"Butterfly" knives ; opinion(s)

I like any kind of knives. From butterfly, fixed, folders, swords, etc.

And I truly believe that each is designed to serve its main purpose. For example; fixed blades are designed to be a work horse on the field, folders are designed for those who wants a working knife in a more compact package. And I believe that butterfly knives are designed to be utility knives (and also a martial arts weapon for many people - not me).

I am NOT saying that other knives cannot be used for martial arts, they can. But, balisongs are the only type of knife that 'train' its user in reflex, coordination between hand/eyes/knife, 'sticky hands' (hsing yi) with your weapons, etc. You gotta 'feel' your knife in order to become one with it.

You can train without any partners.

I see balisongs as utility knives that are closest to fixed blades in term of safety issue (locking mechanism). Besides, flipping balisongs is a form of art for me and for many people.

Is it efficient ? Well, let's see. I saw another forumite's video (I think it was Dawkind), and in that video, he was able to grab the balisong in the kydex sheath (the kydex sheath was located on his belt), pulled it, flipped open, in less than 2 seconds. You be the judge whether or not it is efficient.

One more thing, when you work with your knife a lot, you want a knife that's compact and easy to open.

Balisongs : grab either handle, flip it open without looking - there are simple flipping technique that only require 1 movement to open the knife, so don't imagine that we, swingers, need a lot of flipping and manipulations just to open the knife.

Regular folders : grab the handle, position your thumb on the thumb stud, flick it open. See, balisong saves more time.

Those are just a little example of what balisongs can do.

Just remember, traditional martial arts are notorious for many inefficiencies which prompted Bruce Lee to change the "classical" way of viewing martial arts.
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Please remember a truly great master, Mas Oyama (a.k.a. God's hand). Never been defeated in his life, killed a bull with only one/two punches, killed someone with only 1 punch, and he never changed the way he trained. Martial arts can be seen in many angles and point of views. But in the end, it is the fighter that counts, not the martial arts itself.

My 0.02, and I apologize if it is too long.
 
Originally posted by beluga

Balisongs : grab either handle, flip it open without looking - there are simple flipping technique that only require 1 movement to open the knife, so don't imagine that we, swingers, need a lot of flipping and manipulations just to open the knife.

Regular folders : grab the handle, position your thumb on the thumb stud, flick it open. See, balisong saves more time.

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Debateable IMO.

I admit some folders are quicker to open than others. A linerlock, or Axis lock will generally open quicker than a lockback with a heavy spring.

An Emerson Wave will have them all beat, including the balisong.

But no doubt it's more enjoyable, and dramatic, dare I even say intimidating, to watch a balisong being flipped open rather than a folder.
 
to use a phrase from a Harley t- shirt," if i have to explain,you wouldn't understand." because they're cool. classic example of form follows function. each to his own. later.:)
 
Originally posted by chopper
to use a phrase from a Harley t- shirt," if i have to explain,you wouldn't understand." because they're cool. classic example of form follows function. each to his own. later.:)
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I probably understand better than you think.

No offense, but I don't think quotes from Harley t-shirts are reknown as a sage source for advice or wisdom. It's right up there alongside with other notable Hanes Beefy T proverbs as: "Ass, gas, or grass -- Nobody Rides for Free", "Too drunk to f***", or "I'm with Stupid"

May I suggest:

"Tell me and I may remember, Teach me and I may learn, Involve me and I will never forget"
 
I´m not very fond of balisongs although they are fun to play...
I think that most of them are not very proporcional the handle is to much long in comparison to the blade lenght.
One other feature I don´t like in ballisongs is that after some use they become flawfull and it's not enough to tighten the screws...
Finally another defect I find in balisongs is the fact that the handle is composed by two separated pieces and so is not very solid and won´t provide a secure grip of the knive.
So my final jugement is that they don´t make good cuting tools but they are fun to play with an some make fine collection items.
 
The key to love balisong is not in the opening speed. I can assure you that there are people who could open it as fast as an auto.

These kind of discussion in my opinion are based on the wrong presumption that balisongs are for "martial arts weirdos who want to scare people to rob them"...

I used to have the same wrong feeling about sport utility vehicles: "What should I buy such a big car for?" I used to say. Then I tryied one or two of those and now I am saving to buy one.

My opinion, Allen, is that you never tryed to join us in the discussion about balisongs, and you couldn't see with your own eyes how many good guys play with balis, and how much this practice is more like an art than a opening process.

Take that Benchmade out of the box and join the balisong forum, you'll have fun, follow my advice :);)
 
I likes 'em too. :) I think their merit's have been pretty well enumerated here. They are very practical, being completely ambidextrous, strong and with a fully enclosed blade in the closed position. And it takes only a little time to gain the basic proficiency to open and close it with one hand - you can learn in 5 or 10 minutes. But there's a whole world of fun getting beyond that basic proficiency.
 
They can't get balisongs in Canada so they can't really have the opportunity to appreciate them. Keep on rockin' in the free world! :p
 
I find balisongs lack the comfort, speed of deployment, many safety features, and most of all, versatility of present day tactical folders in my opinion.
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[sarcasm] ok sure :rolleyes: [/sarcasm]

obviously someone hasnt flipped a quality balisong in a long time
 
So my final jugement is that they don´t make good cuting tools but they are fun to play with an some make fine collection items.
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man, do these people know what a bm42 is? or do they just "play" with jags and sidewinders?
 
I'm fond of balisongs for years, so I think I'm biased. But here are some food for thoughts. Kinda wimpy viewpoint about balisongs to tell some funs that does not concern flipping joy.

