Case Peanut - Major sharpening issues

I think everyone has given some great advice the only thing I would add and hope I haven't missed this in this thread is that the key to learning freehand is simply a lot of practice. When I decided to learn how to freehand I went to Goodwill and bought 10 old kitchen knives for a $1.00 and then bought a couple of bench stones one course and one fine then started practicing. As far as stone I like my DMT bench stones a lot but the truth is the stones that came in your Lansky kit will work fine even for freehand. I have so many different stones it's crazy two shoe boxes and one drawer in my tool box full. I think I started getting good when I stopped being nervous trying so hard to make every stroke the exact duplicate of the last and stiff as a board. I guess I'm saying just loosen up and have fun. I'm by no means a guru of knowledge I can't tell you everything about bevels, grinds, angles and so on. I do most of the time sharpen to the factory grind angle and if I do reprofile it is to around 20 degrees. But I can take a dull knife and turn it into a very sharp knife without scratching up the blade and for me that's all I want to do. As far as videos I would start with dealer made videos and then youtube videos some are good some are bad but really what Carl said about angles and practice is the key. Good luck
 
r redden said:
I think I started getting good when I stopped being nervous trying so hard to make every stroke the exact duplicate of the last and stiff as a board. I guess I'm saying just loosen up and have fun. I'm by no means a guru of knowledge I can't tell you everything about bevels, grinds, angles and so on.
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This!!!!

Too many people over the years have made too much over angles and secondary bevels and the hoodoo making it seem much more complicated than it really is. Especially the makers of the gizmos and gadgets that sell for a lot of money that are not needed. A plain old Norton stone from Home Depot will do it.

Man has been sharpening knives since biblical times with some water and a rock. Some Roman Legionnaire sitting by a campfire used a plain stone on his Gladius. A seasoned mountain man sitting by his campfire used a nice smooth stone on his Green River skinning knife. With a little practice, you can too. Remember, it's all about the money the self styled guru's get. They want you to be intimidated and a bit bewildered by the science of putting a sharp edge on a piece of metal. There's big money in Youtube videos if they get a lot of people to watch. And there's lots of money to made by selling sharpening gizmos that just are not needed.

Relax, have a drink, and approach sharpening as act of something pleasurable, not a difficult chore that has some mysterious skill to be mastered. The worst thing you can do is to take it too seriously, and tense up, and over think it. Don't over think it. Think of it this way, you're sitting in the comfort of your own home, having a nice cold one, and downing at least half of it before starting. You don't have to worry about some Gaul taking your head off in the battle that's coming in the morning, or some hostile 'injun taking your scalp. Have a beer, take the stone in your left hand if you're right handed, and the knife in your right, and find the approximate angle that will be close enough like I said. Start at 90 degrees and half of that and divide again by half and you're close enough. When you start to sharpen in the small circle method, listen to the sound and feel. If you hear the rhythmic shhh, shhh, shhh of the knife blade on the stone as it goes around in a small circle, it should be a relaxing thing. Almost like a kind of meditation. If you get too tense, put it all down and relax for a bit. Then come back when you're ready.

But the bottom line is to take it easy, and relax. It's easier than you think.
 
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Murray Carter is a knife maker well known for his sharpening abilities, using techniques he describes on various DVD's etc. Two things he said really helped me: 1) it doesn't need to be perfect, just better than when you started (useful advice if you tend to be a perfectionist, looking for those precise angles); and 2) it doesn't always get sharp in just one session. Each time you sharpen, you make it a little better (considering #1), until at some point it is scary sharp. I'm also a believer in frequent light sharpening (fine stone), rather than getting the knife dull, and then going through the entire process again.

Good luck! --Larry
 
My experience....

I needed to sharpen a lot of knives on the Lansky before I could get reliable results freehand. Freehand, I like DMT credit card stone for small knives and larger Norton stones for bigger knives. But none of that mattered until I got a feel for making and removing burrs and first double beveling and then convexing an edge and finally learning to hone off a burr.

Some tips for using the Lansky with small knives...

