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Car Wreck
- Thread starter Fiddleback
- Start date
My God man. Thank God you and your loved ones are alright. It's amazing how we sometimes do the exact right thing without even thinking about it.
And JD, damn, I don't know what to say. Some people man, some people... It's sad how many people out there don't know how to own up to their actions. If someone screws up, they should pay up. That simple.
And JD, damn, I don't know what to say. Some people man, some people... It's sad how many people out there don't know how to own up to their actions. If someone screws up, they should pay up. That simple.
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- Feb 23, 1999
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- 4,855
I was in a collision a few months back. They do remind you of how suddenly life can come to an end.
I'm glad everyone came out of yours ok, Andy.
I got checked over at the ER after my accident, and didn't settle anything with the other insurance company for a while. After several days I felt fine. Then after a month or two the other insurance co called and asked if I'd take $1000 to give up my rights to sue them. They had already paid to fix my truck, paid for a rental while it was getting fixed, and paid my medical bills for the ER, so I said OK and took the grand.
I was rear-ended by an airline pilot, on the freeway. I was stopped in a line of cars and she hit me from behind at full freeway speed. My head took out the back windshield of my truck. I wasn't hurt but it did look spectacular. I'm lucky to have been hit by a responsible driver with insurance, and to have such a thick head. Her car looked lots worse than my truck.
I'm glad everyone came out of yours ok, Andy.
I got checked over at the ER after my accident, and didn't settle anything with the other insurance company for a while. After several days I felt fine. Then after a month or two the other insurance co called and asked if I'd take $1000 to give up my rights to sue them. They had already paid to fix my truck, paid for a rental while it was getting fixed, and paid my medical bills for the ER, so I said OK and took the grand.
I was rear-ended by an airline pilot, on the freeway. I was stopped in a line of cars and she hit me from behind at full freeway speed. My head took out the back windshield of my truck. I wasn't hurt but it did look spectacular. I'm lucky to have been hit by a responsible driver with insurance, and to have such a thick head. Her car looked lots worse than my truck.
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- Feb 28, 2003
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- 19,854
whoa, just got to this and read.
glad you're okay! and that you did the "right things"... now there's more to do
feel free to email me if you have tricky things, i've danced these waters for myself and friends - even though i'm not a lawyer.
here's some highlights.
#0 - do not sign anything. do not talk to the person you hit if possible at all. DO talk to your insurance company. resist strongly talking to THEIR insurance company. talk to yours.
#1 - you filed a POLICE report yes? have pictures of you vehicle and everyone and damage and stuff? good. make a file with every fact you can get, license plates, a write up, dates, TIMES, etc. sketch the intersection. take pictures. try to obtain a copy of the police report - useful to stay in the loop - have your insurance company send a copy if need be - did the person that hit you get a ticket? document document okay!
#2 - since YOU were HIT you are not at fault. this means many important things. first of which is: you do NOT have to accept the first, second, third... *bids* their insurance will offer. that's right, bids. they are going to low ball you if possible. this is your motto "you want to be made *whole*". that means your vehicle, your health, and any reasonable losses made up.
so if they want to use lowball repair shop, suggest that you only feel comfortable with certain repairs (especially non cosmetic ones) ONLY being done my your dealership, to spec, with like new *factory* parts, not factory *like* parts... as you also intend to own your vehicle for say, 8 years at least *wink*... you want *GOOD* paint. not insta-crap paint. proper base coat, clearcoats, all that. like new, like factory. no exception. "you will be made whole"...
okay, since you were also hit, they can't use the scam "we're going to total you and you HAVE to take this"... look up the blue book value. keep that in mind. print out a few ebay motors and other listings for your year and make. keep those handy to refer to during the bidding/negotiations war.
you PROBABLY don't need a lawyer - that's what your insurance is for. really.
reasonable expenses include anything you wouldn't have had to pay for due to this: cabs, rentals (which they should automatically supply), baby sitting, and so on. ka'peesh?
