Chris Reeve Knives - The Emperor's New Clothes?

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I didn't think it was illogical. I just didn't think it was necessarily to be expected and wondered why someone would think it was.
 
nozh2002 said:
It may have all this tolerance but did this improve performance? I do not think that we all should just stop discissing it permenantely any more because Sal speak up. Why? If this is an only what differs it - I am not impressed. I rather appreciate more Hamon's reply.

I still, like to here simple answer - what is edge thickness?

Thanks, Vassili.
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My answer here is simple. Nobody ever said the Sebenza will out cut any other high end knife. It's not sheer performance that makes the Sebenza a benchmark. Many knives offer better edge geometry or better performing steel. Nobody would argue that.

The Sebenza offers sheer quality. That term involves much more than the simple ability to cut. Not that it can't. Mine came with a fine working edge that holds just as long as any of my other folders and sharpens very nicely, but what makes it special is the air of quality and the little details that you notice during long term use. And, as Sal stated, it's not all mumbo jumbo. They are held to higher tolerances, plain and simple. The little details like the finely tuned pivot bushing that offers rock solid action and lock up every time for countless years is nothing to scoff at. The precise and exact beveling and machining on the handles and blades is flat out unmatched in any other folder I've handled, including customs from well known makers and nearly all major production companies. The little hardened area where the lock bar would normally wear is another detail I've never seen in another knife. There are more subtle details, like the solidarity of the design and the balance of proportions that are less direct, but perhaps even more significant than the details you can pinpoint.

Anyway, my point was that Sal plainly stated that the knife is pricey because it is made to a higher standard. No BS about it, and it shows for people that care to notice. If you want to say that it does not out perform other knives in pure cutting performance, then I agree with you. There are better slicers and better edge retention out there for a lower price, but I can promise it won't match the quality of a Sebenza in most cases, not without exceeding the price range, and even then, I'd have to see it to believe it.

Edit: Well, if I had known that Hamon had already covered all of this, I wouldn't have bothered. That will teach me to not finish reading a thread before I reply. Sorry to be redundant. Not that this subject could get any more redundant, anyway.
 
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Sharp Phil said:
What does one have to do with the other? Why would it be considered "natural" at all?
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Most higher end production (Spyderco, Kershaw, Benchmade, Buck etc) and custom makers offer blade steel choice. i.e. want a 110 in BG42 or a Shallot in CPM110V .. OK. If CRK's only goal is efficiency of manufacture then they would not offer any customization but since they do....it may seem natural to some that they act like other manufacturers and produce runs or offer options of other blade steels.

That they "behave" like other U.S. knife manufacturers (i.e like-kind) seems more "natural" and "logical" to some.
 
J85909266 said:
My answer here is simple. Nobody ever said the Sebenza will out cut any other high end knife. It's not sheer performance that makes the Sebenza a benchmark. Many knives offer better edge geometry or better performing steel. Nobody would argue that.

The Sebenza offers sheer quality. That term involves much more than the simple ability to cut. Not that it can't. Mine came with a fine working edge that holds just as long as any of my other folders and sharpens very nicely, but what makes it special is the air of quality and the little details that you notice during long term use. And, as Sal stated, it's not all mumbo jumbo. They are held to higher tolerances, plain and simple. The little details like the finely tuned pivot bushing that offers rock solid action and lock up every time for countless years is nothing to scoff at. The precise and exact beveling and machining on the handles and blades is flat out unmatched in any other folder I've handled, including customs from well known makers and nearly all major production companies. The little hardened area where the lock bar would normally wear is another detail I've never seen in another knife. There are more subtle details, like the solidarity of the design and the balance of proportions that are less direct, but perhaps even more significant than the details you can pinpoint.

Anyway, my point was that Sal plainly stated that the knife is pricey because it is made to a higher standard. No BS about it, and it shows for people that care to notice. If you want to say that it does not out perform other knives in pure cutting performance, then I agree with you. There are better slicers and better edge retention out there for a lower price, but I can promise it won't match the quality of a Sebenza in most cases, not without exceeding the price range, and even then, I'd have to see it to believe it.

Edit: Well, if I had known that Hamon had already covered all of this, I wouldn't have bothered. That will teach me to not finish reading a thread before I reply. Sorry to be redundant. Not that this subject could get any more redundant, anyway.
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Oh, do not worry - more post like this - better. I just want to understand this knife that it. The fact that there is no any blade play after many years to use is quite impressive as well as no wear in lock bar good to know - you can not find it just handling this knife.

So and I guess this is what is this forum about - not to call each other different names and sharpen your ability to argue, but to share this information. I am more and more considering to get one after your and Hamon's and tsiloics's posts.

Thanks, Vassili.
 
I have a lot of knives, but only a few that I've bought duplicates of. I find the small plain Sebie such a perfect urban knife that I have 3 of them.

contempory.jpg


I've been very happy with my experiences with CR knives and the company.
 