A fixed blade is the easiest to deploy. I also care fore sheathing it. A folding knife can be closed as soon as you finished your job. A fixed blade must go back the long way it came to, your back? under armpit? carf? it's prone to scar some flesh especially in a hurry.

Safety when not in use. Only hardest scabbard will prevent your knife's tip dig into yourself in traffic accident, or when you step on banana. A folding knife will be safer because it's folded. A balisong will even safer with locked handles by a latch.

Clumsy shape a balisong has, with not proportionally long handle, with poor hand guard. Well, a balisong is less stabby = less aggressive knife! (Please don't point out Filipino fighter use very effective slash techniques with a knife!)

Symmetry. Ambidextrousity is already commented. I love open / close symmetry in action also. A balisong takes efforts to get smooth action, but once you're good at opening, you're as good in closing.

Robustness. I know very few people really do this, but if you open and close your decent balisong as gentle as your other folding knife including "tactical" folders, it will last as long or longer than them. There are many cheapy balisongs because they can be as sturdy as other knives by much lower cost. One thing the manufacturer missed is that a balisong is seldom used in such a gentle manner.

A balisong is a balisong. Anyone's any balisongs can be handled as yours like Mercedes Benz's driving seat. Your effort of manipulating balisongs smoothly (I don't mean flashy ones) will well rewarded as the chance to handle other balisongs.

Flipping funs aside, I hope somebody is interested in one or more reason above to have a balisong as daily "user" knife, just for convenience.
 
Originally posted by shmoopiebear
They can't get balisongs in Canada so they can't really have the opportunity to appreciate them. Keep on rockin' in the free world! :p
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Are you sure about that? Take a look at a few retailers online, im sure you can find one willing to help you. If then you are still clueless emailme to cut to the chase.

Also the avaibility of trainers in non balisong countries is there for example BM40T.

I agree with most others in saying I like them very much.:)
 
Originally posted by Full Tang Clan
Let's not forget that there are many folders than can also be used effectively in this fashion including: Spyderco Gunting, Gerber Covert, Spyderco Police...
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Yes, but not all of them are as comfortable as the balisong in that use. The more rounded shape of a bali handle is far better suited to Mr Kubota's techniques than a flat and wide shape of a Spyderco Police. The bali also has the advantage being used as a non-lethal flail.
If it takes that much effort and challenge to learn to merely open it, is it efficient?
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Interesting question. Granted, almost anyone can take a basic lockback/liner lock single axis folder and use it out of the box. But is that really efficient? But the flaw to your question is that the bali is efficient out of the box. Most people can safely open a bali with two hands out of a box like any other folder. The handles just travel in a non-conventional direction. I think you were inferring to the advanced methods of opening a bali, called flipping to the practioners. No, flipping is not efficient to the basic user. Because flipping is a level of commitment to better master the bali. Like any other method of using any knive, a commitment to better learn how to use that knive will require discipline and practice. So, if we reapply that level of discipline and practice to your original question, the answer is yes. In the same amount of time it takes me to master the use of an EKI Wave'd folder, I can easily master a basic opening to deploy the bali.
 
Originally posted by diogo
I´m not very fond of balisongs although they are fun to play...
I think that most of them are not very proporcional the handle is to much long in comparison to the blade lenght.
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There's a reason the handle are disproportioned: it safely carries the blade within it so the blade is fully protected.
One other feature I don´t like in ballisongs is that after some use they become flawfull and it's not enough to tighten the screws...
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Actually, if you look at knive designs in general, the single axis folder have more points of failure than the balisong; liner lock engagement; lockback spring; lock detent. The rest are mostly shared between the bali and the folder. The balisong is composed of static points of construction; 2 handles, 2 pivot points, a tang pin, a blade; and a latch. Not much to really break or need adjustment. Adjusting the pivots is a small point of repair, and is generally all there is. No more so than folders that also share adjustable pivots. It's just that bali's achieve their point of ajustment faster than single axis folder because they cycles through their range of motion with more frequency, because of all that flipping. If a user was to open and close a bali in the same amount of cycles, in the same duration as a regular folder, you'll find that the adjustment points are the same.
Finally another defect I find in balisongs is the fact that the handle is composed by two separated pieces and so is not very solid and won´t provide a secure grip of the knive.
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You're kidding right? Maybe on the bali's you've used. On the ones I've used, they lock up as tight as a fixed blade when opened. And those disproportioned handles you mentioned above actually gives me a greater range of holds to better use it as a cutting tool.
So my final jugement is that they don´t make good cuting tools but they are fun to play with an some make fine collection items.
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Buy a bali with real steel, not those with Rostfrei stamped on it, and you'll have a much different experience.
 
I just started to get into Balisongs, and I am hooked. I find these knives fun to manipulate. I didn't get into them for use as a weapon. I carry one as an EDC now but I don't flip it out in an intimidating mannor in public. I like the idea of a knife that locks open the way it does. It's a very strong design. I know these aren't for everyone. That's ok though. That leaves more Bali's for me :D
 
I have 3 Balisongs ( 1 Taiwan, 1 Jaguar and 1 BM31 )I love them, really all of them are very nice you can use it in most of the works that you can imagine, have a lot of fun, and with little training you can open it so fast.

I would like to tell whom said that this kind of knives are not good for cutting that he is wrong, try with a Benchmade and you will see....

When I got my BM31 I received 6 clean cuts in my hand because af my fault and because of the razor shape that it have.

So Buy, Flip and Play with it and you will keep it.

roloss_valdes
From Monterrey, N.L., México
 
Allen, I'm sure it's been said (I'm too lazy to read all the posts) but, you never have to worry about the lock breaking on a Butterfly knife. A well designed and well built Butterfly is the safest and most reliable type of folder out there.
 
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