Collaborations.....

[Stephen F]

I think $1,750 is in the ballpark.

Who ever ends up with it, if you want to sell it, I am interested.

P

I'll see your $1750 and raise ........

Stephen

 

[ptgdvc]

I'll see your $1750 and raise ........

Stephen

Stephen,

You must unaware of the thin elephant ivory spacer that Russ Andrews added to the Stag handle, in order to prevent the exportation of an American national treasure.


P

 

[Joss]

Hmm... I suspect that people here are slightly over-optimistic. I would put the value of this piece sub-$1,500, maybe no more than Steven's lower end of the range.

 

[Stephen F]

Hmm... I suspect that people here are slightly over-optimistic. I would put the value of this piece sub-$1,500, maybe no more than Steven's lower end of the range.

........ I think we may be watching the floor of the "market" value being set

Stephen

 

[RogerP]

Hmm... I suspect that people here are slightly over-optimistic. I would put the value of this piece sub-$1,500, maybe no more than Steven's lower end of the range.

We're talking the BF Bowie here, right? If the winner offered that to me at $1,500, I'd take it in a nanosecond. Or less.

Roger

 

[Kohai999]

Hmm... I suspect that people here are slightly over-optimistic. I would put the value of this piece sub-$1,500, maybe no more than Steven's lower end of the range.

If they are willing to pay "X-price" for the B.F.B., Joss, than they are not over-optomistic.....they/we/me are setting a valuation....just like you. It is ALWAYS a valuable exercise, especially here, because we can compare notes. If the low value end is established at $1,250......that would work, if for nothing else, insurance value.....BUT if it sells(right!!) for $3,000, and another collector or two are offering above that to own it....what is it worth?

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson

 

[HTMD]

As far as the MS dagger collab, you said that you sniped it, so my guess is between $1,750 and $2,000. For that price, it would be fantastic value.

Actually, I better go look and confirm what I paid for it but it was a definite good value. That's not what interests me about this collaboration.

The bladesmith whom I quoted about these types of collaborations makes an interesting and potentially accurate observation from an insider perspective.

I suspect the quality of workmanship varies over time and sometimes (as in this case, IMO) there's some chemistry that happens yielding a better than average result. Still, I'm not invested in defending its value or lack thereof. It remains to be seen I guess, what the aftermarket would do with something like this.

The beautiful and exotic plush-lined presentation box where this dagger lives sure is a nice plus. It's handmade by a guy in Africa from a variety of fine native woods and on the inside of the lid there is a nice plaque with names and dates and stuff like that - very nice package really.

So, moving beyond the dollars, what do you think? What are the liabilities and who/where is the market for this type of collaboration. Can anybody break it down for us?

 

[Kohai999]

So, moving beyond the dollars, what do you think? What are the liabilities and who/where is the market for this type of collaboration. Can anybody break it down for us?

I like it. It is well crafted, and an excellent example to the things that can go right in a collaboration.


Other than that, I will not attempt to speak about this type of collaboration.

CALLING WOODWORK GHOST!!!!!

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson

 

[HTMD]

As a side note, I wonder how well the ABS Board knives do in the aftermarket. I suspect that with Moran sadly gone, they're going to loose a lot of their appeal.

I'll take the bait. This one is mine.

I couldn't hazzard a guess as to the impact of Moran's death, in the near or far term. I mean, who knows? Still, this is a collaboration but with a twist. The MS collaboration dagger is really a 'low-level' type - up and comers who just got their MS stamp. The ABS Board knife is what I would call a 'high-level' collaboration, the 18th in a series that ends at 19 in terms of Moran's involvement.

I've seen at least one of these for sale in the after market recently, can't remember where but it didn't do anything for me. Can't remember the asking price either. How might one go about appraising the value of this blade. If I drop dead and 'my attractive wife' has to sell it to pay my funeral expenses... well?

 

[HTMD]

CALLING WOODWORK GHOST!!!!!

Good call, let's ask him.

 

[Kohai999]

....Can't remember the asking price either. How might one go about appraising the value of this blade. If I drop dead and 'my attractive wife' has to sell it to pay my funeral expenses... well?

You go with your gut and balls, lick your thumb and call it.

I say $5,500, but could go as high as $7,999....I don't think higher is warranted....what say the rest of you?

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson

 

[Stephen F]

I've seen at least one of these for sale in the after market recently, can't remember where but it didn't do anything for me. Can't remember the asking price either. How might one go about appraising the value of this blade. If I drop dead and 'my attractive wife' has to sell it to pay my funeral expenses... well?

Buddy, IMHO one of, if not the, nicest of the Moran based board knives. But I am going to turn this on its head and ask you a direct question:

"When you bought this at the Blade Auction did you bid based on what you thought it was worth? Or did you know how much you where prepared to "donate" in return for a truly collectable piece of functional art, with little consideration of its aftermarket value?"