so, they're going to offer numbers. you might have your dealership or your insurance get their own adjuster to look at it. tires, only in pairs. *for safety* - argue "you aren't suggesting i put my pregnant wife and kids at risk? are you? can i have your name for my notes? :>
same for everything else really.
do not sign off ANYTHING, until you are fully happy you've gotten as much money as you can. especially medical. make you scratch off anything that suggests that "this is a done deal"... you want to keep open any chance of reopening this if down the line something happens. like your axle snaps. or you get a sprung vertebrae, etc... i've never signed the "final paper work", and don't cash any low ball checks that show up - doing so is sometimes agreement that you accept the deal as is.
basically, the accident is over. you're safe. the other driver is out of the loop too. your insurance company will only step in if the other insurance company takes too long or drops the ball.
they will try to screw you. fight. they HAVE to make your car like it was before, *or* better. no less.
bladite
glad you're okay! and that you did the "right things"... now there's more to do
feel free to email me if you have tricky things, i've danced these waters for myself and friends - even though i'm not a lawyer.
here's some highlights.
#0 - do not sign anything. do not talk to the person you hit if possible at all. DO talk to your insurance company. resist strongly talking to THEIR insurance company. talk to yours.
#1 - you filed a POLICE report yes? have pictures of you vehicle and everyone and damage and stuff? good. make a file with every fact you can get, license plates, a write up, dates, TIMES, etc. sketch the intersection. take pictures. try to obtain a copy of the police report - useful to stay in the loop - have your insurance company send a copy if need be - did the person that hit you get a ticket? document document okay!
#2 - since YOU were HIT you are not at fault. this means many important things. first of which is: you do NOT have to accept the first, second, third... *bids* their insurance will offer. that's right, bids. they are going to low ball you if possible. this is your motto "you want to be made *whole*". that means your vehicle, your health, and any reasonable losses made up.
so if they want to use lowball repair shop, suggest that you only feel comfortable with certain repairs (especially non cosmetic ones) ONLY being done my your dealership, to spec, with like new *factory* parts, not factory *like* parts... as you also intend to own your vehicle for say, 8 years at least *wink*... you want *GOOD* paint. not insta-crap paint. proper base coat, clearcoats, all that. like new, like factory. no exception. "you will be made whole"...
okay, since you were also hit, they can't use the scam "we're going to total you and you HAVE to take this"... look up the blue book value. keep that in mind. print out a few ebay motors and other listings for your year and make. keep those handy to refer to during the bidding/negotiations war.
you PROBABLY don't need a lawyer - that's what your insurance is for. really.
reasonable expenses include anything you wouldn't have had to pay for due to this: cabs, rentals (which they should automatically supply), baby sitting, and so on. ka'peesh?
so, they're going to offer numbers. you might have your dealership or your insurance get their own adjuster to look at it. tires, only in pairs. *for safety* - argue "you aren't suggesting i put my pregnant wife and kids at risk? are you? can i have your name for my notes? :>
same for everything else really.
do not sign off ANYTHING, until you are fully happy you've gotten as much money as you can. especially medical. make you scratch off anything that suggests that "this is a done deal"... you want to keep open any chance of reopening this if down the line something happens. like your axle snaps. or you get a sprung vertebrae, etc... i've never signed the "final paper work", and don't cash any low ball checks that show up - doing so is sometimes agreement that you accept the deal as is.
basically, the accident is over. you're safe. the other driver is out of the loop too. your insurance company will only step in if the other insurance company takes too long or drops the ball.
they will try to screw you. fight. they HAVE to make your car like it was before, *or* better. no less.
bladite
- Joined
- Oct 19, 2005
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- 19,793
Thanks Bladite. Do you think they should replace two tires on my truck in order to keep the tread wear even?
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Thanks John. I will admit to being a fairweather Bible fan. IE. Not too learned. Catholics don't really dig into scripture too much. Truthfully, reading it scares the hell out of me. Maybe I should start somewhere besides revelations huh? Although a recent conversation with a forumite (thanks Tom) has given me quite a new perspective on it.
