Black Jack's Blatant use of Randall Made Knives Designs?

OK, I've had enough 'politickin'" for one lifetime after the events of the last two years. So, instead of taking sides as I don't own either brand and therefore have no dog in this fight, I will play 'third party arbitrator', and offer what I see as the best possible solution.

Extrastout, you say that you have a Randall on order. It will be some time before you take possession, I assume. And you also say that you are/were considering purchasing the BJ 1-7. Why NOT buy the Blackjack? Now, HERE is where it gets interesting. When you get it, look it over OBJECTIVELY, and then USE the damn thing as a knife until your Randall comes in. I am not saying to run over it in the street, or hammer it one inch into a tree and try to use it as a step.(seen it done, it's a bloody mess, literally, if the knife fails, and most will). No, use it for cutting stuff. Observe the fit and finish for the price, rust resistance(O-1 is a rust magnet, and even Randall cannot change that, although a mirror polish can reduce this tendency), the overall strength, comfort in use, etc. All the things you would do if you were doing a review for a magazine. Then when your Randall arrives, you will be in a better than average position to make a detailed, informed, and most importantly, an OBJECTIVE, comparison.

I, for one, would be most interested in seeing the results.
 
I would suggest you pick up a Blackjack 125 or 1-7 and use it. They actually are really nice knives if you don't mind the choil (design). I personally really like the 125 with the guard. It works for me. The 1-7 is a bit too much a fighting knife for me, but I fondle it often. It is likely the knife I would take with me in a SHTF event where potential human to human contact would be more likely than out camping in the woods.

Added: I believe the Blackjack 127's general shape/grind is more similar to the Randall you ordered than the 125 you pictured.

The link above about the history of Blackjack is interesting. Assuming it's correct, I was not aware that Mike Stewart and a partner started Blackjack. I have no particular problems with that. I own one of the Effingham IL Blackjacks. It is consistent with current production.
 
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22-rimfire said:
Let's see if this is true? Seeking information and not "putting out any information" on your own. I refer you to your thread title " Black Jack's Blatant use of Randall Made Knives Designs?". If that is not putting out information, I don't know what is?

Then because you really have no facts, just an opinion which of course you're entitled to. But it still stinks. You say stuff like this...


You resort to insults and have done this a couple times. Not necessary. You don't own this thread as you seem to think.
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Roll on ;)
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22-rimfire said:
I would suggest you pick up a Blackjack 125 or 1-7 and use it. They actually are really nice knives if you don't mind the choil (design). I personally really like the 125 with the guard. It works for me. The 1-7 is a bit too much a fighting knife for me, but I fondle it often. It is likely the knife I would take with me in a SHTF event where potential human to human contact would be more likely than out camping in the woods.

Added: I believe the Blackjack 127's general shape/grind is more similar to the Randall you ordered than the 125 you pictured.

The link above about the history of Blackjack is interesting. Assuming it's correct, I was not aware that Mike Stewart and a partner started Blackjack. I have no particular problems with that. I own one of the Effingham IL Blackjacks. It is consistent with current production.
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I like the choil....I like Randall designs...I might put in a 6 month waiting order soon. Just not buying a black jack, I will buy from brands that give credit to where credit is due.
 
Randall has absolutely no affiliation with Blackjack, Coldsteel, Bark River or any other knifemaker that decides to "copy" the Randall designs or make similar designs... RMK does not endorse these guys but would welcome at least like the acknowledgment that they are indeed using the designs to offer a "like" RMK but without the wait from the shop...dont see that happening though

Bo Randall always insisted that copies were the purest form of flattery and really never really minded them...
 
I apologize, Gary Randall has actually "endorsed" one copy... The Pohl force design... They sent us a letter to inquire whether we would be insulted by their undertaking and knowing Detmer so well, we encouraged his design and even have the first offering in the museum..
 
extrastout said:
Dozier gets it
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extrastout said:
In the knife world, this seems WEAK to me, especially with such an iconic, historical design (show credit, where credit is do)!!
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You, obviously, have a lot to learn about the "knife world". You think Randall influenced the knife world and everyone should be shouting out how great those designs are? Get over it.

There have been knife makers who far surpassed Bo Randall who get no, or little, credit from those using like patterns. Look up Bob Loveless sometime. His patterns basically drove fixed blade knife design for most of the last century. For example, Dozier's current line offers designs that are Loveless inspired (or copies if you will) and you'll look long and hard on their website to find a mention. I can't begin to count all the companies and custom knife smiths who've used Loveless patterns without credit to the designer.

Patterns and designs of knives and blades come and go; some are thousands of years old. The fact that patents are so rare in this field anymore says more about the futility of worrying about copies than anything.

You want to look into folks who really, deliberately, stole, lied, and cheated in this industry? There's names that stand out, and you don't have to look far to find them.

If you wanted to put some love up for Randall, there's threads dedicated to that. Heck, there's a whole forum. Go there and be a "fan boy".

https://www.bladeforums.com/forums/the-randall-made-knives-collectors-forum.769/

(FYI I have owned knives by both Bo Randall and Bob Dozier. I recently sold a Dozier specifically made for me on a Loveless Drop Point pattern. I think both makers deserve to be in the Hall of Fame, but that any "collector" value can only be attached to knives made by those individuals, not in factories stamping their names on blades they never touched.)
 
eisman said:
If you wanted to put some love up for Randall, there's threads dedicated to that. Heck, there's a whole forum. Go there and be a "fan boy".
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Ummm, this thread was burried....your keeping alive bud. I don't like Randall due to the price and wait... if this makes you happy. I like credit where credit is doo though. I like originality and making an honest living

Merry Christmas!
 
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