Best Folder for SD <=6 oz

tirod3 said:
SD + knife? Not reality.
Click to expand...

The REALITY is that people have successfully used knives to defend their lives for thousands of years.
They also have the advantage of being very capable as TOOLS, which means you get more use out of them than a dedicated, weapon only item.
PLUS, the parctice you get from using it for regular tasks tranlates into being able to deploy it more easily.
I deploy my knives multiple times throughout the day. How often do most people deploy their guns or ASP's?
AND, lest we forget, the OP asked for suggestions about a good FOLDING KNIFE FOR SD, not sticks, guns, napalm, swords, etc. A FOLDING KNIFE.
 
He asked for a folding knife recommendation for SD use. I respectfully questioned the necessity with facts and reality.

Sure, people use knives in self defense - but far, far more use guns. After that, they use ANYTHING else, because it offers standoff distance.

The history of self defense is one long example of adding distance to separate yourself from injury. The first improvement on knives thousands of years ago was to lash it to a long pole to get out of reach. Propelling multiple smaller sticks with knives at higher speeds came next - the bow and arrow.

It all came down to getting as far away from the enemy as possible. Now, we carry guns. Armies launch missiles, rockets, drop bombs, use artillery, engage with mortars, grenade launchers, machine gun fire, small arms fire, use pistols, but God forbid you have to use a knife if it gets that bad. Better to stick it on the end of the rifle. Bayonets are issue to the common soldier - self defense knives and tactics, not at all.

Show me a PD or LEO agency who specifically issues large quantities of combat street knives, what regimen of testing they specified, and the contract bid offering. Guns, yes. Body armor, yes. Knives, go buy it yourself, private purchase.

The walking stick is a better asset for self defense than a knife. Hence, I suggested selecting a knife based on what you suggest - daily utility chores. It reinforces familiarity with the knife, and should it come down to it, any knife will do if it's sharp.

As a retired USAR soldier with 22 years, IN/OD/MP, I know this forum is slanted to self defense with knives. It's not a viable defense. Sorry, but that's reality. Most people won't train to the level necessary. And as suggested, it won't do as good as a stick when confronted by animals, or those equipped with a gun.

Knife self defense is a joke in the modern world, since about 1854. Please don't delude people into bringing a knife to any fight.
 
tirod3 said:
The walking stick is a better asset for self defense than a knife. Hence, I suggested selecting a knife based on what you suggest - daily utility chores. It reinforces familiarity with the knife, and should it come down to it, any knife will do if it's sharp.

And as suggested, it won't do as good as a stick when confronted by animals, or those equipped with a gun.

Knife self defense is a joke in the modern world, since about 1854. Please don't delude people into bringing a knife to any fight.
Click to expand...

A solid stick is a good thing to have when walking in the bush, no argument there.
Against animals, well, depends on whether you see it coming, or end up being mauled. Bow hunters have used arrows to good effect against bears while beng mauled, and at least a few people fought off big cats with a normal sized knife.
Against a gun, well, a think the knife and the stick are at about the same disadvantage. BUT, the knife has the advantage of lethality at grappling range(more so than a stick), and against a gun, you either create LOTS of distance, or close right in.
I'd not feel under-weaponed with a knife in most circumstances. If I KNEW I was going into a life or death situation right now, like a war, then sure I'd want the gun with me. I'd still want a knife as well though--for one thing, they don't run out of bullets!:D
 
The Chinook3 is a shining example of a self defense folder, but it may be slightly over six ounces in weight (I forget the exact measurement). I also recommend the Military, although it is a tip-down folder.

On my trek to the Philmont Scout Ranch, where sightings of grizzly and black bears, as well as mountain lions, are a daily occurrence, the park rangers advised that self defense spray and blunt instruments are more effective in stopping an animal attack. This is because they are used to taking punishment from sharp instruments when fighting amongst one another---teeth, claws, etc. The blunt trauma is foreign to them, as is the burning, and will scare them as well as hurt. If you are worried about four-legged prowlers as well as those that stand upright, this might be good advice to practition.
 
tirod3 said:
He asked for a folding knife recommendation for SD use. I respectfully questioned the necessity with facts and reality.

