Big Knives or Handaxes?

[jdk1]

Honestly, I could be wrong, and as I stated my experience with large knives is limited. I judge based on my experience, and the G&B Wildlife Hatchet weighs ~600g (21oz), and for that weight I can't find anything that compares (still waiting for Busse to bring out something longer and thinner, although I do enjoytheir smaller knives). I backpack in the mountains a lot, so weight does factor in quite a bit when you go out for 2-3 weeks straight, and the extra poundage does fatigue you (both walking and chopping) after a long stint.

My earlier examples all come in at 22.5 oz. or less and carry easily. The CS Gurkha and Junglas have great sheaths right out of the box as well. The Tora rides in a home made sheath, but can be carried all day long. The CS Gurkha is 5/16" with a full flat grind. The ESEE Junglas is 3/16" with a high saber grind. The Tora Battalion khukuri is 3/8" or so at the bolster. None of these will be great at clearing large amounts of brush, like a long machete, but thin, green wood and brush doesn't stand a chance against them. There is technique, as with anything, but it's simple. Flicking the wrist works much better than pounding away and trying to muscle through whatever you're cutting.

Busse(kin) has some long, thin ones already. The 1311 and B11 come to mind. I think you'd really like a Junglas if you tried one. The sheath can molle right onto your pack if desired. Take care.

 

[Balboa256]

When "play time" is over, they use a chainsaw.

There was dried wood which got chopped as well, but the camera wasn't mine, and it wasn't of the same diameter anyway.
I wanted to test it with a good old fashioned tree chopping, so I did.
And though the wood be green, tis true, it did as well as any of the mid-size axes I've encountered, once the tool was learned.
The tree was the first object ever chopped with it since being built, but it was not the last that day.

And if I ever build one of the log cabins in the woods that no one ever seems to build, I will not be using this to do so.
Nor will I use an axe.
I will use a chainsaw...or the truly North American method of hiring some low-paid foreigners to do it for me.

Chainsaw is old school now as well for lumbering. Hire some low-paid foreigners!!! LMAO. There lots of people who build using traditional methods. Most people never post pictures of what they do. I don't either and old timers never will. Many of the folks around me are quite humble and find no need to share their pictures if they even have any. IF YOU WANT PICTURES OF PEOPLE BUILDING HOMES WITH AN AXE JUST LOOK AT ANYTHING BUILT BEFORE THE TURN OF THE 20TH CENTURY. THERE IS YOUR PROOF.

 

[utah_fish]

For what I do a knife is actually the best tool for me. I don't chop other than limbing small branches so what I need the most is a splitter. A knife seems to work best. The problem is that I have not found any carry system that works. Baldric, belt, horizontal...I hate them all and I refuse to carry them in a pack as I believe that weight would be better spent on an extra jacket, tarp or even a sleeping bag. I just can't carry a big knife so if I need a chopper I carry a hawk because it seems to disappear on my belt. It's not as good for what I do but it's the one I'll have with me so it's the one that I've been grabbing lately. I think what doesn't come across over the interwebs is what a persons temperament is like. I think that is the primary factor in what people choose. I think it has less to do with which tool is the "best" and more to do with which tool the person likes best regardless of function. There are too many guys carrying what are essentially useless paperweights IMO for me to think otherwise. And of course I know everything.

Where i live the dry seasoned oak and even the pine would eat a hawk in about 2 bites and then laugh at you for even trying to use it. I'm referring to splitting wood with a minimum 6" diameter.

 

[stabman]

IF YOU WANT PICTURES OF PEOPLE BUILDING HOMES WITH AN AXE JUST LOOK AT ANYTHING BUILT BEFORE THE TURN OF THE 20TH CENTURY. THERE IS YOUR PROOF.

Oh I know people used to do such things.
A few people still do (very few).
They tend to have various sizes of axes...and saws of different types...and wedges...and a bunch of experience using them.

Myself, the biggest thing I'll be building in the woods ever is some sort of shelter, which could be accomplished with a small axe, or a large knife, or a saw, or a machete, or even a SAK of a variety which has the saw.

Most of the time it won't even be that, and I'll just be making a fire, which, depending on the availability of the right type and quantity of wood, may involve nothing more than the pocket-knife I always have with me.

Really, to paraphrase Sir Mixalot, "I like big knives and I cannot lie..."