- Joined
- Dec 4, 2005
- Messages
- 851
Andy, yes you should get two new tires. You want to make sure you drive on tires with even wear. This becomes more important as the age of the tires increase. Up here in Ohio, I wouldn't want my wife (or daughter) to drive on tires with one having 50+k miles on it and the other being new for any length of time, especially in the winter. Winters are really rough on tires up here. Keep the old one as a spare or make a swing out of it for your girls.
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- Feb 28, 2003
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- 19,854
yes, this. as i said, it's a safety issue. so say something like this to the insurance adjuster "this is a common practice with tires, to make sure they have the same traction and wear, in pairs. you wouldn't want to put me, or my family - my wife is pregnant, did you know that? or my children at risk... i believe the fact they were paired WHEN your client hit me was critical in maintaining control..."
how can they refuse that? pregnant wife? ''for the children''
evil i know...and then while they're pondering that, get your mechanic to make sure the frame is aligned, and the axles not bent, nor the brakes/pads/calipers... nor the RIMS bent or split or cracked. if the tire was wrecked, so could the rim be. they'll love that. rims don't have to be replaced in pairs.
make sure all the doors and hood and hatch/gate open and close smoothly. often, radiators get jostled and rip, have that checked. did you airbags deploy? if not, why not? check.
you're probably entitled to a new pair of shorts :>
bladite
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Bladite you are the man, bro. I'dda never thought to have the airbag system checked. They didn't go off, and I was glad. Maybe thats a concern. Thanks!
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yar. that's me.
have your mechanic/dealership/etc REALLY go over the car, even if they charge, you, the other guys are paying here. was the car in gear (or course), have the tranny looked at. make sure it shifts well. brakes. the lights, everything. even blinkers.
remember: whole and complete. this includes you and your back and your family. bwahaha.
bladite
- Joined
- Jul 13, 2003
- Messages
- 431
Glad you're OK. Here's some of my recent experience with a minor (but expensive) wreck. I got rear-ended. There was no doubt it was the other driver's fault and there were no injuries. My insurance company said give them a shout if the other company was a serious problem. I never talked with the guy who hit me again, nor did I need to. His insurance company called me that day and we set up an appointment with their adjuster in the next day or so.
The adjuster eyeballed my car and wrote me a check. He said that when I get the car fixed, if there was additional, hidden damage, they'd pay for it but the shop had to call him to have it approved. What they don't want is to pay for unrelated repairs or for upgrades, and that's fair. In theory, this seems fair because that check didn't represent any sort of final settlement and I wasn't asked to sign any sort of release.
Here's his scam: The check *is* a lowball, and they count on people cashing the check, pocketing the money, and never fixing the car. I would have been tempted to just pocket the check except that my exhaust system was bent up some and was loud. I got an estimate on just that but that would use up almost all of the adjuster's low-ball check.
I went to an expensive colllision center (so expensive they don't like to be called "body shop"). Since there was an insurance estimate already, they didn't want to bother looking at the car. They explained that there is ALWAYS additional or hidden damage, especially with this adjuster. However, getting legitimate charges paid for is fairly routine paperwork that they handle. There can be questions over whether they use OEM, aftermarket, or reconditioned parts. The biggest problems are where there is shared blame and when multiple insurance companies disagree about what company pays for which repairs.
One thing they told me was to accept the insurance company's offer to get me a loaner while my car is getting repaired. When the insurance company is paying for the rental, they have a little more incentive to get decisions made on approving those supplemental repairs. The ultimate bill (all payed by the insurance company) was three times the original estimate by the adjuster.
In a case like this, the shop is on your side. They WANT to do more work, use high-end parts, and check everything to make sure it's right, because that gets them paid more. And these guys deal with getting things through the insurance company more than I do.
