Big burly solid pins...

richstag said:
I am talking about bolts that screw together and hold the handles tight together to the tang. I think I may have been unclear.

If not, then my apologies.
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if you meant the flat head chicago bolts like the ones above, I would say they are stronger and better :thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:


come to think of it, I don't know if the old pins were press fit pins or ground down chicago screws :confused:
 
I have been trying to post on this thread for over an hour – embarrassing how many attempts and embarrassing frustration about it as well, but I have been having SERIOUS issues posting on this thread – yet no problems posting on a couple of other threads ???) So, I “finally” went to service and support and saw where another person seemed to be having the same issues I was having. He guessed that size of post might be a problem, cut the post into smaller pieces and it worked. So, here goes my attempt to “piece together” my attempts to post what is now a bit old…

…….. Anyway:


LVC is pretty well all over this one! Although, I doubt weight is a factor in Jerry's decision. 3 solid pins vs. 3 hollow pins probably amounts to a about .25 ounce difference at most and probably less in over-all weight. I have not seen any pattern to indicate Jerry has that sort of concern over either handle weight or over-all weight. Jerry seems to LIKE "FATTY" knives. Beefy and solid! ;)

Big solid pins might "Seem" beefier and more solid, but they are NOT more "Secure"!

Big Solid pins would resist sheering much better, but they are NOT as good as "Flared" hollow pins over-all. As LVC said: Hollow pins "actively hug the scales". Solid pins are not flared and do not actively grip the scales other than a bit of friction if tight enough. The only way to make solid pins stick and hold well is with epoxy. Epoxy works VERY well, but is a PITA to remove the scales if they need to be replaced. If using epoxy, hollow tubes still win in the event the epoxy fails.

Hollow pins are probably a bit cheaper and a bit easier and faster to install in production (????), but I doubt that little bit of extra savings amounts to much in regards to Jerry's reasoning.

Sure the hollow pins can be "slightly" moved or develop a bit of wiggle if beat on to extremes, they are just a bit more prone to give "a little" if extremely abused. But, if a hollow pin gives a little, it is still pretty darn attached and secure. - If you know how, a loose hollow tube could even be peened back to center and secure if needed.

But, once a solid pin becomes loose, it is DONE! You have to completely remove the rest of the pins to fix the one or more that failed - so competely rebuild the scales. Further, if a hollow tube fails, you don't have to resize the hole. Just flare in a new hollow tube. If a solid pin becomes loose, a replacement pin isn't likely to fit right anymore and may new a "slightly" larger pin, might need redrilled scales and tang, etc., etc. complications.
 
This seems to be working, but I have to keep shortening my post "bits":

cont.

Also, Solid pin is designed to be set into scales, then ground off to flush. This is more time consuming. But, there are other factors related to Busse's production where grinding the pins would affect production. Busse's scales are CNC cut and done. If you used hollow pins and had to go back to grind off the pins, you would have to hand shape the scales at that point.

Many people like hollow tubes for their ability to be "lashed". I don't. I am about 99.99999% confident that lashing my knife to a stick will never be something I need holes in my handle for. And for the remaining 0.00001% chance, I will just have to find another way to lash or not. I don't particularly like the looks of hollow pins. But, they have become a "Busse" look and they have a bit of "Combat" look to them - for those who want a "Combat" look.

I agree with LVC on the screws being better and more secure than solid pins. Although, I think Corby bolts are much more secure than a screw with a standoff. However, Corby bolts are NOT usually intended to be removed. Like solid pins, Corby bolts are typically screwed together tightly and then the slots are ground off (BY HAND). However, the concept could be used to leave the slots without grinding them off.
 
LVC - thanks for taking the time.

I was thinking threaded bolt. I would think Busse uses a type of these and grinds off the ends. Just a guess and only Busse can probably answer?
 
Too many issues posting. sorry for not getting all of my post info up, but I have to step away from this frustration. I don't need it after yesterday.
 
THAT post went right up (???????), makes me wonder if worth trying to finish my other info ????
 
I hope Spark gets this fixed. Still having problems with posting multiple lines.
 
