Chris Reeve's no-flick policy

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Personally, I'm not a CRK fan, but the opinion I can give you is- If "flicking" your knife open is considered abuse, it's not a hard use knife to begin with. My favorite folder is a Crucible and it's as smooth or smoother than any Sebenza I've ever held and I only ever flick it to deploy it. The point being, if I pay $300+ for a folder that claims to be hard use, I better be able to open it with a small explosion if I want to and not have to worry about flicking being considered abuse. Hacking on a cinder block is abuse. Flicking is reasonable use.
 
Slightly off-topic, but maybe related... What about assisted-opening knives? Those can open with quite a bit of velocity (seems at least as fast as flicking a blade open). My Cryo and Mini-Barrage both fly open really fast and slam resoundingly into the stop pin and lock. The sudden stop of some heavier blades (eg. ZT 300) feels like it could jerk the knife out of your hand if you didn't have a decent grip on it.
 
TotinCh1p said:
I don't know, I get what you're saying, however, your analogy isn't apt. Using a Porsche's motor in the operating range is acceptable. Saying "Here is your new Porsche, refrain from constant burn-outs" would better suit the topic.
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I still think it is apt. Operating above 2500 rpm is unnecessary and puts extra strain on engine components. Should a Porsche be able to handle that? YES! Yet, this is the exact same argument CRK uses against flicking. Any knife should be able to handle it, regardless of whether it is "necessary" or not. :rolleyes:


Don't get me wrong. I really like my Sebenza and appreciate the craftsmanship that goes into them, but it does not make sense to me that my $50 Kershaws and $250 Ti ZTs can be flicked 10,000+ times and still keep their warranty, but a $400 CRK cannot. :confused:
 
solidorange said:
Any knife should be able to handle it, regardless of whether it is "necessary" or not. :rolleyes:
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Except for the many knives which developed horrid bladeplay when I was a silly youth who thought that flicking knives was "cool."
It does accelerate wear...there's no way around that solid fact.
Some companies just don't mind replacing parts every so often due to it.
 
Maybe the question really is ,how many knives are getting sent back to CR because of flicking? if you pay that kind of $$$$ for a pocket knife should you be able to flick your knife and still have the company's blessing? :sorrow:
 
stabman said:
Except for the many knives which developed horrid bladeplay when I was a silly youth who thought that flicking knives was "cool."
It does accelerate wear...there's no way around that solid fact.
Some companies just don't mind replacing parts every so often due to it.
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Correct, and I expect any company that charges $400+ for a knife to be on that list.
 
BITEME said:
if you pay that kind of $$$$ for a pocket knife should you be able to flick your knife and still have the company's blessing? :sorrow:
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How about you start your own compnay and tell us? ;)
Seriously though, the owner of the company gets to make the rules.
When the rules are up front for everyone to see, then whining becomes silly.
If they hid the rules then refused to service the knife, it would be an issue, but that isn't the case.
 
stabman said:
Strider does...but you pay about $150 more than the knife is really worth for this.
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Let's not debate knife worth in here. That could get ugly. Take the ZT 0560 for example:

Design - Hinderer, 'nuff said.
Ti Frame Lock - Check.
Smooth Opening - Due to KVT, probably more so than the Sebenza, check.
Blade Steel - Elmax, even higher end than any CRK, check.
Flickable - Check, and you keep the warranty.
Dissasembly - Allowed, with warranty.
Fit and Finish - CRK gets the edge here, but not by much.
Price - Sebenza, minus $150.

In the end, a knife is worth what someone will pay. This includes CRK, Strider, ZT, and every mall ninja knife ever made.


What we haven't done here is get to the heart of the problem. Why does CRK feel that their knives cannot stand up to the "abuse" that other brands can? And, if it is such a problem, why don't they find a way to fix it instead of using this crazy policy to protect themselves? I personally think a CRK would be just fine even if you flicked it all day, but I still won't do it because I can't risk being told that my $400 investment is no longer covered by warranty if something ever goes wrong.
 
solidorange said:
What we haven't done here is get to the heart of the problem. Why does CRK feel that their knives cannot stand up to the "abuse" that other brands can? And, if it is such a problem, why don't they find a way to fix it instead of using this crazy policy to protect themselves? I personally think a CRK would be just fine even if you flicked it all day, but I still won't do it because I can't risk being told that my $400 investment is no longer covered by warranty if something ever goes wrong.
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Well, ZT gets knives sent back due to vertical play after people flick them.
Emerson has people send knives back after the liner walks across the tang due to flicking/waving.
CRK just doesn't want to have to deal with that, and I don't blame them.