Actually, I'm in charge of cutting the potatoes for supper tonight, and I'm going to use that sword to cut them up.
Not because it's efficient (it isn't), not because anyone will be impressed (they won't), but because it's fun. :thumbup:

 

[B.F.U]

Actually, I'm in charge of cutting the potatoes for supper tonight, and I'm going to use that sword to cut them up.
Not because it's efficient (it isn't), not because anyone will be impressed (they won't), but because it's fun. :thumbup:

Although I grew up using hatchets and machetes, never big knives, I think you make a great point. Not many of us on this forum do serious everyday work with a hand axe or big knife: we use them because we enjoy using them. If I was going to make a shelter I would grab my small axe and small fixed blade and possibly a hand saw. However, due to the busse and Becker as well as some custom makers on this forum, I decided I want a big knife. So instead of paying $300+ I decided to do what you did and make one. It doesn't make me ignorant for wanting to use a big knife, it just means I like using big knives.

 

[Balboa256]

Oh I know people used to do such things.
A few people still do (very few).
They tend to have various sizes of axes...and saws of different types...and wedges...and a bunch of experience using them.

Myself, the biggest thing I'll be building in the woods ever is some sort of shelter, which could be accomplished with a small axe, or a large knife, or a saw, or a machete, or even a SAK of a variety which has the saw.

Most of the time it won't even be that, and I'll just be making a fire, which, depending on the availability of the right type and quantity of wood, may involve nothing more than the pocket-knife I always have with me.

Really, to paraphrase Sir Mixalot, "I like big knives and I cannot lie..."

Actually, I'm in charge of cutting the potatoes for supper tonight, and I'm going to use that sword to cut them up.
Not because it's efficient (it isn't), not because anyone will be impressed (they won't), but because it's fun. :thumbup:

People might not be impressed but sure arent gonna say anything about it....Not with that big beast in your hands!!! I live in Amish country and see these types of tools being used often. I have worked with the Amish and they are impressive people filled to the brim with old-world skills. But in the end, for most people its all about having fun and getting out in nature. Rock the big knives brother, I still do.

 

[elkins45]

My bk9 will beat your hatchet anytime anywhere and at anything

I have a couple of 6" Osage orange trees in my fence line that need to come down. Let's try your knife against my Dad's old Estwing hatchet and see which of us gets their tree on the ground first.

IMO unless you're fighting off ninjas or filleting fish, a knife with a blade longer than about 5" is just a poor substitute for other tools unless it's long enough to be a machete.

 

[Raymond1000]

For those old enough to remember,
And to keep us from taking this too seriously:

Come along and sing a song
And join our jamboree!
B-I-G—G-E-R—K-N-I-F-E!

Bigger knife! Bigger knife!
Bigger knife! Bigger knife!
Forever let us wave it at the sky!

Slices, dices, very nice
I’m sure you will agree!
B-I-G—G-E-R—K-N-I-F-E!

 

[Myal]

No, there's no advantage to using a big knife vs. a hatchet for chopping.A good hatchet will outchop a knife any day if you use it properly. Mind you that there won't be any noticeable difference between the two in branches less than 2" in diameter and a knife will do better with very thin sticks. But if you're talking logs the hatchet will win. Also, if you're planning on cutting brush, the knife will win because it's more like a machete, which is the proper tool for that job.

So the short version, if all you care about is chopping, the hatchet is the better choice; the trade-off is that the knife can do more jobs, the hatchet only does one.

cant argue with that

 

[Kletsou]

Just to add to stabman's post , this tree was as hard as a stone been lying there for about 20 years but the big busse choppers got the job done . Circumference was 71.2" . If we had a big logging axe the job would have been done much faster , but then that is not what it was about , me and a buddy having a great time testing our choppers and a few beers
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Yip - to tell you the truth, we had a axe but it broke.... The thing with the full tang big knives is that it can not break in same manner as a axe.

I love axe's and own a couple. Mainly for winter firewood chopping. But then, I also like the big knives.....

Chopping up this massive tree was huge fun, and very hard work. I would not have likes to do it on my own but it is great fun with a like minded buddy. Taking turns make a good days exercise and you really get to appreciate tools (read knives here). Busse, Swamprat, Kershaw (Outcast and Camp10) and toolshed time machetes. All worked and got tested in this instance.

There is always a lifetime worth of difference between theory and practice. Testing practical like this and looking at some reviews on these tools are also vastly different.

