Carothers and Guns

[SpyderPhreak]

Currently have a Rugged Oculus, Silencerco Sparrow, OSS (or Huxwrx I forget) RAD22, proto Thompson Machine Zephyr, old ass Huntertown Guardian (rebuffed to titanium).

All are “user serviceable” and it’s really the most horrible thing to do with 22 cans. The new soak cleaners work well and I have 0 concerns about a sealed can at this point

Back in the day when the Outback was available as a non user serviceable and you had to rely on simple green it’s a different story but nowadays, no concerns

I’ve read concerns about lead salts in the waste product using some of the soak cleaners like Breakthrough clean. Lead salts are pretty effin bad shit (like, you can die), and I want no part of it. Need to research further.

I have a good rotary rock tumbler, and an ultrasonic cleaner, so I’m not terribly concerned about the cleaning aspect. About the only thing I’d need to buy would be a pound of SS pins for the tumbler. That’s like $10.

That said, unless I go with the Ti22 in FDE, I’m going to have to wait an unknown amount of time for a restock. The Pluto is currently available through my shop.

This is good info for a lingering concern of mine! Thank you!!

If you would indulge me, what cleaner do you use or recommend? Procedure? Again, thank you!

I was going to ask too.

Here's a link with a quick overview of a few products with general directions on use and process.

There are other products available and a search for "suppressor cleaning solutions" will yield additional information and links along with reviews of each product line, which metals they work on, and their effectiveness.

Hope this helps.

Best Suppressor Cleaning Solvent

Explore the best suppressor cleaning solvents from top brands like HUXWRX, C.A.T, and Mil-Comm. Learn how these specialized solutions simplify maintenance, break down fouling, and protect your silencer's performance.

www.silencershop.com

I read that over the weekend. I was surprised at the number of dedicated cleaners available now, and dumbfounded at the price of some of them lol. $1-$3 per fl. ounce is asinine! (And I’m a cheap mofo lmao…)

 

[M67]

Regardless of how you clean a 22 can, there’s going to be some sort of lead byproduct from it because you’re cleaning lead out of it, everything gets contaminated, I just wear gloves

 

[SpyderPhreak]

Regardless of how you clean a 22 can, there’s going to be some sort of lead byproduct from it because you’re cleaning lead out of it, everything gets contaminated, I just wear gloves

Oh for sure, as with any firearm cleaning. But lead salts (from dissolving lead into solution) are especially nasty, and some of the soak cleaners apparently do that. That shit can be absorbed through your skin and kill you. Further research needed.

 

[510Whisper]

Environmental scientists in the old west...

 

[M67]

Environmental scientists in the old west...

They would just take a little mercury to remove the lead, works in gun barrels so…..

Another can to look at that is lightweight, modern, and might be easier to find, and $399 or less would be the Primary Weapons Systems BDE22. 3D printed titanium core and user serviceable….as long as you’re good with the cigar wrapper style logo

 

[SpyderPhreak]

Another can to look at that is lightweight, modern, and might be easier to find, and $399 or less would be the Primary Weapons Systems BDE22. 3D printed titanium core and user serviceable….as long as you’re good with the cigar wrapper style logo

You know… I saw that one early last weekend, and I’m not sure why I threw it out of the running.

Looking at it again, even though it has 3D printed monocore baffles, I’m OK with that since it can still be taken apart. It fits all my other criteria, is a bit less expensive than the OCL 22Ti (by $40, that’s 10%), it’s DLC coated inside and out (FAR better than PVD, cerakote, or anodized), and it is currently available.

My initial looking at reviews and testing are promising! Several say it’s almost as quiet at the CAT SR/A2 on a pistol, and better than the OCL Ti22! If this all proves true with a bit more digging, I might just go with this one!!!

One thing I’ll give the 3D printed baffles design is that they can be made far more complex than a machined design for less money. In some cases, they can implement designs that cannot be machined, and are more efficient at suppressing noise. This might just be a “have your cake and eat it too” situation!

 

[510Whisper]

"They would just take a little mercury to remove the lead, works in gun barrels so….."

Mad Hatter with a loaded gun!

