Brand New BK9 Failure!

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dcgisme, if it is any consolation I very typically, with with a variety of different knives and brand names, use a knife very much the way you did here. It it were me personally, I'd have no qualms whatsoever about digging my knife, designed exactly for this kind of thing, into nasty naughty wood. I do it routinely. There are some pieces of wood that do defeat me. My handle hand gets tired of the jarring from all that batoning and I give up. Most cases I have to get a iron wedge and sledgehammer to finish the piece.

I will say that very often that what will defeat a small axe (not a maul) of 20-23" for splitting can be done with a knife and baton. Or the axe and baton. I've had lots of tough wood laugh at my fiskars and thats when I pull out a big knife.

I completely trust Becker for quality and as such I wouldn't bat my eyelashes at tackling on the kind of job your boy did. It is also why I insist that your knife is a flawed product. What you have shown simply doesn't mesh with most of my experience. I have never broken a blade under 100's of batoning sessions in nasty and frozen wood. I've batoned the hell out of a buck 119 on wood that I couldn't split with my small forest axe. It also doesn't ring true with the breaks I have seen on dozens of broken blades posted here on BF. In every case that I can recall the blade broke cleanly at the blade/handle junction or there was a tip failure usually within 1" or closer to the tip.

I hope Ethan wades in on this conversation.
 
I don't know if Ethan is monitoring the board right now, kgd. He may be off to this weekends Blade show. I would imagine he'll weigh in after the show, though: I think he'll have a lot to tell us about.
 
If you look closely at the break it almost looks like the steel broke the way obsidion or glass would fracture. This is my non scientific observation. This and the fact that it "shattered" in more than one place leads me to believe that there may have been a structural flaw in the steel itself. Imho I believe this would fall under fair use (malls and axes aside):). I recall a thread in which Mr. Becker was o.k. with replacing a bk9 that broke under similar circumstances all he wanted was to get the broken blade back to look at it to see why it failed. I think he may have stated that he thought it was structural but never was able to look at the broken pieces. This was on an older camillus model not the new kabar one.
 
dawsonbob said:
I don't know if Ethan is monitoring the board right now, kgd. He may be off to this weekends Blade show. I would imagine he'll weigh in after the show, though: I think he'll have a lot to tell us about.
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Yes, no doubt, it would be interesting to glean Mr. Becker's personal take on this discussion. Given what little I know of Mr. Becker, I'm sure the guy is plenty busy enough with out having to chime in on BK9 failure threads, but perhaps he'll weigh in at some point?
 
glamdring said:
If you look closely at the break it almost looks like the steel broke the way obsidion or glass would fracture. This is my non scientific observation. This and the fact that it "shattered" in more than one place leads me to believe that there may have been a structural flaw in the steel itself. Imho I believe this would fall under fair use (malls and axes aside):). I recall a thread in which Mr. Becker was o.k. with replacing a bk9 that broke under similar circumstances all he wanted was to get the broken blade back to look at it to see why it failed. I think he may have stated that he thought it was structural but never was able to look at the broken pieces. This was on an older camillus model not the new kabar one.
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Yes, your view glamdring seems to be the quickly building consensus; meaning I managed to get my hands on a rare, one-off defective BK9. How fortunate!
 
dcgisme said:
Yes, no doubt, it would be interesting to glean Mr. Becker's personal take on this discussion. Given what little I know of Mr. Becker, I'm sure the guy is plenty busy enough with out having to chime in on BK9 failure threads, but perhaps he'll weigh in at some point?
Click to expand...

My guess is that he will weigh in after Blade, and I'm sure he wants to know about your BK-9 failing.
 
kgd said:
dcgisme, if it is any consolation I very typically, with with a variety of different knives and brand names, use a knife very much the way you did here. It it were me personally, I'd have no qualms whatsoever about digging my knife, designed exactly for this kind of thing, into nasty naughty wood. I do it routinely. There are some pieces of wood that do defeat me. My handle hand gets tired of the jarring from all that batoning and I give up. Most cases I have to get a iron wedge and sledgehammer to finish the piece.

I will say that very often that what will defeat a small axe (not a maul) of 20-23" for splitting can be done with a knife and baton. Or the axe and baton. I've had lots of tough wood laugh at my fiskars and thats when I pull out a big knife.

I completely trust Becker for quality and as such I wouldn't bat my eyelashes at tackling on the kind of job your boy did. It is also why I insist that your knife is a flawed product. What you have shown simply doesn't mesh with most of my experience. I have never broken a blade under 100's of batoning sessions in nasty and frozen wood. I've batoned the hell out of a buck 119 on wood that I couldn't split with my small forest axe. It also doesn't ring true with the breaks I have seen on dozens of broken blades posted here on BF. In every case that I can recall the blade broke cleanly at the blade/handle junction or there was a tip failure usually within 1" or closer to the tip.

I hope Ethan wades in on this conversation.
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Thanks for offering the consolation kgd, as it does help. I was beginning to wonder (just a little) if batoning hard wood was outside of the realm of fair and reasonable use for knife of the size, heft and apparent caliber of a BK9.

Given the feedback and, no doubt, more seasoned perspectives offered on this forum I suspect my initial gut instincts were correct. Meaning my brand spankin new BK9 had failed under (admittedly) hard, yet reasonable, use and this was due to some kind of defect in the knife it's self.

Yes, it would be generous (and appreciated) of Mr. Becker to offer any personal opinion of my experience.
 
First, my sincere thanks to all who have taken personal time and energy to offer thoughtful and well reasoned replies to my initial post. You're a savvy and generous crew and your insight is well appreciated.

