Beware Jerry Roberts aka underdogishere!

Well, it seems that Jerry has had a change of heart, and now blames me for his inability to act honorably! Here is his latest e-mail:

-----Original Message-----
From: UnderdogIzHere@aol.com [mailto:UnderdogIzHere@aol.com]
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2001 9:36 PM
To: glennp33@home.com
Subject: Re: Chew Spitfire..

my offer is withdrawn..you should have been happy with my offer to try and accomodate you..but you had to keep going..so i am exercising my right and withdrawing my offer..larry offered to make it right as the knife came from him..so that is the offer..
he has been sent a copy of this...as well the only pressure came from you forcing me to withdraw..

Guess what Jerry? I didn't trust you then either...note the e-mail I sent several hours ago, after you were bragging about your integrity:

-----Original Message-----
From: Glenn Pritchard [mailto:glennp33@home.com]
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2001 8:11 PM
To: deleted to protect identity
Subject: FW: Chew Spitfire..


Hi,

As you can see, he is still posturing........you might wanna hold onto the other knife until this is settled. Because I would not be surprised if tomorrow he has another excuse about the knife, and you and I ultimately end up swapping knives.

Thanks,

Glenn


-----Original Message-----
From: UnderdogIzHere@aol.com [mailto:UnderdogIzHere@aol.com]
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2001 7:26 PM
To: glennp33@home.com
Subject: Re: Chew Spitfire..


oh..he is not worried about me sending you anything..he has known me for awhile and we are friends..he is already shipping the new terzoula to me as we speak...
 
-----Original Message-----
From: UnderdogIzHere@aol.com [mailto:UnderdogIzHere@aol.com]
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2001 10:07 PM
To: glennp33@home.com
Subject: Re: Chew Spitfire..


I think it was..if they are as small minded as you...then I KNOW IT WAS...

-----Original Message-----
From: Glenn Pritchard [mailto:glennp33@home.com]
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2001 9:58 PM
To: UnderdogIzHere@aol.com
Cc: sales@bladeart.com
Subject: RE: Chew Spitfire..


Doesn't surprise me a bit........I sent a note to ***** asking him to hold onto the new knife, as you would probably have a new excuse anyway. If it wasn't this, you would have had to work in the morning, or you would have had a flat, or whatever. I've gotten many e-mails from folks who have got you on their ignore list on Bladeforums, Knife forums, Tacticalforums, Bladeauction, and everywhere in between, so you won't get the chance to do it again. Most people said that your only hope was to make good on your promise. Hope this was all worth it.

-----Original Message-----
From: UnderdogIzHere@aol.com [mailto:UnderdogIzHere@aol.com]
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2001 9:36 PM
To: glennp33@home.com
Subject: Re: Chew Spitfire..


my offer is withdrawn..you should have been happy with my offer to try and accomodate you..but you had to keep going..so i am exercising my right and withdrawing my offer..***** offered to make it right as the knife came from him..so that is the offer.. he has been sent a copy of this...as well the only pressure came from you forcing me to withdraw..
 
:confused: You know, I'm going to chide in here and not take sides but this is a VERY INTERESTING thread! I'm going to vent but let me start by saying I have had a few deals with Jerry and have NO complaints. His knives sent to me were as advertised.

I have been buying, selling and trading knives on these forums for a LONG time. Maybe someone will pipe in here and say that I sent them a knife that wasn't "up to snuff" but they DID NOT let me know about it. Oh yeah, I'm wrong. There was one guy and I refunded his money.

I have had a FEW knives sent to ME though that weren't "up to snuff" or "not as advertised". Some folks that are even responding to this thread know what I mean.;) I like these people though, (heck, I like MOST folks), and let it slide because they gave me pretty good deals. I noticed slight flaws but hell, these are KNIVES people, (i.e., read "TOOLS"), and they at LEAST have to be HANDLED to appreciate. I have owned knives in the past that shouldn't even be HANDLED because MAYBE one fingerprint MIGHT leave an indelible mark and it wouldn't be desireable. I got rid of them!

I have to say though, that I have had the WORST problems with "expert" purveyors and makers and NOT regular collector/forumites! I have been sent knives that had wrong handle/scale colors and flaws of one nature or another. Most of them were minor flaws and I CHOSE to let it slide. Hell, I even ordered a knife on a purveyor's website, (and you know who you are!), and was "shined on" because when he finally got the knife because it's value had gone up, (slightly), and he could sell it for more, (slightly), than I originally ordered it for!