 

[carnifex knifeworks]

I have 6 22 cans ATM, and will be getting another 2. One for sure is the B&T Tiger 22, it’s solid construction 3d printed so can’t take apart and clean, but with all the “non toxic” cleaner on the market it’s not a big deal. Takes a lot for me to be impressed with a 22 can and the B&T was amazing



Just think of the stuff I don’t post

I believe that the b&t tiger 22 is also rated for 223 or 556. I think I saw it tested on the silencer analytics youtube channel.

I’ve read concerns about lead salts in the waste product using some of the soak cleaners like Breakthrough clean. Lead salts are pretty effin bad shit (like, you can die), and I want no part of it. Need to research further.

I have a good rotary rock tumbler, and an ultrasonic cleaner, so I’m not terribly concerned about the cleaning aspect. About the only thing I’d need to buy would be a pound of SS pins for the tumbler. That’s like $10.

That said, unless I go with the Ti22 in FDE, I’m going to have to wait an unknown amount of time for a restock. The Pluto is currently available through my shop.


I was going to ask too.


I read that over the weekend. I was surprised at the number of dedicated cleaners available now, and dumbfounded at the price of some of them lol. $1-$3 per fl. ounce is asinine! (And I’m a cheap mofo lmao…)

If you don't want a fde can but can't find the black in stock, I would just toss a black suppressor cover on it. They're really nice when heat builds up anyway.

Simple green (full strength) works great at removing carbon build up, but I'm not sure about lead. I've read that if you use it in an ultrasonic cleaner, it removes lead. I haven't tried it though.

Lead salts (lead acetate, lead sulfate, lead chloride, etc.) are very toxic, but if I'm not mistake, there are several cleaning options available that don't create those byproducts.

 

[SpyderPhreak]

Another can to look at that is lightweight, modern, and might be easier to find, and $399 or less would be the Primary Weapons Systems BDE22. 3D printed titanium core and user serviceable….as long as you’re good with the cigar wrapper style logo

You know… I saw that one early last weekend, and I’m not sure why I threw it out of the running.

Looking at it again, even though it has 3D printed monocore baffles, I’m OK with that since it can still be taken apart. It fits all my other criteria, is a bit less expensive than the OCL 22Ti (by $40, that’s 10%), it’s DLC coated inside and out (FAR better than PVD, cerakote, or anodized), and it is currently available.

My initial looking at reviews and testing are promising! Several say it’s almost as quiet at the CAT SR/A2 on a pistol, and better than the OCL Ti22! If this all proves true with a bit more digging, I might just go with this one!!!

One thing I’ll give the 3D printed baffles design is that they can be made far more complex than a machined design for less money. In some cases, they can implement designs that cannot be machined, and are more efficient at suppressing noise. This might just be a “have your cake and eat it too” situation!

I believe that the b&t tiger 22 is also rated for 223 or 556. I think I saw it tested on the silencer analytics youtube channel.

So...

Found a LGS less than 15 minutes from my house with the black PWS BDE 22 in stock for $370. Right on my way to the office too, so stopped by and looked at it this morning. I liked it. Only concern I have whatsoever after hours of researching it last night is the open baffle design is rumored to carbon lock the baffles to the outer tube if you're not careful. I decided I'm OK with that potential issue for a $70 savings vs. the OCL Ti22, and I'll just be proactive and lube the ID of the tube and OD of the baffles before firing and after cleaning. I can live with my 2nd choice. Bought and paid for. Now the jail wait begins!

I might still get the OCL at a later date lol, if it ever gets out of backorder in black.

If you don't want a fde can but can't find the black in stock, I would just toss a black suppressor cover on it. They're really nice when heat builds up anyway.

Simple green (full strength) works great at removing carbon build up, but I'm not sure about lead. I've read that if you use it in an ultrasonic cleaner, it removes lead. I haven't tried it though.

Lead salts (lead acetate, lead sulfate, lead chloride, etc.) are very toxic, but if I'm not mistake, there are several cleaning options available that don't create those byproducts.

I'm too OCD, I can't abide FDE on black/silver guns lmao. I've read a bit about that with Simple Green, but will need to look into it further. Need something that won't be an issue with DLC (I can't imagine too much will hurt DLC). I will need to confirm which cleaners do/do not dissolve lead into lead salts (and which ones aren't super expensive). I want to stay FAR away from that shit!!! Worst case, I'll just tumble-clean the baffles in my rock tumbler with soap and water and 1/4" SS pins.

