Best production liner lock ?

RxEnergy said:
It's a linerlock in the same sense Millie's nested liner is.
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Actually it's not.

The MicroBar is piece of steel with a hinge. It's not part of the liner therefore cannot be a liner lock. In the picture you can see the screw at the top of the MicroBar where it's hinged to the frame of the knife.
 
I should have phrased my question differently. What liner lock would be the one that all others are compared to ?
 
Jpalmer1988 said:
I should have phrased my question differently. What liner lock would be the one that all others are compared to ?
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Again, a nearly meaningless question because you have to say, for what purpose?, does weight mean anything?, how big?, steel type?, strength?.
Anyway, my favorite is the Kershaw 1416 XXL Starkey Ridge.
 
David Lowry said:
Actually it's not.

The MicroBar is piece of steel with a hinge. It's not part of the liner therefore cannot be a liner lock. In the picture you can see the screw at the top of the MicroBar where it's hinged to the frame of the knife.
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I think it comes down to semantics. There are quite a few production and custom knives that employ a separate, inset lock bar like the one on this ti-handled CRKT that serve exactly the same function as a traditional liner-lock, and their makers usually refer to them as such, even though the knives in question don't use liners.

Lockbar.jpg
 
Blade-Tech!:confused: Aside from Spyderco's Military model, I consider Blade-Tech's Pro Hunter model to have the best production liner lock in the business!:thumbup:
 
That Microbar looks interesting, but it appears to me that the spring tension is provided by a seperate spring rather than being a function of the locking leaf itself. In my opinion, that would disqualify it as a liner lock.

All liner locks are judged against one you are familiar with. To say that a ZT300 has a better lock than a Spyderco Military doesn't mean a thing if you have never handled either.

I know that Spyderco designs and builds their locks to a specific strength rating, verified by extensive break testing. I suspect other companies do as well, although Sal Glesser is the only CEO I've seen sharing his test results with us. Of the couple hundred liner lock knives I have or have handled, I'd rate the Military as the best overall for me. The new Gayle Bradley folder is more like a framelock with scales over the sides in that the locking leaf has a relief milled at its base to reduce the tension enough to make it operable. It is probably more reliable (less prone to accidental release) but good luck using it with gloves on.
 
Rick said:
I think it comes down to semantics. There are quite a few production and custom knives that employ a separate, inset lock bar like the one on this ti-handled CRKT that serve exactly the same function as a traditional liner-lock, and their makers usually refer to them as such, even though the knives in question don't use liners.

Lockbar.jpg
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Rick,

That's not what I was referring to. I agree that the one you've pictured above looks like a liner lock.

The one you pictured below is what I consider to be the MicroBar and do not consider it a liner lock.

Rick said:
"Best" is a relative term, but for my money, Microtech's "Microbar"-equipped manuals are the top-'o-the-line production linerlocks. Much as I appreciate the F&F from companies like Spyderco and Kershaw, I think MTs are a cut above, but you do pay for it.

micbaryx4.jpg
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I like the Al Mar sere 2000 for a liner lock. I am surprised it wasn't mentioned yet.
 
yablanowitz said:
That Microbar looks interesting, but it appears to me that the spring tension is provided by a seperate spring rather than being a function of the locking leaf itself. In my opinion, that would disqualify it as a liner lock.

All liner locks are judged against one you are familiar with. To say that a ZT300 has a better lock than a Spyderco Military doesn't mean a thing if you have never handled either.

I know that Spyderco designs and builds their locks to a specific strength rating, verified by extensive break testing. I suspect other companies do as well, although Sal Glesser is the only CEO I've seen sharing his test results with us. Of the couple hundred liner lock knives I have or have handled, I'd rate the Military as the best overall for me. The new Gayle Bradley folder is more like a framelock with scales over the sides in that the locking leaf has a relief milled at its base to reduce the tension enough to make it operable. It is probably more reliable (less prone to accidental release) but good luck using it with gloves on.
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Um, Wow!
 
The Military does have a good liner lock. But now that I have the Gayle Bradley folder, I think it has an even better liner lock.
 
yablanowitz said:
That Microbar looks interesting, but it appears to me that the spring tension is provided by a seperate spring rather than being a function of the locking leaf itself. In my opinion, that would disqualify it as a liner lock.

All liner locks are judged against one you are familiar with. To say that a ZT300 has a better lock than a Spyderco Military doesn't mean a thing if you have never handled either.

I know that Spyderco designs and builds their locks to a specific strength rating, verified by extensive break testing. I suspect other companies do as well, although Sal Glesser is the only CEO I've seen sharing his test results with us. Of the couple hundred liner lock knives I have or have handled, I'd rate the Military as the best overall for me. The new Gayle Bradley folder is more like a framelock with scales over the sides in that the locking leaf has a relief milled at its base to reduce the tension enough to make it operable. It is probably more reliable (less prone to accidental release) but good luck using it with gloves on.
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The ZT 0300 is a "RIL" aka framelock. Unfortunately I don't own one yet, otherwise I could measure the thickness of the lock vs the blade.