Now I know I could complain, send things back, bitch about it, etc., etc... but one thing I find in this and other forums, is that if you DO bitch or send things back, or post a complaint, you are BRANDED! Especially if such and such a maker or purveyor or even seller is popular on these forums. Hell, I made a post like this on another thread awhile back saying that folks SHOULD bitch once in awhile and was taken to task for it!

I guess what I'm trying to say here is that if you have a LEGITIMATE complaint, go ahead and bitch and don't be afraid to! I think that if any DECENT person, (collector, maker, purveyor or otherwise), is selling on these forums, he will correct the problem to the best of his ability, (Darrel Ralph, I SALUTE YOU!). I chose NOT TO because I could live with it and flame wars REALLY suck and are worthless exercises in futility.

Glen, if Jerry did you wrong, do what you have to do! Jerry, I have had good deals with you and thanks.
 
Wood gets micro cracks and ti scuffs... part of life! Too bad it gets to this point. Guys I hope you both get this cleaned up.
 
Gene, thanks for your post. Jerry, I have not been editing your posts, only removing the intermediary's name, per his request. The bottom line is that I am unsatisfied with the transaction, and Jerry cannot rectify it. Everyone knows as well as I do, that you see knife on the board, and you like its looks. Until you hold it, you have no idea whether it will work for you. The Terzuola is not for me. I have only done this once before, and the blade in question was a Lightfoot fixed blade. The knife was way too thin for me to use comfortably. I told the seller this, and he promptly refunded my money, with no complaining at all. He didn't tell me he spent the money, got laid off, was robbed, or any of that. He simply refunded the money, less shipping. Is that too much ask? Jerry has placed himself in a position where he cannot do that (or will not do it, since it appeared possible for a few hours). Instead, he has gone to the dealer from whom he purchased the knife, and gotten him to agree to replace the knife with a NIB one. While that's great for some, it's not what I want. Jerry has complained about me sending him a used knife. Well, since he held onto his knife for an extra few days, he had them both, and if he was unhappy at all, with my painfully accurate description, then he could have just dropped the Chew into the box and returned it. Hell, if he had asked for the shipping charge becauase I misrepresented the condition, I probably would have sent it. But none of that happened. We've all watched his posts come and go all day, as he deletes, re-edits, and changes his story, and tries to change the entire subject of this ordeal. Well, good try, but Bill Clinton had better writers. If someone is unhappy with a transaction, the other party should rectify the situation to the other's party's satisfaction, not vice versa. I don't think I am being unreasonable. Within 20 minutes of receipt, I ask for my knife back. When Jerry tells me it's gone, I tell him he can pay me my asking price for the knife, plus shipping ro return his. It's not my fault that Jerry imprudently traded a knife before it was his. He claims it was a done deal, but how many of us BF guys would buy a knife under those conditions? Every reputable dealer gives an inspection period, and honors it.
Look everyone knows I've been around for years on BF, and this is the first time I have needed to go to this extreme, since everyone I have ever had an issue with has always done their best to get it settled. But Jerry was very clear.....it's a done deal, there's nothing he will do, and I can post away, he doesn't care. Well, he seems to care a little more than he indicated, since he agreed to recover my knife and return it once his tactics were public knowledge. But that lasted for a short while. You think I'm being tough on him? You'd be tough on me if I had done to you what he did. The difference is that I would make it right, and not waiver back and forth all night, blaming whoever crosses my path. I'll drop this when Jerry satisfies me, and he has only to simply buy the knife if it is truly impossible to recover. 30 seconds at PayPal, and this would be over.
 
Gene, I appreciate that you have been dealt with fairly by Jerry, but have you ever tried to return anything to him? That's where the "fun" begins. I agree people get branded by posting in GBU all the time. I won't deal with those names who regularly show up there in general. But you mention some less than honest dealers......this has historically been a hobbyist board, where all are kindred spirits. I admire most knife dealers, because it's a hell of a way to keep the lights on......long hours, low margins, etc. Just remember what you might be in for if you get something from Jerry that is less than stated, especially on a trade, where your knife might be shipped out before you even get what you trade for.
 
Guys, never had a deal with either of you but heard nothing but good things about both of you.
But I can't believe nobody else is posting about the fact that a trade is never a done deal till both sides are happy with what they get. Not just condition, what if you just dont like the feel of the knife? It's really bad form to get rid of a knife before the other party says he's satisfied with the trade. You should never be stuck with a trade just because the other guy says so, should get at least the right to inspect it before the deal is done.