1) pad the vice with several layers of paper to make a shim to allow the thin indent on the vice end to grab the thinner blade spine. Alternatively, wait a year or so for that portion of the Lansky vice to break of. When enough of it breaks off, you can clean up the end and use the non-indented portion of the vice to grab the spine.

2) Take the stones to the hardware store and replace the tall thumb screws with flat head machine screws or at least an allen bolt. Just match the threads to that on the thumb screws. This will allow you to get the stone closer to the vice, which is useful when working on small blades.

And a tip for working on Case knives specifically.
3) I find Case runs their steel on the soft side making hard to hone and too easy to raise a new burr. I would recommend sharpening at 17 DPS (the shallowest Lansky setting) and once you've raised a burr on each side, move to the fine stones and hone at 20 DPS (the next steeper Lansky setting). Use a very, very light touch when using the find stone to hone. All you're looking to do is to remove that burr. After this, I would continue to maintain that edge by doing light touch ups at 20 DPS (until you have the need to redo the whole process). What this will do establish a 17 DPS primary bevel with an easier to hone (and more durable) 20 DPS micro-bevel. In reality, I think the softer Case steel likes the 20 DPS anyhow. If this still doesn't work, move to 25 DPS for your honing. I suspect you're using too much pressure during the honing step.

Lastly...
4) Get a DMT credit card stone and try using that for touch ups. Easy tip. Take a piece of paper and fold it at the corner to make a 45 degree angle. Fold it again and you have a 22.5 degree angle, which is pretty much what you want for that soft steel. Put some tape on that and put it in with your DMT stone and practice holding the blade at that angle. Eventually, you'll gain confidence in the freehand. But for now, set the edge with the Lansky and touch up with a pocket stone.
 
Great advice still coming... This thread really generated a lot of useful tips for me as a new guy to small blades + freehanding. I've been kind of spoiled with the simplicity of the Lansky with "regular" sized blades.

Just before my shift tonight, I picked up a Norton stone (fine/course) from Home Hardware. I'm going to try pinnah's tip to get the small peanut clip blade in the clamp with some paper to set the edge (since I seriously think I fubar'd it) and touch it up on the Norton.

The DMT credit card stones look fantastic and during my road trip to Maine next week, I'm totally going to try and pick some up...

I'll post my results tomorrow hopefully to let you all know how things go.


- Ryan


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A little tough when you have a knife that came out of the box dull, or with uneven grinds, but Scott Gossman told me the key to a sharp knife, was to not let it get dull. Constantly hone that edge, maintain it.

I'm trying to do that, especially when my EDC consists of 154CM, CPM154, CPMS35VN and others.
 
In many cases I actually use my kitchen butchers honing steel to remove burrs does a pretty good job!

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Hey guys. Little update here... So I managed to get the clip point blade of the peanut into the Lansky system and worked at it for about 30-40 minutes at 20 degrees trying to get an edge.

Still nothing at all. At this point I'd choose to sharpen my S30v Paramilitary 2 ten times over this CV blade. I have 154CM, VG10 and 440HC knives that I'm able to obtain an edge without this much trouble.

I'm starting to really think that as mentioned before that there is an issue with the heat treatment.

Looking for any more thoughts or recommendations.

I'll ship this little sucker anywhere in Canada to see if someone can prove me wrong to see if this is sharpen-able.. Once I have an edge I'll be fine, I'm more of a maintain as you go guy, much easier.

- Ryan


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Chizzholm said:
Hey guys. Little update here... So I managed to get the clip point blade of the peanut into the Lansky system and worked at it for about 30-40 minutes at 20 degrees trying to get an edge.

Still nothing at all. At this point I'd choose to sharpen my S30v Paramilitary 2 ten times over this CV blade. I have 154CM, VG10 and 440HC knives that I'm able to obtain an edge without this much trouble.

I'm starting to really think that as mentioned before that there is an issue with the heat treatment.

Looking for any more thoughts or recommendations.

I'll ship this little sucker anywhere in Canada to see if someone can prove me wrong to see if this is sharpen-able.. Once I have an edge I'll be fine, I'm more of a maintain as you go guy, much easier.