 

[510Whisper]

Having dealt with stainless fasteners in high temp situations, I used nickel silver based anti-seize to prevent binding and galling. If memory serves, it's good to 2200°F. I still have a 25 year old can laying around. There might be newer formulations like ceramic base that can go even higher. Just something to consider... I use anti-seize on all my threaded barrels to ensure nothing locks up.

 

[SpyderPhreak]

Having dealt with stainless fasteners in high temp situations, I used nickel silver based anti-seize to prevent binding and galling. If memory serves, it's good to 2200°F. I still have a 25 year old can laying around. There might be newer formulations like ceramic base that can go even higher. Just something to consider... I use anti-seize on all my threaded barrels to ensure nothing locks up.

I recently read about a product in passing called suppressor syrup (the syrup part stuck with me... ) that's supposed to prevent carbon locking and thread seizing. Haven't looked at it yet though.

 

[510Whisper]

A dirty little secret in the gun industry is taking off-the-shelf products, rebranding them and jacking up the price. Gun Scrubber is a well know product. It's just trichloroethane (red can brake pad cleaner) in a smaller can at twice the price. Of course, it's nasty stuff and needs to be used with gloves in a well ventilated area, but is very effective at stripping everything off the inards or in the barrel of a gun after cleaning. You may find that with a little research there's less expensive options that will do the job as well or better. BTW, lubricants are another one of those overpriced "gun" products.

 

[clinton1]

Having dealt with stainless fasteners in high temp situations, I used nickel silver based anti-seize to prevent binding and galling. If memory serves, it's good to 2200°F. I still have a 25 year old can laying around. There might be newer formulations like ceramic base that can go even higher. Just something to consider... I use anti-seize on all my threaded barrels to ensure nothing locks up.

Good info on the anti-seize! I’ve always wondered how that would work and good to have some real world experience! Thank you!!

Side note: below is me after my next range day!

 

[SpyderPhreak]

A dirty little secret in the gun industry is taking off-the-shelf products, rebranding them and jacking up the price. Gun Scrubber is a well know product. It's just trichloroethane (red can brake pad cleaner) in a smaller can at twice the price. Of course, it's nasty stuff and needs to be used with gloves in a well ventilated area, but is very effective at stripping everything off the inards or in the barrel of a gun after cleaning. You may find that with a little research there's less expensive options that will do the job as well or better. BTW, lubricants are another one of those overpriced "gun" products.

Yep on both counts. That's why I'm not blindly spending $1-$3 per ounce on some of these products. I might just try to pre-treat the suppressor innards with some Kroil (of which I already have a large can) and see how that works before trying anything else.

Good info on the anti-seize! I’ve always wondered how that would work and good to have some real world experience! Thank you!!

Side note: below is me after my next range day!

View attachment 3136506

SO TRUE!!! That shit gets EVERYWHERE!

 

[M67]

I believe that the b&t tiger 22 is also rated for 223 or 556. I think I saw it tested on the silencer analytics youtube channel.
.

It is, on a bolt gun (slow rate of fire). Have heard/seen people mag dumping on an AR and seems like sometimes it holds sometimes it doesn’t (on high rate of fire)

So...

Found a LGS less than 15 minutes from my house with the black PWS BDE 22 in stock for $370. Right on my way to the office too, so stopped by and looked at it this morning. I liked it. Only concern I have whatsoever after hours of researching it last night is the open baffle design is rumored to carbon lock the baffles to the outer tube if you're not careful. I decided I'm OK with that potential issue for a $70 savings vs. the OCL Ti22, and I'll just be proactive and lube the ID of the tube and OD of the baffles before firing and after cleaning. I can live with my 2nd choice. Bought and paid for. Now the jail wait begins!

That’s the nice part of the design IMO about the BDE, yeah the crud can stick the baffle stack to the tube but least you can just push straight out of the tube since the stack is “pinched” in the tube based on the tapers instead of threading into the tube and trying to rotate the stack when it’s carboned

Serialized part of the can is the DT module too so least if something does get damaged catastrophically it’s a quick repair from PWS

 

[510Whisper]

Anti-seize is famous for that and has been for 50+ years! I was going to mention it but am glad I didn't. Clinton1 came up with the internet winning pic today!

