Cost of equipment

you can afford gear to get out in the hills on any budget imo

lot's of folks spend their hard earned $ on camping gear because that's what they like to do in their free time, some people spend it on fancy golf clubs, or bowling balls, or how about......... knives :)

there is really no reason to buy brand new gear at top price- w/ e-bay, craigslist and all the different for sale forums- lots of quality gear for much less than retail

then there is the whole myog movement- free patterns and lots of free advice- a little time and a sewing machine is all that is needed

my "$100" poncho was picked on ebay for $30, just one of many good deals I've been able to score because I knew what I was looking for and spent the time looking for it

as someone mentioned above, you do often get what you pay for- there are a few things I think are worth spending a little $ on- one being a quality sleeping bag- a good down bag will last 15-20 years or more, a sleeping bag is an area I wouldn't go too cheap on- again I'd recommend looking used (easy to wash a down bag)
 
I just used .to buy the best I could afford. As years went by, and my financial situation got better ,I replaced my mediocre items with better quality ones. I used to only have a $20 pup tent ,a Mora or 2 , cheap fishing rod, K-mart sleeping bag , wool blanket , and my wits ( most important!

Now I use a $350 sleeping bag , a bunch of $ 100-200 knives , $150 boots , $300 tent , and a $38,000 Jeep to get me there. I worked hard my entire life to get these things because they are the things I like the most. Back in my frugal days, I still had as much or more fun with all the cheap gear. I actually revelled in the fact I was living in the bush for days or weeks at a time with like, $50 worth of gear. Those were some of the best times I ever had. It's not the gear that makes the trip good though. It's where your at and what you do with your time in the bush.
 
Ferrousknight said:
What is bad is when you're trying to buy a full set of gear all at the same time
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It definitely sucks when you are there. Don't forget that many folks are not college aged, rather I think the mean age in this parts is 40 something. We've been around the block a few times so its not so bad when you pick your battles per say and buy an expensive item one at a time.

A $100 silnylon tarp is not so hard to swallow when you own a bunch of other elements needed for tarp tenting, but I wouldn't prioritize an ultralight tarp off the bat (I still don't have one, rather mine is the mid-grade polyurethane coated nylon variety). As Mentor said, there is always the $10 blue tarp which works great with the only issue being their compressibility (contrast to what most people think, a 6 x 8' blue tarp isn't really heavy at all).

I'm also a firm believer in that it is better to learn on mid-grade gear first and discover what features you really want and care about. I even went backwards on a few things. I started out with a, at the time, high end MSR whisperlite stove, and now I pretty much only use an alcohol stove or home made twig stove for cooking.

Gear choices are a bit about discovery, getting some good dirt time and finding out what works for you. Some folks are totally into modifying their gear while others take a 'trade-up' mentality to acquire what they want. Others are just satisfied with what they have. All in all, your use patterns dictate the minimum standards of what you need, your experience dictates what works best for you and that little bit of consumerism side of you is always searching for what might be a better solution.

Codger_64 said:
And the gearheads with disposable income frequently sell their almost new but out of style gear at half of retail or less. You can also post your own "want to buy" ads on this and most other outdoor sites.
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Ha, true enough! I still get a kick (and I own one by circumstance of a trade) all the knives with matching firesteel handles.
 
1000 dollars on your back? Easily. Some people pour 1000 dollars into just the pack. Run over to the ESEE forums and see how much money some of those guys tote just with that brand name screen printed on it...

When I buy gear, I shop til I find a price I can afford- IE the lowest price I can find on froogle. If I still can't afford it, I sit on ebay and craigslist for a week or two until I DO catch that weekday ender when everyone is at work and scoop a sleeping bag or tent or pack for less than half the retail price. Alot of it you can buy off-season. Alot of fancy dancy gear you dont' need-lately I've been taking a yard long piece of tinfoil and a 1.48 stainless steel 2 pint camp mug that I bought at the grocery store-came with a lid. You don't need a hundred dollar titanium cook set. Mine is just as light, just as functional, just as compact and costed me 1 100th of what many people spend. And Rome wasn't built in a day, I'm using some gear I've had since I was 12 years old camping in Wisconsin.
 
You wanna talk cheap, I'll give you a list of what I run with:
Hammock-$6 CTD
Poncho-Army/Navy Surplus-$13
Mos Netting-$8 (split a large fabric with friend)
Hobo stove-free I made it from a Coffee can I found
Alcohol stove-$0.75 (bought a mt dew, made it myself)
Fuel- Heet $1.18, PGA (Everclear) $13
Toilet trowel-$2.88 Dick's sports
FAK-homemade cost $35
Suunto Map compass-$20
Becker BK2- $60
ESEE 3- $90
Boonie Hat-$15
Hobo Kit- Free, pick up spare plasics at Fast Food
550 cord-$5
Various clothing-$60

Talk about cheap, don't have $300 in my whole kit. I love being a hillbilly. Still got all my teeth though. Life is what you make of it my friend, somefolks drive Ferraris, others walk, its all in what you want. Be cool. Moose
 
Here in Tucson, there is lots of good camping equipment at the thrift stores. Not as much now with craigslist and eBay, but there is still some bargains to be had. Where ever there is a big outdoors scene there is going to be people upgrading or getting rid of their old gear.