- Ryan


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Sorry you're having so much trouble. The bottom line is, you just won't get good result with a "system" on a small knife like a peanut. It needs freehand sharpening. The magic gizmo's have limits.
 
jackknife said:
Sorry you're having so much trouble. The bottom line is, you just won't get good result with a "system" on a small knife like a peanut. It needs freehand sharpening. The magic gizmo's have limits.
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Alright I'm determined... It just seems so much easier to blame the gizmos... Alright, I'm going to tell myself I won't get frustrated and just learn with the freehanding.

I'll keep you all posted on, "Ryan's journey to sharpen a small knife" lol...



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The Lansky will sharpen CV just fine. So will free hand.

If you're used to sharpening S30V, I suspect you are using way too much pressure on the stone.

Are your stones diamond? Doubly go lighter.
 
pinnah said:
The Lansky will sharpen CV just fine. So will free hand.

If you're used to sharpening S30V, I suspect you are using way too much pressure on the stone.

Are your stones diamond? Doubly go lighter.
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That is a gem of sharpening wisdom! Read it over and over, then practice it to see how effective using a light touch can be.
 
pinnah said:
The Lansky will sharpen CV just fine. So will free hand.

If you're used to sharpening S30V, I suspect you are using way too much pressure on the stone.

Are your stones diamond? Doubly go lighter.
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They are just the regular stones! I've only been using the fine grit stone. I'll have to try using very light pressure.

How light are we talking? Much more than the weight of the knife?


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After you have a burr try just the weight of the stone with no pressure. On crock stick type of sharpener it's just riding the stick with no pressure.

BTW Tormac makes a small knife adapter you can use with jig based setups where it clamps the body of the knife not the blade and then the jig mounts were the blade goes in the jig
 
Chizzholm said:
They are just the regular stones! I've only been using the fine grit stone. I'll have to try using very light pressure.

How light are we talking? Much more than the weight of the knife?


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I think that is maybe the issue then, if you want to use the lansky start with the coarsest stone and set the new bevel right, once you have the apex formed, refine to grit you favor.
If you're only using the fine stone your efforts are being in vane because you're refining a non sharp edge.
Don't be afraid to grind on the coarse grit even if you go totally crazy for hours at a time you will only be taking off 1/128 of an inch of metal off the blade, and if you use it everyday hard maybe you'll have to regrind once a year.
 
pinnah said:
The Lansky will sharpen CV just fine. So will free hand.

If you're used to sharpening S30V, I suspect you are using way too much pressure on the stone.

Are your stones diamond? Doubly go lighter.
Click to expand...

Chizzholm said:
They are just the regular stones! I've only been using the fine grit stone. I'll have to try using very light pressure.

How light are we talking? Much more than the weight of the knife?


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If the regular Lansky stones were used on S30V, they might also be glazed (likely are to some degree, I'd bet), which could compound the burring issues, and make cleanly removing burrs difficult. Some of the other wear resistant steels sharpened with them (154CM, 440C, VG-10) might've also contributed to glazing as well. Lansky's small hones have a double handicap, in that a very small abrasive surface area is expected to do a lot of work, and doing so on very wear-resistant steels can kill the regular stones very quickly. I ruined two of mine (glazed and dished) on an S30V blade, in a single rebevelling job, after which they wouldn't cut any steel anymore. When they start getting 'slow' after glazing, it's a natural tendency to press harder, which just makes the burring issues worse.


David
 
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I believe it would be more rewarding for you to get it sharp yourself, but if you can't, send it to me and I will sharpen it for no charge. Then you will just need to maintain it. A crock stick set or sharpmaker is the best system for this, at least in my experience. You can email me for the address.
 
Tilley Knife said:
I believe it would be more rewarding for you to get it sharp yourself, but if you can't, send it to me and I will sharpen it for no charge. Then you will just need to maintain it. A crock stick set or sharpmaker is the best system for this, at least in my experience. You can email me for the address.
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Appreciate the offer Tilley, I'm going to give it a go again this evening and see if any progress is made. I may have to take you up on that offer.

- Ryan


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If OWE is right (and he generally is IME) and the stones are glazed or clogged, you might try scrubbing them with Comet and either a scotch brite pad or old tooth brush.
 
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