Kroil has been my/our go-to cleaner for as long as I can remember. Most of my cans are sealed. Eight of them are 22 cal, several more in 30 cal, 50 cal and 9mm.

Simple Green and Kroil have been the products we've used the most over the past several decades. I'm sure the new cleaners are fantastic, but where's the formula for a good, inexpensive product that we can use by the gallon without breaking the bank?

Anyone mix their own Ed's Red? I do...

Hopefully some clever young chemist will come to our aid.

BTW, Simple Green Extreme Aircraft & Precision Cleaner or Simple Green Pro HD (purple) are what you want in an ultrasonic cleaner for aluminum. The green will erode the soft metals.

Also, get that PWS in hand before ordering the stainless pins. Don't believe what everyone says... size matters! You don't want to be dealing with pins lodged in that core.

 

[SpyderPhreak]

That’s the nice part of the design IMO about the BDE, yeah the crud can stick the baffle stack to the tube but least you can just push straight out of the tube since the stack is “pinched” in the tube based on the tapers instead of threading into the tube and trying to rotate the stack when it’s carboned

Serialized part of the can is the DT module too so least if something does get damaged catastrophically it’s a quick repair from PWS

I hadn't noticed that about the s/n. Man, good call there on their part!

One thing I also like about the tapered thread assembly design is that if you always assemble it the same way every time (in the order the manual mentions), the notch in the bellows baffles cones is always in the same place for a given firearm. So, POI shift (once sighted in) shouldn't change. My OCD would like to see that notch on the bottom or top, but it is what it is (I'm not trying to shim it so it winds up that way lol).

Anti-seize is famous for that and has been for 50+ years! I was going to mention it but am glad I didn't. Clinton1 came up with the internet winning pic today!

Kroil has been my/our go-to cleaner for as long as I can remember. Most of my cans are sealed. Eight of them are 22 cal, several more in 30 cal, 50 cal and 9mm.

Simple Green and Kroil have been the products we've used the most over the past several decades. I'm sure the new cleaners are fantastic, but where's the formula for a good, inexpensive product that we can use by the gallon without breaking the bank?

Anyone mix their own Ed's Red? I do...

Hopefully some clever young chemist will come to our aid.

BTW, Simple Green Extreme Aircraft & Precision Cleaner or Simple Green Pro HD (purple) are what you want in an ultrasonic cleaner for aluminum. The green will erode the soft metals.

Also, get that PWS in hand before ordering the stainless pins. Don't believe what everyone says... size matters! You don't want to be dealing with pins lodged in that core.

Kroil has been used in Aerospace forever. Before it was easily commercially available, I used to use my shop supply ordering contacts to get some for myself. Now, you can buy it at a lot of auto parts stores and the big river lol.

Simple Green has always been excellent. I remember my dad using it when I was a kid in the 80's. I always have a gallon on hand. I've sent off an email to PWS to ask if there's any cleaners I need to watch out for, so I don't harm the DLC coating. I can't imagine much would hurt it, I know it's pretty damn durable stuff from knife usage, but better safe than sorry.

I firmly believe that some of these new cleaners are charging 1,000% or more than they should be for the product. I won't support that kind of price gouging. Not gonna do it, nope nope, nope.

Oh jeez, Ed's Red. Hadn't heard of that for a minute or two lol! Haven't made any in years. I think I printed out my original copy of that recipe in the early 2000's when I was living in TX.

Yeah, I'm not ordering any SS pins yet. From what I saw briefly today, I think I'd want ~1/8", and not the typical~1/4" for that exact reason.

 

[ferider]

Nice early morning at the range. Testing out my new SD ammo (Speer G2).

Not quite as accurate as 230gr Speer Gold Dot but good enough, I feel. ~10% more impulse, ~20% more energy, elastomer filled nose.

 

[M67]

Was able to talk a bud out of an old NP3 RMR that looks perfect on the VP9 build. Was a good day to sight it in

 

[Ozmose]

Just picked up a new hand cannon today. Can't wait for the damn snow to melt so I can go put some lead through it.