Cost of equipment

I've been there. I'm nearing retirement, I'll be done working, except for myself, in a little over two years. I have some high end stuff, I can afford it, but I also enjoy getting out there with the $14.00 hammock, home made tarp, mora and the simple 20 lbs and pack purchased from an on line Milsurp store.

Actually when I think about it 35-40 years ago when I was camping, in school and broke I wasn't even aware that expensive camping equipment existed.
 
Strong back and good heart make up for crappy pack and bulky bag.

I agree with some of the opinions, but high end stuff is mostly about comfort. Grin and bear it and enjoy. I don't know why everybody keeps saying the outdoors is so dangerous. Sheez, I was camping alone when I was 14 and that involved a k-mart bag with deer print on it and the remnants of a leaky canvas tent that my uncle tried to throw away.
 
We all love to show off are shiny new "toys" now and again but realistically the basic gear needed to enjoy the outdoors doesn't need to break the bank.
 
As much as I like shiny new toys, I still get more satisfaction and more of a charge out of home made o rmodded gear. Amazing what you can do with some tip snips, leatherman a dremel and a questionable aethetic. Link's to an odl thread I posted in the HI Cantina, shows a stove I put together out of duct steel. Matched my lil' whisper stove in setting a 1L enamel coffee pot to boiling, adn kept my (then 12 yr old) son busy feeding it wood and air.

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=371373

Scrounge, snip, braid, sew, snipe (auctions and garage sales, not people walking out of REI with stuff you want), improvise, adapt, and overcome! Most of all have fun. Had some of my best times day hiking in the woods, chucking rocks into a lake or natural berm with slings my son and I braided out of jute twine, 550 cord etc. Cheaper than a ball game, and more fun by far
 
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You kids today don't know how good you got it! When I wuz yer age I wuz grateful fer whut I had -- and you know whut I had? I had nuthin'! :mad:

Seriously, when I started backpacking I was in my early teens. I had no gear and no money. (But I wuz happy! :mad:) I read Colin Fletcher's Complete Walker (from the library, of course) so I knew about expensive gear, but there was no way I could afford any of that stuff. Fortunately I also had a 1940s era Boy Scout Handbook (an invaluable resource, far better than later editions) and the library had some of Bradford Angier's books. I made blanket pins out of wire coathangers -- make oversize safety pins and pin up an old wool blanket and you got yerself a sleeping bag. Not because I couldn't afford a good sleeping bag -- because I couldn't afford any sleeping bag! Eventually I got a display model that had been sitting in the window so long the sun had faded part of it, so I was able to get it for four or five dollars. Until then I used blanket pins or borrowed a sleeping bag.

I had a canvas knapsack that was smaller than the bookbags every kid has today. I had to tie my blanket roll or borrowed sleeping bag to the outside with imitation parachute cord. Cheap imitation parachute cord is fine for most purposes; most of the time you don't need 550 pounds tensile strength. Eventually I got an external frame pack at a discount store, and that was immensely better than the plain ol' knapsacks the kids I went camping with had. (Theirs were bigger than my little old knapsack, but no frame, no padding, no hip belt -- just a sack with shoulder straps, a flap on top, and one or two external pockets.) My frame pack was wonderful! On the second trip it broke where the bag attached to the frame; I lashed that corner of the bag to the frame with imitation parachute cord. It lasted me for years with a few repairs. I bought a padded hip belt for it, and later bought nice padded shoulder straps. I still have that pack, though I haven't used it for quite a while. It cost me more than $10, I think....

I had an army mess kit of my father's. It sucked. Then I bought a modern thin aluminum mess kit at a discount store. That sucked too. You can't buy anything that bad these days.... I made a pot out of a coffee can. I loved that pot; I used to brag on it and people would look at me funny.... I gave it a bail handle and bent a spout into it for pouring and made a lid from a peanut butter jar lid, cut it out with tin snips for the spout. It was lightweight and I believed it was far better than any storebought pot. I guess I still believe that, come to think of it.... I kept my pot and messkit in plastic bags and never cleaned off the carbon. The carbon coating distributes the heat more evenly.

I couldn't afford freeze-dried backpacking food. I ate canned food, mostly Spam. I pretty much lived on Spam when I went camping, and the guy I went camping with the most pretty much lived on Minute Rice. When we went camping together we shared. Canned food is heavy -- so we only carried a couple days worth. If we wanted to stay out longer we planted caches. I had several caches and kept them stocked.