I think it helped that I had established myself as a real PITA but perhaps not a whiney nutcase. The adjuster was making up stuff about insurance regulations and I called his supervisor to complain. I think the adjuster was scolded to shut me up and keep me from calling the boss any more. If you go up a level, I think it's important to be reasonable, though. It's probably better for the boss to tell the adjuster "the guy just wants his car fixed right" than for him to say "you're right, he is a complainer." (Although either one might work.)
You're probably in a sticky place as far as the tires go. Tread wear can be measured and tire warranties are normally prorated. It's not unreasonable for them to say that the tires were, say, 60% used up, so they'll only pay for 40%. This is where it might be very good for your shop to be uncomfortable about releasing the car to you with mismatched tires due to safety concerns. This is a case where a high-end place can be better.
The adjuster eyeballed my car and wrote me a check. He said that when I get the car fixed, if there was additional, hidden damage, they'd pay for it but the shop had to call him to have it approved. What they don't want is to pay for unrelated repairs or for upgrades, and that's fair. In theory, this seems fair because that check didn't represent any sort of final settlement and I wasn't asked to sign any sort of release.
Here's his scam: The check *is* a lowball, and they count on people cashing the check, pocketing the money, and never fixing the car. I would have been tempted to just pocket the check except that my exhaust system was bent up some and was loud. I got an estimate on just that but that would use up almost all of the adjuster's low-ball check.
I went to an expensive colllision center (so expensive they don't like to be called "body shop"). Since there was an insurance estimate already, they didn't want to bother looking at the car. They explained that there is ALWAYS additional or hidden damage, especially with this adjuster. However, getting legitimate charges paid for is fairly routine paperwork that they handle. There can be questions over whether they use OEM, aftermarket, or reconditioned parts. The biggest problems are where there is shared blame and when multiple insurance companies disagree about what company pays for which repairs.
One thing they told me was to accept the insurance company's offer to get me a loaner while my car is getting repaired. When the insurance company is paying for the rental, they have a little more incentive to get decisions made on approving those supplemental repairs. The ultimate bill (all payed by the insurance company) was three times the original estimate by the adjuster.
In a case like this, the shop is on your side. They WANT to do more work, use high-end parts, and check everything to make sure it's right, because that gets them paid more. And these guys deal with getting things through the insurance company more than I do.
I think it helped that I had established myself as a real PITA but perhaps not a whiney nutcase. The adjuster was making up stuff about insurance regulations and I called his supervisor to complain. I think the adjuster was scolded to shut me up and keep me from calling the boss any more. If you go up a level, I think it's important to be reasonable, though. It's probably better for the boss to tell the adjuster "the guy just wants his car fixed right" than for him to say "you're right, he is a complainer." (Although either one might work.)
You're probably in a sticky place as far as the tires go. Tread wear can be measured and tire warranties are normally prorated. It's not unreasonable for them to say that the tires were, say, 60% used up, so they'll only pay for 40%. This is where it might be very good for your shop to be uncomfortable about releasing the car to you with mismatched tires due to safety concerns. This is a case where a high-end place can be better.
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- 19,793
Thanks for the story FK. I think we're handling it similarly. I went to an expensive collision center too. My dealership doesn't do body work or idda gone there.
My father in law is coming up next Tues. He's a car guy, and can help me determine whether the thing is put together right, and running as it should. Handy as I am, I'm no good with cars.
Bladite, you're a huge help. Thank you Sir!
My father in law is coming up next Tues. He's a car guy, and can help me determine whether the thing is put together right, and running as it should. Handy as I am, I'm no good with cars.
Bladite, you're a huge help. Thank you Sir!