ExMachina said:
man, this thread is like a train wreck

OP started off with a reasonable question...
then he got hammered....
then the hammer-ers got hammered...
then someone got called a name, then somebody got ignored
then someone called someone else another name...
then a mod warning....then some more name calling....then another mod warning...
then someone quoted
Sal​
then someone said STFU...
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You Rock:thumbup: This is the best play by play summary I have ever seen. I cuncur wholeheartedly. People really came out of the woodwork on this one.
To stay on topic though-the small details of the CR knives is where they really shine. I will probably buy another one someday.
 
I got the SR Mountaineer II because I believe this is one of the few hollow handle knives that I would trust. If I am mistaken please tell me. I’m new to the knife forum but this type of thread and the info. that comes up is why I joined.
 
The OP asked a question that could be asked of any maker of knives priced over $200. It's not about the knife much, quality built or not. It's about possessing a status item that relates to the culture they want to be identified with. A more experienced collector appreciates just how hard it is to make one that way - but does acknowledge that it really doesn't do much more than a $50 knife. It just does it in ways they can understand to be superior because of better design, materials, and finish. It's still dollars spent for pennies worth of improved performance.

.005 tolerance is hard to detect with coventional measuring tools, much less tighter. Almost no one can identify knife steel by sight, much less spectroscopically. Still, the best built knife with the best materials may be one that doesn't meet someone's needs.

I view knives for features offered in design vs. price, and go from there. I don't see that S30V and a Titanium framelock are necessary for casual EDC at all. If they fell off the face of the earth, very little difference would result - just like whether you drove a Ferrari or an Chevy coupe. You'd still get there.

High end knives are about catering to image and ego, and CRK is doing well with that, just like Mercedes, Rolex, and Macy's. It is about branding and building a reputation, as Spyderco well knows.
 
Dont worry about your knife, you got yourself a fine knife that should serve you well for many years.

This type of discussion will pop up from time to time after somebody destroys a knife by doing completely unreasonable things with it. That tends to be very misleading to new buyers. When somebody tries to go after a brand like Chris Reeve, try to see through all the BS and you will realize that CRK makes a darn fine knife.

x-10 said:
I got the SR Mountaineer II because I believe this is one of the few hollow handle knives that I would trust. If I am mistaken please tell me. I’m new to the knife forum but this type of thread and the info. that comes up is why I joined.
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tirod3 said:
I don't see that S30V and a Titanium framelock are necessary for casual EDC at all. If they fell off the face of the earth, very little difference would result - just like whether you drove a Ferrari or an Chevy coupe. You'd still get there.

High end knives are about catering to image and ego... .
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No. The concept of "high end" is about catering to image and ego.

Plenty of people drive built cars in spite of the attention they draw, and plenty of people carry refined knives unbeknownst to all but themselves.

Driving an advanced car is not about "getting there", it's about driving. Owning such a car does not make anyone better than anyone else. If you do own such a car for that reason, the joke's on you.

If TI framelocks and Ferraris fell off the face of the earth, a great deal of difference would result, just not in terms that you personally care for - which is fine.
 
Sharp Phil said:
I didn't think it was illogical. I just didn't think it was necessarily to be expected and wondered why someone would think it was.
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Troll's never supply good info........Lunchladys try to call people out.....which are you???:jerkit:


I've carried many knives, but I finally found the one that I will stick with in the Sebenza. The fine machining, the lockup, edge retention, and edge ability are the best I've seen!

Opinions may vary, but this is mine!:D
 
patrickcudd said:
Troll's never supply good info........Lunchladys try to call people out.....which are you???:jerkit:


I've carried many knives, but I finally found the one that I will stick with in the Sebenza. The fine machining, the lockup, edge retention, and edge ability are the best I've seen!

Opinions may vary, but this is mine!:D
Click to expand...

Well....we now know which one you are. and by your own definition.
 
Driving an advanced car is not about "getting there", it's about driving. Owning such a car does not make anyone better than anyone else. If you do own such a car for that reason, the joke's on you.

Not so much a joke when I drive a car with such an advanced drive train I can out accelerate 95% of traffic in the snow, and go up 35% muddy grades. Superior performance does reflect on the person - it's why I drive a Jeep.

It also didn't take 10 years wages to own one.

But a $400 knife doesn't do that unless you do push it to extremes, not drive it around on nice dry streets. Sebenza owners don't push their knives to the edge of performance - according them, they fiddle around in the kitchen with them or scrape insulation off copper wire, at best. Then, back in the pocket sheath.

If some do use a knife at the limits of it's ability, then it's decried as abusive, and knives marketed to do that are for mall ninjas.

The point of a Ferrari isn't to cruise to the mall in style - you could do that in an Escalade. It's driving the bejeezers out of it - and most don't, just like all the posers driving other sports cars, like Corvettes and Porsches. I pass them in my Jeep during the summer and laugh - where are they NOW in the freezing rain?

Same with knives - show up to do some serious work, the pretty knives stay in the special pocket sheath so they don't get scratched. The working knives come out and do the job.

One of mine is a $400 S30V titanium framelock and earns it's keep. It reallly isn't 8 times better than a $50 knife - certainly 3 or 4 times, but the rest is image and ego.

I'm just honest enough to admit it.
 
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