But each knife buyer must make their own choice as to purchase and use, and live with the consequences.:)
 
stabman said:
Well, ZT gets knives sent back due to vertical play after people flick them.
Emerson has people send knives back after the liner walks across the tang due to flicking/waving.
CRK just doesn't want to have to deal with that, and I don't blame them.

But each knife buyer must make their own choice as to purchase and use, and live with the consequences.:)
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Even if our opinions differ, I would like to thank you for keeping your arguments civil and objective. I have seen way too many of these kinds of threads go off the deep end because people get entirely too defensive and personal.

To each their own! :thumbup:
 
stabman said:
Well, ZT gets knives sent back due to vertical play after people flick them.
Emerson has people send knives back after the liner walks across the tang due to flicking/waving.
CRK just doesn't want to have to deal with that, and I don't blame them.

But each knife buyer must make their own choice as to purchase and use, and live with the consequences.:)
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I understand not wanting to deal with that but with the price point of the knife i dont think he should have much of a choice if its within reason. Think about it i mean zt fixes their 200-300$ knives no issues, but CRK wont fix their 410$ knife that most people would be too scared to flick even if it was allowed. I think more then anything this is the i want to because i cant thing going on though.

Alot of people who get mad because they cant flick their CRK without voiding their warranty but if you told them to flick it alot of them would turn right around and say now why would i want to flick it?
 
solidorange said:
Let's not debate knife worth in here. That could get ugly. Take the ZT 0560 for example:

Design - Hinderer, 'nuff said.
Ti Frame Lock - Check.
Smooth Opening - Due to KVT, probably more so than the Sebenza, check.
Blade Steel - Elmax, even higher end than any CRK, check.
Flickable - Check, and you keep the warranty.
Dissasembly - Allowed, with warranty.
Fit and Finish - CRK gets the edge here, but not by much.
Price - Sebenza, minus $150.

In the end, a knife is worth what someone will pay. This includes CRK, Strider, ZT, and every mall ninja knife ever made.


What we haven't done here is get to the heart of the problem. Why does CRK feel that their knives cannot stand up to the "abuse" that other brands can? And, if it is such a problem, why don't they find a way to fix it instead of using this crazy policy to protect themselves? I personally think a CRK would be just fine even if you flicked it all day, but I still won't do it because I can't risk being told that my $400 investment is no longer covered by warranty if something ever goes wrong.
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ELMAX is roughly the same price per pound as CPM S35VN or the same depending.

CRK designed their knives, they make their knives, they sell their knives so they can choose to warrant them anyway they want.

They just don't cover abuse from the information I have just like many other companies, even Strider had to change it's Warranty in the past few years due to different reasons.

For as why CRK doesn't do something call Chris Reeve and ask him..... ;)
 
Smokinape said:
lol @ a no flick policy... that is worse than Cold Steel's marketing...
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lol, give cold steel a sebenza could you imagine what their advertisement would be? Stabbing car hoods and barrels but there would be a big warning and someone would flick it open and the knife would catch on fire "Impervious to everything, Except opening"
 
stabman said:
Well, ZT gets knives sent back due to vertical play after people flick them.
Emerson has people send knives back after the liner walks across the tang due to flicking/waving.
CRK just doesn't want to have to deal with that, and I don't blame them.

But each knife buyer must make their own choice as to purchase and use, and live with the consequences.:)
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Exactly, it really isn't all that hard to get a framelock to go out of specs and develop issues, I don't care who made it.

I am not talking about failing, just out of spec....

That's based on my own testing of a lot of knives over the years.

That's why this thread is really so funny... ;)

If people don't believe that, they can send me their knife they think won't and I will ship it back to them at their expense rattling so they can experience that...
 
Ankerson said:
Exactly, it really isn't all that hard to get a framelock to go out of specs and develop issues, I don't care who made it.

I am not talking about failing, just out of spec....

That's based on my own testing of a lot of knives over the years.

That's why this thread is really so funny... ;)
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What do you mean by out of spec?
 
chrisfa said:
What do you mean by out of spec?
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Developing any kind of play, lock travel etc.

I have pushed enough framelocks over the years to know how easy it really is to get them to that point, even to the point of having them rattle.
 
In the end if one treats and uses a CRK with care and respect it will last them their lifetime and likely their kids lifetimes.
 
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