For instance I recently got an almost unused Katadyn Pocket water filter at a thrift for $4.95.

Chad
 
"buy quality, cry once" that's NOT being elitist... just a little experience that many times the cheap stuff may work poorly or fail easily. and quality ain't always expensive... because the quality stuff lasts, you may be able to find someone selling an older, high quality item with lots of use left in it.

end of season closeouts, ebay and other online marketplaces can be good sources for stuff at far less than it cost new.

and being able to hear the reviews of other people on what gear works and what's crap, what's "THE best" and what's "the best for the money". you don't need to gear up a;; at once, many people get their gear over many years... but avoiding the cheap junk will usually save you money in the long run.
 
I dunno. I dropped bones on a pair of Borns, a company that is supposed to make one of the most comfortable and bombproof shoes in existance, and they fell apart on me today after three weeks. Their customer service is being cranky, saying it was 'typical wear and tear' which is not warranteed. How can shoe failure after less than a month be typical wear and tear when people are telling me they've been using theirs hard for 7-8 years? In this day and age you can still cry after buying the best...
 
....another great resource is REI, if you become a member they have twice a year sales on the goodies that are returned as part of their no questions policy on returns...I scored a Delorme PN-30 GPS for 50 bucks, fleece blankets for five bucks and my beloved Montrail GTX hiking boots for 22 dollars. Now I had to wait for five years to put all this together on my budget but its all well spent, when I am cozy in those big ol' Sequoia's.
 
moosez45 said:
You wanna talk cheap, I'll give you a list of what I run with:
Toilet trowel-$2.88 Dick's sports
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whoah, big spender! :eek:

check out the Gerber/Fiskars zytel garden trowel, it's 97¢ at Wal-Mart :D

and i think it's got a better shape than the ones sold for camping, and you could store stuff in the hollow handle.

also handy for prospecting with a metal detector.
 
PayetteRucker said:
I dunno. I dropped bones on a pair of Borns, a company that is supposed to make one of the most comfortable and bombproof shoes in existance, and they fell apart on me today after three weeks. Their customer service is being cranky, saying it was 'typical wear and tear' which is not warranteed. How can shoe failure after less than a month be typical wear and tear when people are telling me they've been using theirs hard for 7-8 years? In this day and age you can still cry after buying the best...
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yes, but buying quality usually means you'll have fewer problems, and less "wasted money" if/when you decide to upgrade later.

and high price doesn't always equal high quality.

you can find quality cheap, but it's rare to find it at Harbor Freight.

dunno, an issue like the one you have seems to be more about "customer no service" a good company should stand behind the product and replace it if there's a problem with it. too bad ESEE doesn't make boots!

If you are unhappy with your order you may return your purchase within 30 days of shipment for a refund or exchange. Shoes must be in original condition to be accepted for returns/exchange (unless defective). Beyond 30 days, our products are guaranteed against defects and workmanship.
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i'd send them back to them TOMORROW, with confirmation delivery and a written letter saying you expect a refund or exchange. if they're three weeks old it's worth a few bucks to try and make them honor their guarantee. :D
 
fixer said:
whoah, big spender! :eek:

check out the Gerber/Fiskars zytel garden trowel, it's 97¢ at Wal-Mart :D

and i think it's got a better shape than the ones sold for camping, and you could store stuff in the hollow handle.

also handy for prospecting with a metal detector.
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I own several of those Fiskars trowels...somewhere. They're very nice and light and pretty durable. I looked at the folding stainless ones, but the beefier, well built looking ones weigh quite a bit and have a higher price tag than I want on something that's just going to dig catholes. I didn't think of putting anything in the handle, though. That's a good idea. I can see it now...

"so I wandered away from my pack to crap in the woods and got disoriented due to the fumes. After stumbling several hundred feet and slipping into a steep gully, I found myself at least a day's hike from my pack. Fortunately, the cathole shovel I was still holding on to was equipped with a full micro survival kit hidden in the handle."

Lets send that to the producers of Man vs. Wild. :D
 
i have that same walmart trowel, mine still has the barcode / sticker on it, guess i need to use it. heck of a deal at .97 cents.
 
Ferrousknight said:
What is bad is when you're trying to buy a full set of gear all at the same time- like I have been. You can buy cheap now, but if you decide to upgrade in only a year or two, you've lost money over buying the "upgrade" from the get-go.
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I don't think buying cheap to start out with is a bad way to go. Our backpacking packs start at $200 and go way up from there. Would I recommend one to someone backpacking for the first time? Hell yeah, I'm a businessman. Just kidding, I'm not quite that bad. I send people to WalMart, Goodwill, etc., all day long.