Sure, people use knives in self defense - but far, far more use guns. After that, they use ANYTHING else, because it offers standoff distance.

The history of self defense is one long example of adding distance to separate yourself from injury. The first improvement on knives thousands of years ago was to lash it to a long pole to get out of reach. Propelling multiple smaller sticks with knives at higher speeds came next - the bow and arrow.

It all came down to getting as far away from the enemy as possible. Now, we carry guns. Armies launch missiles, rockets, drop bombs, use artillery, engage with mortars, grenade launchers, machine gun fire, small arms fire, use pistols, but God forbid you have to use a knife if it gets that bad. Better to stick it on the end of the rifle. Bayonets are issue to the common soldier - self defense knives and tactics, not at all.

Show me a PD or LEO agency who specifically issues large quantities of combat street knives, what regimen of testing they specified, and the contract bid offering. Guns, yes. Body armor, yes. Knives, go buy it yourself, private purchase.

The walking stick is a better asset for self defense than a knife. Hence, I suggested selecting a knife based on what you suggest - daily utility chores. It reinforces familiarity with the knife, and should it come down to it, any knife will do if it's sharp.

As a retired USAR soldier with 22 years, IN/OD/MP, I know this forum is slanted to self defense with knives. It's not a viable defense. Sorry, but that's reality. Most people won't train to the level necessary. And as suggested, it won't do as good as a stick when confronted by animals, or those equipped with a gun.

Knife self defense is a joke in the modern world, since about 1854. Please don't delude people into bringing a knife to any fight.
Click to expand...
"It all came down to getting as far away from the enemy as possible. Now, we carry guns. Armies launch missiles, rockets, drop bombs, use artillery, engage with mortars, grenade launchers, machine gun fire, small arms fire, use pistols, but God forbid you have to use a knife if it gets that bad. Better to stick it on the end of the rifle. Bayonets are issue to the common soldier - self defense knives and tactics, not at all."

"The walking stick is a better asset for self defense than a knife. Hence, I suggested selecting a knife based on what you suggest - daily utility chores. It reinforces familiarity with the knife, and should it come down to it, any knife will do if it's sharp."
Click to expand...

It depends a lot on what kind of self-defense you are talking about, and against which type of beast you are dealing with. Sticks are completely WORTHLESS against dogs, while you can kill ANY type of dog with a folding knife or small fixed blade. Been there done that many times... Try stopping a rabid fighting-dog trying to kill, using with a stick. Think of a mad Pitbull, a Dogo Argentino, Fila or Tosa Inu.

And most bad guys or four-legged threats around here don't carry missiles, mortars, rockets or machineguns. So unless you live in the Gaza Stripe or in Mogadishu, a knife is still a great SD tool in a non-urban/non-civil war environment.


Show me a PD or LEO agency who specifically issues large quantities of combat street knives, what regimen of testing they specified, and the contract bid offering. Guns, yes. Body armor, yes. Knives, go buy it yourself, private purchase.
Click to expand...

Lets be honest here! Most cops are fat and poorly trained dorks who couldn't hit a Zeppelin with a shotgun in order to save their lives. A knife in the hands of a moderately trained fighter or soldier is a devastating weapon.
 
Last edited:
My opinion, if you've got the money, the cqc-12 is hard to beat. But, if money is an issue, the Chinook 2 or 3 is hard to beat.
 
First of all, I must say tirod3 has a point. He has some very good points from an objective and pragmatic point of view. He also seems to have first-hand experience as he claims to have been a soldier. Thus, I think those are some good arguments and I don't see why you should reply with such childish posts indirectly attacking the man and mentioning mortars and napalm. :thumbdn:

YES, the man asked for a FOLDING KNIFE and I myself carry a knife for SD. BUT, tirod has simply offered some more adequate solutions better suited for the specified task. The facts ARE on his side. It is absolutely true that advancement in weapons has manifested itself primarily in increasing the reach of a certain weapon (and also it's firepower later on). The spear is the perfect example. Initially, it was basically a knife strapped to a relatively long stick. And it was used solely as a weapon with it's main purpose being separation of the wielder and the threat (animals, other humans etc.).