It is hard work! It is a lot FUN! It is a must to KNOW the tools and what you want to use where. We all are different and even with this exercise we had between two knife nuts different preferences and different level of effectiveness with the knives.

Bottom line, know you knife (tool) and test your tool (I had a epic steel failure on Busse, it is one in a million, but happens).

For me, I would prefer to test before I rely and then I am happy to rely on a tool. What works for me, might not work for you.

Nice thread! Go out there! Have fun! Break a sweat!

 

[Shotgun]

Where i live the dry seasoned oak and even the pine would eat a hawk in about 2 bites and then laugh at you for even trying to use it. I'm referring to splitting wood with a minimum 6" diameter.

Why would I be splitting wood over 6 inches in diameter?

 

[Shotgun]

Myself, the biggest thing I'll be building in the woods ever is some sort of shelter, which could be accomplished with a small axe, or a large knife, or a saw, or a machete, or even a SAK of a variety which has the saw.

Not to mention the fact that a shelter can be built without a cutting tool at all.

 

[Raymond1000]

I designed a BOB for a girl going off to college. Something she could keep in her book bag. Five pounds total. Here’s what I told her about processing wood.

Your Victorinox Farmer is as much knife as you need.
The saw is great for cutting firewood or making a debris shelter. You do know how to split wood with a saw, right?
There are still crown cork caps requiring a real bottle opener. The bottle opener is also a screwdriver and a decent light pry bar. You can strip insulation from wire with the notch.
Not all cans come with pop tops. The can opener still earns its keep. The screwdriver on the end handle straight and small Phillips screws.
The awl is great for scraping a ferro rod. Use it to shape the notch on the fireboard before you use a friction fire drill. It can drill in hole in wood, or add a new hole to your belt, or help you sew leather pieces together. Spin it in the other direction and it’s a marlinspike, helping you untie a tight knot.
Oh yes, there’s also a knife blade.

 

[Doc8404]

You can spend $180 on a Junglas but it won't out-chop or out-split a $20 Fiskars hatchet. So it really boils down to what will you be using it for? If you're clearing brush then a large knife will serve you much better, if we are talking strictly fire prep, then the hatchet wins every time. I guess in theory the big knife would be better for fine cutting chores, but it's still going to suck. One big advantage to the large knife is it is much safer; other than a mechanical injury due to a fall or something of the like, you are most likely to suffer a debilitating injury as a result of chopping. Even on my knees, I have had some pretty close calls trying to chop while I was tired. More than once I have missed my target and watched a hatchet head come dangerously close to sinking into my thigh. So now I carry a Laplander Saw to avoid chopping if I'm tired, a small hatchet for splitting (I only split logs while they are horizontal now), and an Izula 2 or something similiar for knife work. This is the safest and most efficient set up I have found. But if you forced me to only carry one tool, I would probably take my BK9 for the only reason of it being less likely to end up lodged in my leg.

 

[Doc8404]

I originally loved the "idea" of big knives but quickly realized I don't use them when I go camping. When I hit the woods, I take a folder, fixed blade & axe/hatchet. That being said, I have got rid of my beckers cause they were collecting dust.

You should have held onto those Beckers, the prices on those things just keeps going up. IMO, they have lost much of their perceived "bargain value", and now compete based on quality alone.

 

[Balboa256]

Its great to see a civil discussion on this topic, it shows maturity. Im glad I recently became a member to this forum. The bottom line on this subject for me is: No matter if you carry a large knife, a Nessmuk trio, a Laplander, a cruiser axe, It really doesnt matter. The fact is, Im sure any two of us together in the woods, no matter the tool preference would make out ok. For instance, I have a buddy who usually carries a GB Wildlife, Kellam Wolverine and a stockman. Sometimes I just carry a Svord Von Tempsky Bowie and a Large Case stockman. The two of us have done extensive winter hiking and overnighters in foothills and mountains and we've always excelled. Sometimes its great having a "tool off-set" between two people. Where his hatchet lacks, my large bowie excels and visa versa. As long as you know how to competently use the tool you have I have no problem hiking with you. I have made netting needles with my Von Tempsky Bowie. Is it the right tool? No, not really, takes a bit too long but the point is I can do and have done it. My buddy knows im competent with whatever I take and I feel the same about him. The last thing I want is for one of us to get injured or not be efficient with a tool just because someone said its "the best". If you can, pick the right tool for the job, be safe, have fun and pass this ever-fading knowledge down to our children.