AFAIK, when makers use small pins, the scales are glued on, the pins serve mainly to locate and hold things together until the epoxy sets. I don't think anybody uses fat pins that are simple press fitted and expected to hold the scales down. Most makers use Corby bolts and grind them down when the handle gets finished.

example pic borrowed from a Dan Koster WIP thread;

Updates041410-02.jpg
[/QUOTE]
 
I just want to briefly mention a misconception about using the hollow, flared tube holes for lashing the knife to a pole. This has been mentioned by two of the people in this thread. For a lot of you, I think discussion of lashing the knife to a pole is theoretical; for me, it's something I've done many times. I don't lash knives for the purpose of making a spear, I lash them for the purpose of making a pole-axe, to increase leverage and thereby drastically increase chopping power.

Anyway, I just want to point out that lashing knives to poles by threading cord through the tube holes in the handle scales is actually not such a great idea, in practice. It sounds good, but it isn't. When you lash the knife to the pole that way, it abrades and wears out the cord rather quickly. It also doesn't hold as securely and as wobble-free. The knife is held more securely, and with less abrasion on the cord, if you just wrap the cord entirely around the knife and the pole, with the "flat" of the handles pressed to the pole, without threading the cord through the holes in the handle.

Threading cord through the holes in the handles, for attaching the knife to a pole is not practical, in reality. In my opinion, that is not a real feature of the tube fasteners.
 
^^^^^^ Yeah.... but Rambo killed a pig that way. It was in the movie... has to be for real. ;)
 
Jerry.. Just use a Hammer Lock set up.Have a solid pin inside of a tube.. HA HA!!!
There ya go.. Pins and tubes done..
Now,, For that little tip i would like the NMFBM.
Frosted with Black Paper.
Hey, iam a givin guy!!! HA HA!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
Garth told me that the solid bolts on the knives from Easton were "hand peened" nickle. Does that mean anything to this discussion? Is it a bathroom joke? You all seem to know better than I do.
 
pioneertoo said:
Garth told me that the solid bolts on the knives from Easton were "hand peened" nickle. Does that mean anything to this discussion? Is it a bathroom joke? You all seem to know better than I do.
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That is what I was told as well.:thumbup:
 
Ankerson said:
I gotta have that front tube to put my lanyards through on my FBM's. :D
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Me too.

The flared tubes do make the handles easier to remove cleanly, than rivets/corby bolts ground flush would.

Also, Busse does not epoxy the handle scales on, which would also make them harder to remove.

If you wanted this done on your knives (both corby bolts, and epoxy, I bet you could send them in and get it done for a nominal fee, I believe that it would in fact be more solid, but if you ever broke a handle scale under really rough use, you are absolutely going to have so much more work to get them off).

The idea of putting a pin through the pressed hollow tubes would probably work. Also along that lines, I suppose you could get another stainless tube, that would fit the inner diameter of the original tubes and then press fit that one inside the first to make it beefier. In theory this would act like increasing the wall thickness of the stainless tubes. Then to be really crazy, you could peen another rod inside that second flared tube........

Well, until I actually break loose a handle or even get them to shift, I think I will just leave them as is. I know for a fact if I really wanted to shear those hollow handle fasteners, I probably could, but It would take me doing things to the knife I don't think I have ever done yet. I do have a 8 lb sledge I suppose I could baton the knife through the steel pipe.

I do like the Flared tube holes, and have noticed that other manufacturers seem to be taking this approach as well.
 
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Tinbasher said:
No epoxy used on Busse knives.

Richard
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They do on custom knives that have mosaic pins. There may be another exception but it eludes me at the moment.

pioneertoo said:
Garth told me that the solid bolts on the knives from Easton were "hand peened" nickle. Does that mean anything to this discussion? Is it a bathroom joke? You all seem to know better than I do.
Click to expand...

Post reported for flagrant use of the word "PEENED".:eek:
 
pioneertoo said:
Garth told me that the solid bolts on the knives from Easton were "hand peened" nickle. Does that mean anything to this discussion? Is it a bathroom joke? You all seem to know better than I do.
Click to expand...

Interesting. Hadn't heard that before. Wonder exactly how that works?
 
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