Dave
 
Dave,

I couldn't agree more! Glenn has a valid arguement, start to finish.

Jerry didn't "own" Glenn's knife until Glenn gave the thumbs up, regardless of shipping schedule, and he had "No Right" to sell Glenn's knife in the mean time!

Futhermore, Jerry came across as a real prick in this whole fiasco, and TFC, BFC, KFC, ABC feedback aside, it doesn't mean "diddly squat" when a situation is handled as poorly as this one was.

Glenn, I "feel your pain" bro, BTDT! Jerry, based on you sorry assed attitude, we won't be doing business, ever.

4 months ago we did a "deal" with that prick Ted "Dead" Wood up in Michigan...he advertised two "mint" rare Applegate/Fairbairn daggers, a Harsey and a Yancy for sale on BladeAuction.com. We needed those two to finish off our A/F collection, so I went out on a limb and offered two dead mint RMK's and some cash for his two knives.

If you guys know RMK's, you know the "source" is Tom Clinton. We had a brand spanking new #1-7 in Stainless Steel, with Black Micarta Handle, Nickel Silver Hilt-Spacers-End cap, and a Black Sullivan's sheath, along with a mint #25-6 with the NS hardware and the best Stag you've ever seen...I sent these and $300 to "Deadwood" via Express mail with the agreement that he'd do the same...

A week goes by, and after numerous unanswered emails and phone calls, and finally we get through to him...."Your RMK's were sh*t, I had to give them away, so you can't have them back, and I want more money before I ship you my "mint" A/F's" was his response...

OMG, I was on the phone with the airlines, I was gonna fly to Michigan to kick some well deserved ass! Finally, after even more fruitless emails and calls, "his" knives arrive, and they are NOT mint! I think the Yancy had been cleaned, and there was light rust on the other, not to mention the sheaths were pretty dinged up...what a prick!

So Glenn, welcome to the down side of the forums, and we're sorry to hear ya lost out this time. Most of the folks here come clean, but some just don't....regardless of their past.

As Dave said..."When both parties agree", so guys, please don't ever "turn" the knife until you have an agreement that it's a done deal, whether it "suits" you or not...

BTW, "Deadwood" listed our previously "sold" RMK's on ebay a month later...hmmm :rolleyes:
 
I could see how this whole mess could get bent out of shape. An agreed upon three day inspection by both parties, and this mess would never happened. Do not assume any thing, especially a three day inspection which is normal for trading guns and knives at least in my experience.

Hope you gents can come to an acceptable conclusion.
Big D1
 
Without getting into personalities (especially since I know neither of these two gentlemen) it would seem to me that a "deal" is not completed until both sides state their satisfaction with the transaction. In a trade that would mean that both sides received goods that meet their expectations and stated such. In a sale it would mean that the buyer is satisfied with the condition of the item received.

The personality (or lack thereof) of one side or another shouldn't enter into the equation. Imagine if businesses only sold or honored their commitments to customers they "liked".

The bottom line, as I see it, is that one party to the transaction is not satisfied and the other party didn't wait for confirmation before trading away or selling the other party's goods. I don't see that there is any way that can be acceptable in a transaction where the goods have not been examined in advance and a deal cemented.

Underdogizhere, I realize you won't be pressured to do the right thing, but as a fellow LEO, I'd urge you to consider what your honor and integrity is worth. You said you'd get the knife back and therefore finish this matter honorably. Don't let your anger over the other party's statements stop you from doing what's right.

(Glenn, fwiw, I think that when an agreement to send your knife back was reached, you should have, at that point, ceased the offensive and allowed the matter to be resolved without further finger pointing.)

In the end, what will be remembered is that you stood up and did the right thing despite the distasteful circumstances. And if the other party continues to "spew" where there is no need, don't think that it won't be remembered as well.

My two cents. I hope you two can gentlemen can get this resolved.
 
It is not a deal,if both parties are not satisfied.
Underdog:You had no right getting rid of the knife until it was "A done deal".Sorry but right is right.
 
I have dealt with both Jerry and Glenn. I am not taking sides on this matter but I do agree that you should make sure both parties are satisfied before selling/trading off the knife. I think this should be a standard rule on Blade Forums.
michael
 
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