As far as I'm concerned, I'll be carrying a knife in my pocket for a long time nearly everywhere I go. I find it impractical to carry anything else and I have never carried a gun in urban areas. It seems totally useless, at least where I live.

Now, concerning your question, I myself would get an Emerson CQC-12. IMHO it is one of the best all-around folders considering the price. It's a bit bulky but I don't mind that. You should be quick though, as they have recently been discontinued. :(

Anyway, you should get something with a strong and reliable lock (this is a no brainer) so I wouldn't recommend any liner locks or smth like that. Get a nice framelock or a lockback (best spyderco's have already been mentioned) that is waved or has assisted opening. I myself dislike spydeco's. There are some benchmade models that have potential too. As much as I like Emerson knives I just can't justify a liner lock for anything but light to medium cutting. So, just the 12' or possibly a 7'.

However, as someone has already mentioned, a well built bali can hardly be beat (it can't :D).
 
Comrade said:
First of all, I must say tirod3 has a point. He has some very good points from an objective and pragmatic point of view. He also seems to have first-hand experience as he claims to have been a soldier. Thus, I think those are some good arguments and I don't see why you should reply with such childish posts indirectly attacking the man and mentioning mortars and napalm. :thumbdn:
Click to expand...

Not attacking the man.
I AM attacking the common tendecy I've seen to ignore what someone is asking for, and suggesting something totally else.
Like those threads where someone asks for a good $50 knife, and people suggest Striders and Sebenzas!
Come on, we all have our preferences, knife and defense-wise, but why not stick to answering the questions asked?
P.S.-I didn't mention any mortars.
 
Sure you could go out for a walk in the park with an AK-47 or a spear, but it seems hardly practical from a legal perspective.

So for those who have to worry about defending oneself from a dog / crazy homeless person who's trying to attack you with a sack of papers / the odd drunk who's just too angry at the world and attacking you with beer bottle, a folding knife seems very far from useless.

Back to the discussion - I recommend the Griptilian with the Ritter blade. Oh, get some pepper spray too. And remember, always run, and only fight if you're cornered and your life depends on it. Avoid confrontation at all costs. I'd rather someone call my momma ugly and walk away, than get into a fight over silly words and get killed / injured or go to jail over that stupid stuff.
 
Comrade said:
First of all, I must say tirod3 has a point. He has some very good points from an objective and pragmatic point of view. He also seems to have first-hand experience as he claims to have been a soldier. Thus, I think those are some good arguments and I don't see why you should reply with such childish posts indirectly attacking the man and mentioning mortars and napalm. :thumbdn:

YES, the man asked for a FOLDING KNIFE and I myself carry a knife for SD. BUT, tirod has simply offered some more adequate solutions better suited for the specified task. The facts ARE on his side. It is absolutely true that advancement in weapons has manifested itself primarily in increasing the reach of a certain weapon (and also it's firepower later on). The spear is the perfect example. Initially, it was basically a knife strapped to a relatively long stick. And it was used solely as a weapon with it's main purpose being separation of the wielder and the threat (animals, other humans etc.).

As far as I'm concerned, I'll be carrying a knife in my pocket for a long time nearly everywhere I go. I find it impractical to carry anything else and I have never carried a gun in urban areas. It seems totally useless, at least where I live.

Now, concerning your question, I myself would get an Emerson CQC-12. IMHO it is one of the best all-around folders considering the price. It's a bit bulky but I don't mind that. You should be quick though, as they have recently been discontinued. :(

Anyway, you should get something with a strong and reliable lock (this is a no brainer) so I wouldn't recommend any liner locks or smth like that. Get a nice framelock or a lockback (best spyderco's have already been mentioned) that is waved or has assisted opening. I myself dislike spydeco's. There are some benchmade models that have potential too. As much as I like Emerson knives I just can't justify a liner lock for anything but light to medium cutting. So, just the 12' or possibly a 7'.