Your response is important inorder to put its current "value" in context.

Stephen

 

[Keith Montgomery]

I think most board knives are over bid on. It is a way of supporting the ABS, and having something to show for it.

 

[ptgdvc]

If I drop dead and 'my attractive wife' has to sell it to pay my funeral expenses... well?

Buddy,

If it was only up to me, you would be meeting your maker from the inside of a large Zip-Lock bag.

Realistically, I would go with STeven's appraisal.

Best,

Peter

 

[Les Robertson]

Hi STeven,

The Ghost is in!

First, look at those reading this thread right now:

WoodWorkGhost, ptgdvc, RogerP, Russ Andrews, Kohai999, DWinkler, Shing

Interesting group wouldn't you say.

As with any collectible you have to build a market past the primary market.

Back when John Fitch was hot, I bought a couple of the Crowell/Fitch collaborations and sold them immediately.

As I have said numerous times before the makers have to keep their names out there (even when they are years back logged). Jim and John have not done this, their reasons are their own. Fact is Crowell and Fitch knives are "slow" movers in the aftermarket.

The ABS Board knife that was up for auction in Chicago did not meet its reserve and was pulled from the Auction.

I agree that most people who buy the Board knives are doing so to support the ABS (wonder what they do with all that "profit" they make on those knives?). Almost without exception the prices paid are, in the short term (10 years) are not going to be realized in the after market for any significant profit.

As most of you have pointed out to me time and time again, custom knives are not an "investment" as such I don't see what the concern is about any of these knives. Surely your not spending several thousand dollars hoping the knives will go up in value. I am now putting away my soap box.

A very valid point has been brought up about the collaborations.

I think what it takes to make the knife really desirable is to have makers of equal stature to work on the knife. Obviously a Dean/Fisk or a Feugen/Hancock knife would be super hot! The prices would at a minimum go for what their least expensive knife would sell for. The Ceiling would eventually be set by collectors.

One of the problems with the Board knives is that there are too many makers working on them. If 10 guys are working on a knife how much work can any one of them really do on the knife?

You guys have brought up the good and the bad in this thread.

To sum up:

Collaboration knives to bring a synergistic price have to feature two makers of equal status/desirability for the knife to be worth more than the maker could get on his own.

Auction knives (for the good of an organization) seldom if ever will recoup the original auction price in the aftermarket.

WWG

 

[RogerP]

WWG - I think you are spot on about makers of equal status and not too damned many of them on one knife.

On a related note - I sure hope we do another BFBowie - or fighter or camp knife or something.

Roger

 

[HTMD]

Or did you know how much you where prepared to "donate" in return for a truly collectable piece of functional art, with little consideration of its aftermarket value?"

Yes, no doubt that is the case. But I wouldn't have bid to win if I didn't like it in the first place.

To me, this one really had something special going on with it. Everybody knew Bill Moran's days were numbered, yet he was able to be personally involved in this project which I think affected and effectively raised the standards for all the collaborators. These men have known each other for many years and Moran was their spiritual leader, pioneering hero and steadfast defender. It was the last time for all of them to do something like this together, with Bill.

 

[Kevin Jones]

I valuate it at between $1,250 and $1,750 .

STeven Garsson

I've heard quite a few estimates form VERY knowledgeable Bowie enthusiast, makers and dealers over the last six months as to the BF Bowie's value and even more enthusiast state how much they would be willing to pay and none were in the your range stated above. Most not even close.

I'm not giving my opinion on this, however may be interesting to hear other's opinions in this last week of ticket sales.

 

[Les Robertson]

Hi Kevin,

What prices are the knowledgeable people giving you?

WWG

 

[Habber]

I have just one collaboration piece.I like what I refer to as 'milestones'.First,last,only,etc...(I have a 1957 Panhead...last year of the rigid frame,my favorite bike would be a '48 Panhead...last year of the springer front end,and first year for the Panhead)I digress.
As a newer collector,I have only recently started thinking of resale and holding value to others.When this piece became available to me what made it all that more enticing was that it was Don and Anders' first collaboration,couple that with at the time both makers were on my list of must haves.Add to that,I had previously met them both and really enjoyed their company.Also,in my eyes,both of them are top of the heap makers.
Taking all that into consideration I splurged and scooped it up.Even with all the positives(in my opinion)I still struggled with the decision as it was,and is,the most expensive knife I have bought,and I probably could have gotten one from each instead.
In the end I'm glad I did get it,It's a great piece,by 2 great knife makers,and I think if I had to part with it it would retain it's value.
As for collaborations in general,it seems that there are a lot of intangibles that go into the idea of value(at least I think so).If theres enough there for someone to percieve it then I'd say go for it.That kind of applies across the board to knife collecting it seems.

Anyway,here's my collaboration piece:

I think it's great!oh yeah...Don Hanson/Anders Hogstrom