- Joined
- Feb 28, 2003
- Messages
- 19,854
i don't understand why they'd balk on this, except to think they maybe can save $100... i've had both tires replaced without a blink on an accident. including a rim. no problems.
since your whole car is ... used ... when they make it like before, or better, sometimes they'll use aftermarket/used parts and that's often okay. tires... well, they can't easily find a tire with the same wear patterns, and i'm not sure that would be legal. one tire they HAVE to replace. the other tire SHOULD and probably must be matched for safety reasons. simply citing that and asking them to forego safety pushes back on them that it's simply not a cost thing and they are cheaping out on safety - which makes it their issue. 3 month later, that tire fails or doesn't provide balanced traction? one could reasonably argue it's their fault
another thing to say "this is non-negotiable... it's a two tire swap out. period." and the SAME kind as before. you don't put mismatched pairs on a vehicle either. don't offer to "split the difference"
"i was fine before your client hit me, now i'm left with a single new tire, and three old ones? everything i've read says that's not safe, fix it."
stand your ground :>
bladite
- Joined
- Jul 13, 2003
- Messages
- 431
Bladite: I'll confess I don't know what car insurance companies will actually spring for.
I wholeheartedly agree that (unless the tires were brand new with no appreciable wear) you shouldn't replace just one. And I don't think you ought to get stuck with any prorated stuff either. You didn't want to have the wreck. You didn't cause it. You shouldn't have to be cash out of pocket or have to accept a downgrade in your car, especially when it comes to safety or handling. (Now if you were to take this opportunity to switch from steel rims to alloy, then you should pay the difference.)
If the adjuster's estimate only includes one tire, check with the shop to find out if they usually are able to push through the other on a supplement or if you need to nail it down with with the insurance company up front. If your shop doesn't see a problem with mismatched tires, find another shop.
I wholeheartedly agree that (unless the tires were brand new with no appreciable wear) you shouldn't replace just one. And I don't think you ought to get stuck with any prorated stuff either. You didn't want to have the wreck. You didn't cause it. You shouldn't have to be cash out of pocket or have to accept a downgrade in your car, especially when it comes to safety or handling. (Now if you were to take this opportunity to switch from steel rims to alloy, then you should pay the difference.)
If the adjuster's estimate only includes one tire, check with the shop to find out if they usually are able to push through the other on a supplement or if you need to nail it down with with the insurance company up front. If your shop doesn't see a problem with mismatched tires, find another shop.
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- Feb 28, 2003
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- 19,854
i'm of mixed mind on the shop vs getting money thing... i'd want a no hassle supreme up front "bid"... the little stuff typically pops up later. a pro knows what it's going to cost usually. they also know that some things they can talk you out of.
the key phrase is "make me whole, as good or better". there should be no loss - that's theft.
and yes, better doesn't include free upgrades/etc. that's why the maximum up front payment without a shop being involved first. what you choose to fix later is up to you or upgrade.
the shops imho are quite good at getting as much $$$ out of it, that doesn't benefit you necessarily. thus, cash up front. choose what you want fixed. maybe you will sell it as is, maybe you'll make it functional, but not *pretty*
so, what you spend with the repair place ONCE you possess the cash is more interesting :> and better. but they still have to make things 100% or better.
bladite
Here is my whiplash story. I was stuck in construction on I85 south, just past Richmond. It was at a standstill - I was just sitting because everyone was waiting.
There was a guy relieving himself on the side of the road. A young teenager was really interested, and looked at the side of the road, and not in front of her.
Her Nissan hit the back of the Chevy at about 55 or more. My car was tossed a few feet, but hers was not drivable. The kid was 16 and had her licence for about 1 week.
After I saw a Doctor, her insurance co. paid me $500 to waive rights. At this point, I was pretty sure I was OK.
Of course, the guy who caused all the chaos just got back into his car and drove away. I was able to drive back home to Winston-Salem, but the Nissan had to be towed.
I was really pissed off!
There was a guy relieving himself on the side of the road. A young teenager was really interested, and looked at the side of the road, and not in front of her.
Her Nissan hit the back of the Chevy at about 55 or more. My car was tossed a few feet, but hers was not drivable. The kid was 16 and had her licence for about 1 week.
After I saw a Doctor, her insurance co. paid me $500 to waive rights. At this point, I was pretty sure I was OK.
Of course, the guy who caused all the chaos just got back into his car and drove away. I was able to drive back home to Winston-Salem, but the Nissan had to be towed.
I was really pissed off!