However, as someone has already mentioned, a well built bali can hardly be beat (it can't :D).
Click to expand...
Now, we carry guns. Armies launch missiles, rockets, drop bombs, use artillery, engage with mortars, grenade launchers, machine gun fire, small arms fire, use pistols, but God forbid you have to use a knife if it gets that bad. Better to stick it on the end of the rifle.
Click to expand...
I don't see why you should reply with such childish posts indirectly attacking the man and mentioning mortars and napalm
Click to expand...

The words in bold were taken directly from his post. If you have major text comprehension issues, that's not my goddamned problem. He was the one who brought the subject of war weapons up.


YES, the man asked for a FOLDING KNIFE and I myself carry a knife for SD. BUT, tirod has simply offered some more adequate solutions better suited for the specified task. The facts ARE on his side. It is absolutely true that advancement in weapons has manifested itself primarily in increasing the reach of a certain weapon (and also it's firepower later on). The spear is the perfect example. Initially, it was basically a knife strapped to a relatively long stick. And it was used solely as a weapon with it's main purpose being separation of the wielder and the threat (animals, other humans etc.).
Click to expand...

Long-range weapons are USELESS in close combat. SD is not the same thing as warfare or hunting animals. Spear and bows have their place, but not in a SD situation.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Outdoors Fanatic said:
Lets be honest here! Most cops are fat and poorly trained dorks who couldn't hit a Zeppelin with a shotgun in order to save their lives.
Click to expand...

Let's be honest here, your rhetoric is getting carried away with itself. I can't remember the last time I've seen a fat cop in New York or New Jersey. Got them? Probably. But not the norm around here. So your "most" doesn't impress me.

You don't need to distort the discussion to make a good argument.
 
Yea I know a knife is a poor choice. I was going to get one of those tactical walking sticks but walking a dog carrying a stick leaves no free hands. Its also difficult to communicate to a dog with a stick in hand. Mine don't like me waving a stick at them.

One suggestion was to get a fixed knife. The more I think about it, that makes a lot of sense in a state park. I will probably pick up an Emerson 8 (the 12 seems hard to find) just because I'm a knife nut, but carry a Benchmade Rant in the state park for the SD piece. A good thread like this deserves at least 2 knife purchases come out of it.
 
regal said:
One suggestion was to get a fixed knife.
Click to expand...

Get a big Bowie then.
That way you have the best of both worlds, as it makes one hell of an impact device with the back end(better than an ASP:D).
Most people who say knives aren't effective aren't thinking of large Bowie knives.
 
Emerson waved for sure
also check out 9line knives by Warren Thomas, they open like a wave knife too and are very light
 
Since you've decided on a fixed blade, why not go all out and get a machete then?:D Ontario, Tramontina, Condor, and Cold Steel are the four companies that come to my mind that make good machetes, and they won't cost you an arm and a leg, either (the Condor's are a bit more expensive than the others). 14-18 inch blade length would be my choice. And like stabman suggested, you could whack whatever's attacking you with the spine of the blade, as well. I'd feel better with a machete on my belt than I would with a small fixed blade, at least where self defense is concerned.
 
Emerson cqc12 would be up there for sure becuase of the wave feature and
frame lock.But another comes to mind that is overlooked and never mentioned.Well!!! it's the emerson persian just one look at the thing it is specialized and not recomended for utility use,which reminds me about another folder that wasn't said here,the spyderco civilian.Both of these folders measure a hair over 4'' though.
 
Well for s.d. I would recommend a CRKT Apache lg size. Under 6ozs. ats34 steel, handle is very grippable being a dropped style handle, nicely serrated thumb ramp, very positive locking liner of titanium, and the blade, ahh the blade. Extremely pointy with a nice swedge and nice belly going up to the point. The friggin thing just looks fast sitting there.

This I think is the BEST design CRKT ever came up with the S2 running a close second. If you can find a pic of one you will see exactly what I mean. I have an S2 and 3 Apache's both lg and small. Purpose driven knives that can double as a utility knife too but to me geared more towards s.d. keepem sharp
 
Oh, and Waved Endura 4. 2.3 oz, almost 4" blade, waved, opens as fast as you can retrieve it from a pocket, 4-way clip, solid as a rock, lockback, great ergos, reasonably priced.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top