My ZT 0350 is a fully lined folder with a liner lock that has a 0.075" thick against a blade that is 0.12" thick. My Spyderco Military is a "nested liner lock" that is 0.047" thick against a blade that is 0.14".

My ZT0200 has a liner lock that is 0.080" against a blade that is 0.16" thick.

BTW: Just turned my digital calipers off. :cool:

Not saying that the ZT0200 or 0350 liner locks are "better" than the Milie as far as failure or overal performance. Haven't used either enough to tell. The ZTs are definitely thicker and more robust than the Millie, though. I'll wait until I get my Ti/M4/G10 Millie to compare a Millie framelock to the ZT linerlocks and framelocks before making a final judgment.

Need to get a ZT 0300, too to make a full comparison.
 
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Jpalmer1988 said:
I should have phrased my question differently. What liner lock would be the one that all others are compared to ?
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If you read through this thread, you can easily answer that, its spyderco military not saying its better or its worse, but its going to come up in any such discussion. I own one, and the only reason I bought it because of the spyderco reputation, I wanted to see it for myself. I got a CF model, I don't know about other models, but this thing is light. Its a big knife for a folder, yet its unnoticeable in your pocket. I like it, and I'm not looking for anything to replace it with.
 
PG5768 said:
Um, Wow!
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Wow, what? :confused: So I'm mixing apples and oranges on that comparison, it still holds true. Comparing a lock you've never handled to another lock you've never handled really doesn't tell you much, if anything. For the record, the ZT knives simply do not appeal to me, so I've never handled one. They may be the greatest thing in the world if you like that sort of thing, but I don't. So if I compare anything to one of them, I don't know what I'm talking about. If I compare something to the Military, I do know what I'm talking about, but that doesn't mean anyone who hasn't had a Military will understand.
 
As a rule I don't trust L.L.'s because they have a lot of give when it comes down to push and shove, and on the Micro Knife - no no on that L.L. as a guy at the feed mill lost two fingers to one (that is not what I call good L.Lock) - as for me most of my Liners are gone except a few Military's as I trust them more than any other L.L. out there!! But that is why there are so many different knives out there because we all like different things as far as looks and feel and the way this and that performs for each individual person. Be a real piece of work if they only made one kind of knife for everybody, yep - that would be a real BXtch now wouldn't it.??* All I got to say and more than I have said in the last year.! {Reckon I just keep my opinions to myself since they are like axxholes and everybody has one}
 
yablanowitz said:
Wow, what? :confused: So I'm mixing apples and oranges on that comparison, it still holds true. Comparing a lock you've never handled to another lock you've never handled really doesn't tell you much, if anything. For the record, the ZT knives simply do not appeal to me, so I've never handled one. They may be the greatest thing in the world if you like that sort of thing, but I don't. So if I compare anything to one of them, I don't know what I'm talking about. If I compare something to the Military, I do know what I'm talking about, but that doesn't mean anyone who hasn't had a Military will understand.
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The "Um, Wow." refers to making a judgment based on experience with only one knife of the ones that you cite. I'm looking at my ZT0200, 0350, and Spyderco Orange G-10 Military as I type this. Speaking of oranges. ;) (My Orange G10 Tyrade is in my pocket so I'll leave that out of the discussion.)

My measurements were an attempt to show that the liners on the 2 ZTs that I own are almost twice as thick as those on my Military. The blades are about the same thickness for all 3 knives. Personally, I haven't used any of these knives enough to cause a failure or any other problem with the lock.

The best thing that the OP could do before he chooses a knife is handle the ones that are recommended by the folks here in this thread. Or he could follow the BF tradition and buy them all. :thumbup:
 
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PG5768 said:
The "Um, Wow." refers to making a judgment based on experience with only one knife of the ones that you cite. I'm looking at my ZT0200, 0350, and Spyderco Orange G-10 Military as I type this. Speaking of oranges. ;) (My Orange G10 Tyrade is in my pocket so I'll leave that out of the discussion.)

My measurements were an attempt to show that the liners on the 2 ZTs that I own are almost twice as thick as those on my Military. The blades are about the same thickness for all 3 knives. Personally, I haven't used any of these knives enough to cause a failure or any other problem with the lock.

The best thing that the OP could do before he chooses a knife is handle the ones that are recommended by the folks here in this thread. Or he could follow the BF tradition and buy them all. :thumbup:
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Perhaps the OP was looking for recommendations pertaining to the knife as a whole, or a complete knife, rather than just a comparison of just the liner lock itself?

In any case, nice ending to your post. :)
 
Thomas W said:
Perhaps the OP was looking for recommendations pertaining to the knife as a whole, or a complete knife, rather than just a comparison of just the liner lock itself?

In any case, nice ending to your post. :)
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Guess we need to narrow down the OP's requirements a little more. From best liner lock to the liner lock that all others are compared to is still pretty broad.

Thanks Thomas, buy them all is a time honored tradition here on BF, based on my short time here. :thumbup:
 
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