Make sure that you like doing something before dropping $1000 on gear that will go straight to ebay after a few months. After you use a $40 WalMart sleeping bag on a few trips, you will appreciate a 32 degree bag that is the size of a coconut when compressed. Do you need the nicer gear? Of course not. Do any of us need anything we buy beyond the items keeping us alive? Of course not. I work so I can afford to spend time doing the things I enjoy, and nice gear tends to make my trips in the outdoors more enjoyable.
 
It's not that people are being elitist, it's just that you get what you pay for. Good gear is lighter and performs much better - full stop. A $30 Coleman sleeping bag rated at 50F would probably take-up half my pack - you see where I'm going here. Things cost what they cost, I live in a city where the average house price is 1 million, for a crack shack - it's $%#&ing retarded, but that's the deal. $1000 bux worth of camping gear is nothing, hell 75% of the guys on these forums are walking around with $400 folders in their pockets. A new tent, a pack, a sleeping bag, and a few other things [stove, pots etc] is $1K easy and that's nowhere near high-end. Now to be constructive.

Super cheap gear is fine for the occasional, non demanding trip, but a $25 tent isn't going to cut it in the mountains when the weather goes south. Totally depends on what you want to do. Car camping - sure go cheap, but serious backpacking will require a few adjustments. My suggestion, BUY USED. You get awesome gear for cheap gear prices. Case in point, I just sold an older model Therm-a-rest for $30. I also just sold a $400 pack for $180. Both perfectly fine. Figure out what you want [do lots of research] and start to look for it on Craigslist etc. I notice you're in the PNW - there's a used store in Seattle called 2nd Ascent, I've heard good things. Don't buy new cheap gear, unless it's a decent buy. Buy the good stuff, but buy used. Even sleeping bags, just launder them in giant commercial front loader.

I could never have afforded all my gear at once, I've bought it s-l-o-w-l-y since 1993. I totally understand how you'd be frustrated, even REI house brand is expensive. So buy good used gear especially for the big three: tent, pack, sleeping bag ... and then supplement with cheaper stuff.
 
I understand what you are saying, redpoint, but you must realize that the $180 used bag you sold is far beyond the means of me. That is unless I wanted to go into the wilderness with nothing but an empty bag.

I knew this thread would spark some controversy but a lot of people just don't understand the level of "cheapness" that some of us have to deal with.

Maybe in many years When the economy improves and my skills (Porsche/Ferrari/Lambo mecahnic) are in need I'll be able to spend $180 (2 days pay now) on an piece of used equipment.
 
Car camping and day hiking, can be done really cheaply!

By the time I got to college, I was already a VERY well equipped backpacker, so that was never an issue. But now, after years of thrashing my knees out on the trail, I fear my backpacking days are over. It's car camping and day hikes these days, and you know what, I am really enjoying not having to keep up with the latest equipment....and I don't have to deal with the yuppies that I use to meet on the trail either!
 
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Buy what you can afford, one piece at a time, and you'll eventually have decent kit that didn't kill you to get. I'm not gonna apologize for not only wanting, but having some of the best gear money can buy, as that's my thing. I don't drink often, I don't smoke, I work hard and this stuff is cheap in comparison to some hobbies(the chrome on my brother's Harley costs more than eveything I can put into my Mountain Hardwear pack:eek:)
For easy goin days car camping, you can make do, but more committed excursions require more durable gear, or the willingness to be less comfortable. It's all about priorities in my mind. Another option for you might be to look for some work in the putdoor industry? I'm a seasonal kayak guide and instructor leading to pro deals that equal huge discounts. Just a thought.
 
Hard to analyze human behavior. "Gear" means different things to different people. There are actually folks around that NEVER use their stuff. They buy it, or say they do, and talk about it in their alternative reality internet world.
There are folks that are out 'doing' it every week. Some use the best, some use whatever, and yes, some get online and discuss the ups and downs of each choice.

I use a mix of gear. Some top of the line, some bargain basement. I usually try to find the best gear for the job, based on cost/value. On Occasion I even get it right. :)

What you can pay for your stuff does vary widely. When I was a young lad, married with kids, I could not afford much at all. I used hand me downs, yard sale stuff and made a lot of my gear.

Now, retired with little debt load, and with years of planning behind me, I can pretty much pop for what I want. Took many lean years to get here though.
 
The gear is part of the fun for me. I don't get to go out as often as I would like anymore... a handful of times per year now, working too much. But with working so much comes more disposable income which allows me to afford shiner toys, including better gear for the woods.

But I certainly don't NEED these expensive things. Would my $30 walmart pack manage a day hike as well as my more expensive (and heavier :( ) maxpedition pack? Sure. Would a Mora whittle sticks to pass the time by the fire just as well as one of my Busses or Bark Rivers? Absolutely.

And you could certainly argue that my working more to buy better gear keeps me from actually enjoying the outdoors, and that I should cut back the work and use cheaper gear. Unfortunately in the business I'm in, it's feast or famine. You're either working 60 hours a week, or you're not working at all. There is no 8 hour day.
 
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