Second, I did email Ka-Bar today on this recent incident. I have yet hear back and may call them in a day or two to follow up and check on overall status.

Thirdly, some seem to think Mr. Becker himself may chime in at some later point. Needless to say it would be great to glean his personal take on my BK9 and recent experience with a shattering blade. Guess time will tell ...

Lastly, while I have every intention of continuing to make judicious, future and continued use of Becker knives (the family is up to three at this point, which is a new record for one knife maker), I've been exploring the Ranger Knives RD9 as possible compliment to (what I hope will be) a new BK9 replacement.

So, anyone have any fair and balanced insight on this knife (RD9) as compared to the BK9? Being somewhat new to knife forums, hopefully this is in good form and acceptable manners for a Becker knife form? No worries if not and I'll be the last guy offended if the question needs to move elsewhere.

Thanks again gang!
 
I just came across this thread, but under no circumstances would I call that abuse of the knife. If the BK-9 isn't up to the challenge, what's its appeal? I wouldn't hesitate to try this with my Becker Machax.

I have no doubt in my mind, that Mr. Becker would agree with this, and probably KaBar as well. Cut them a little slack at the moment because of Blade, but I'm sure it will work out fine.

Please keep us advised.

Doc
 
Kind of a side note. I remember a fairly picture of a Ontario RTAK or RTAK II breaking in a similar crescent pattern. Anybody else remember that thread.

I am sure Ethan will do right by you..."Knives the WORK for a living!"
 
Hey Everybody....

I am chiming in at long last.....Sorry it took so long........Well I must say it was a truly spectacular failure and I have no idea what caused it other than to say that an inclusion or other flaw in the steel itself may be to blame....I saw this once with a piton hammer head about thirty years ago and we had several PATROL MACHETE failures that occurred before we adjusted the heat treat....Knots were at fault with the machetes......Paul needs to see the remains as soon as possible.....I have clubbed many an oak log into small stuff with my Bk9 and am certain this is a fluke....As a general rule -and this goes for any knife, axe or machete with a rockwell over 50- stay clear of chopping pine and especially hemlock knots they are incredibly dense and always a potential problem for any blade......I do a lot of batonning with the BK9 in oak, hickory eastern cedar(juniper) and fat pine on a real regular basis soooo I am surprised at this but I promise two things ----- If we can figure it out we will and tell you guys what we find and you will get a replacement.......

When I found out about this I was literally headed out to my truck for the trip to BLADE Show.... I will be back amongst the land of the Blade Forums on a regular basis on my return........It has been interesting (in the Chinese sense) around here since PWYP.......

I hope to see you all at Blade....We will have a few BK77s and the most beautiful Micarta handles you ever did see.....

Looking forward to it......

All Best....

ethan
 
Hey dcgisme.....

I was so shook up that I forgot to apologise and also to tell you that if you have not already done so send the mortal remains to Ka-Bar Knives 200 Homer Street Olean NY 14760......attn: Paul....

All Best ....

ethan
 
Right after I posted last Paul called to inform me that we will also have some NECKER micarta handles....Be sure to drop by the booth and say hi if nothing else....

All Best...

ethan
 
Ethan Becker said:
Hey dcgisme.....

I was so shook up that I forgot to apologise and also to tell you that if you have not already done so send the mortal remains to Ka-Bar Knives 200 Homer Street Olean NY 14760......attn: Paul....

All Best ....

ethan
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Hello Ethan,

Given your busy schedule, I appreciate your taking time to review this thread and weigh in personally. Thank you.

I will ship the remains of the knife (we did keep the largest fragment) to the address and person you've request by the end of the week. By all means, I'm sure folks are interested and please advise should you ever determine root cause.

Good luck with the show and enjoy your time in Atlanta.

Hmm, what was that about Micarta scales? Are these for BK9/BK2 knives?

Thanks again,

Darrell
 
I was one of the guys with the patrol machete problem. Mine simply snapped when I very lightly chopped on a 2x4. I would have been able to break it in my hands seriously if I knew it was that messed up. I remember the same thing, send it in for testing. They never did tell me what was wrong with it, but I got a new one and to this days years later and tons of abuse later It is still running strong.
I was actually not surprised about seeing the break, now if it was your Fehrman Knife that would be interesting!
 
Hey Dcgisme,
When you send the broken BK-9 back to KA-BAR, please send it to the attention of:
Paul Tsujimoto

We have two Pauls and we want you to get it to the right one.


Paul Tsujimoto
Sr Eng
Product Dev and Quality
Ka-Bar Knives
 
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dcgisme, Yes, the micarta scales will fit the BK-2, the BK-7, BK-9, etc. I don't think they will fit the BK-11 necker, but scales for the BK-11 will be shown (introduced?) at the Blade show. Along with many other people I'm anxiously awaiting the scales for the BK-11: They'll make a great little knife even better, I think.

Wish I could make it to the Blade show, but I can't. Fortunately, other people have promised to take a lot of pictures of the Becker offerings.
 
Toooj said:
Hey Dcgisme,
When you send the broken BK-9 back to KA-BAR, please send it to the attention of:
Paul Tsujimoto

We have two Pauls and we want you to get it to the right one.


Paul Tsujimoto
Sr Eng
Product Dev and Quality
Ka-Bar Knives
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Will do and thanks for the clarification Paul. I should put this knife in the mail this week and it'll go strait to you.

Hey, if you're feeling really generous over at Ka-Bar, feel free to dress up the replacement with a pair of the new Micarta scales you guys seem to have coming out <grin> ...sorry, couldn't resist given the recent chatter on this subject <bigger grin>.

And thanks again for all of your prompt attention to this matter Paul
 
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