy it, and do not go after similar designs that are not a copy.

Benchmade says it is a copy. They just didn't tell you it was a copy because you didn't ask about it. Once again Duane, just because BM doesn't go after Ganzo (they can't very easily) does not mean it is not a copy. You logic here is extremely flawed and it has been pointed out many times by several people. To not admit it is a copy is a disservice to this community and extremely Naive.

Why would they go after others, and let another slide? I got that answer straight from them.

That has been explained to you. Why not go ask BM? You don't believe any of us. And no, you didn't get an answer from BM about this specific issue, you inferred it.

I have no problem with his opinion but his opinion is not law and obviously is not Benchmades opinion.

It is Benchmade's opinion. You are now just lying to cover u[p the embarrassing reality that you are wrong.

Why not provide your correspondence with Benchmade for us? You can forward it to me or post it here. Let's see what they really told you.

I like you. Straight to the point.

That other guy. All he has to do is look at the text where the number he gave is not an application number or a patent number. The patent date still stands at 1996 no matter what he says. He claims there is a patent for 2010 and there just may well be one. He just needs to find it first. Then post it.

Duane, the number is on the blade and takes you right to the most current information on the patent. That is a done issue. You need to back up what you are claiming because it is exactly 100% counter to what Benchmade has said.

 

[craytab]

Note the patent number. Then look at the patent date.



Notice on top where it says publication number. It's not a patent or application number.

It is clear you will argue about the most trivial issue. The number is on the blade Duane. What ever it is it takes you to the most current information on the patent. To deny otherwise is silly and it is distracting from all the other falsehoods you are claiming here.

 

[kniferbro]

This thread serves nothing but to start a fight and call someone out. People are wrong on the Internet all the time. Best to just move on.

Haven't you gotten upset because certain threads about ZT are "just to stir the pot?"

 

[craytab]

This thread serves nothing but to start a fight and call someone out. People are wrong on the Internet all the time. Best to just move on.

Haven't you gotten upset because certain threads about ZT are "just to stir the pot?"

This is to clear up inaccurate information spread that tries to legitimize the copying of the axis lock. If Duane doesn't want to keep getting called out he can stop saying things that are not true. I'm sure this will get locked soon anyway but I am happy I was able to prove the truth here.

 

[kniferbro]

This is to clear up inaccurate information spread that tries to legitimize the copying of the axis lock. If Duane doesn't want to keep getting called out he can stop saying things that are not true. I'm sure this will get locked soon anyway but I am happy I was able to prove the truth here.

You're right Craytab, it's best to have the true info out there. I just thought a whole thread dedicated to it was a bit much. It is however 4:30 and I am a bit cranky at work. Sorry if I was a bit rude...

 

[Duane Sanders]

Double, my bad

 

[Duane Sanders]

It is clear you will argue about the most trivial issue. The number is on the blade Duane. What ever it is it takes you to the most current information on the patent. To deny otherwise is silly and it is distracting from all the other falsehoods you are claiming here.

No. I am reading the facts.

I want to see a patent number or application date for 2010.

Now this is what's going to show exactly what your motivation is on this issue. I want a straight to the point comment from you on the Shirogorov T100NS. They say they have a licensed axis lock on that knife. BM mad it very clear they license to no one.

Forget about the Ganzo for now. Let's focus on another criminal knife manufacturer. After all the topic is the axis lock and how you say even look a likes are a violation of a patent.

Let us know what you think about Shirogorov T100NS axis lock.

As I said before. A publication number is not an application or patent number. I already have shown you this.

Do you have that 2010 application or patent number!

 

[trevitrace]

Boris?

 

[craytab]

No. I am reading the facts.

I want to see a patent number or application date for 2010.

Now this is what's going to show exactly what your motivation is on this issue. I want a straight to the point comment from you on the Shirogorov T100NS. They say they have a licensed axis lock on that knife. BM mad it very clear they license to no one.

Forget about the Ganzo for now. Let's focus on another criminal knife manufacturer. After all the topic is the axis lock and how you say even look a likes are a violation of a patent.

Let us know what you think about Shirogorov T100NS axis lock.

As I said before. A publication number is not an application or patent number. I already have shown you this.

Do you have that 2010 application or patent number!

You are not reading facts. You are in the least inferring inaccuracies and at the worst lying just to argue. I have nothing to prove to you. In fact it is quite the opposite.

Boris?

Not even one r-bomb or a "son". Doubtful he could change his ways so much.

 

[craytab]

You're right Craytab, it's best to have the true info out there. I just thought a whole thread dedicated to it was a bit much. It is however 4:30 and I am a bit cranky at work. Sorry if I was a bit rude...

No worries :thumbup:

 

[shinyedges]

Also not one mention of schrade or how other people don't use their knives so every one is a p****

You are not reading facts. You are in the least inferring inaccuracies and at the worst lying just to argue. I have nothing to prove to you. In fact it is quite the opposite.



Not even one r-bomb or a "son". Doubtful he could change his ways so much.

 

[craytab]

Also not one mention of schrade or how other people don't use their knives so every one is a p****

Also true.