Colin Fletcher made his Svea stove sound wonderful, but I couldn't possibly come up with that kind of money. I used Sterno and I built fires of twigs.

Water purification tablets cost money. I carried an eyedropper bottle of bleach -- two drops per quart and wait half an hour.

Some kids had pup tents but they sucked and they were expensive -- $20! Ackkkkkkkk! I preferred a plastic tarp. Even when I grew up and had money to buy a tent I didn't for a long time -- I decided a tarp is better. I still think a tarp is better most of the time. Bugs? Don't camp in a goldurn swamp you goldurn idjit! Camp on a ridge and use bug repellent to keep off the occasional mosquito that might go that high. I camped mostly in hot weather and my favorite tarp configuration was to raise the bottom six inches or a foot above the ground for ventilation. I used a plastic poncho for a ground cloth. Sometimes I used two ponchos instead of a poncho and tarp.

My loaded pack weighed about the same as Colin Fletcher's. I didn't have food for as long but I used caches. I didn't carry unnecessary junk like binoculars, camera, stove (which I couldn't afford anyway, of course).... I ended up with the same weight as him. Nyaa nyaaaa! :p

The big investments were the external frame pack -- discount store junk-grade, but immensely better for heavy loads than a knapsack, and the sleeping bag, also discount store junk-grade and discounted further for the sun damage, but better warmth to weight ratio than the old blankets I used previously. I didn't camp in cold weather. Oh, I bought an air mattress, too. The cheapest plastic ones (less than $2 then) didn't last so I saved up for a coated fabric one, the most expensive one the discount store had at about 8 or $9. I used it for swimming, too, got a lot of use out of it.
 
I didn't mention knives, did I. I carried a pocketknife at all times, various slip-joints and lockbacks. (I would lose them and buy a new one, and occasionally I would find the one I'd lost and then I would have two for a while!) I had an old Boy Scout knife that was too heavy and thick for comfortable pocket carry so I usually carried it in my pack. It had a can-opener blade and a leather punch. The can-opener was essential. The screwdriver and bottle opener and corkscrew, not so much.

Later I got a puukko and I would carry that in the woods (in addition to my pocketknife) just because I loved knives. I never did anything with it that I couldn't have done with my pocketknife. I never cut or split wood for a fire. There are plenty of dead birch trees in the woods around here and birchbark will get a fire going no matter how long it's been raining. My father had a hatchet I could have brought camping (my brother often did) but I considered it far too heavy. When I wanted to cut a sapling for a staff or a tarp pole I would whittle through it with my pocketknife like felling a tree with an axe. (I had never heard of batoning.)

I always had a compass, and eventually I bought a good Suunto compass. Before that it was toys, but they would point north.
 
Y'know, I never used a pad until I was an adult! Now I couldn't continue backpacking without one.
 
I'm all about being thrifty with my gear. It's not hard to find good qualtiy stuff at budget prices and for me, my gear needs to be "replaceable". What does that mean...well if it's too expensive to replace then I don't want it.

My boots have to be pretty decent but you can always find good deals but expect to spend $100 on a good long lasting pair of boots.

Knives, I feel there's no need to spend more than about $50-60 on a decent fixed blade. Becker Campanion is an example of an affordable yet awesome knife. Add a $25 Victorinox Pioneer and you have cutting tools covered.

Shelter or tents, use your imagination here. Good tents are pricey but a lean to with a tarp works in warm weather. Used tents can be found for cheap at yard sales or craigs list.

Sleeping bags are always on sale at the big department stores.

Some cooking stuff and a cooler and your set. No need to drop lots of cash to go camping and the less stuff you bring the more fun you will have!

Collecter
 
I use a lot of military surplus.
Go to the dollar store.
Goodwill.
Yard sales.
Be creative.
Google for some of the "common man bush kit" videos.
All offer lower cost alternitives
 
+1 for military surplus...

1) Shelter halfs (old school with no floor) - This is how we rolled in Boy Scouts. You will need two of them and the wooden poles.

2) Military Mummy Bag - you can get regular or cold weather. The new 3 piece bags are pretty nice (well new circa 1997).

3) Alice Pack - still see them on the trails.

4) Used Military Boots - Have hiked in them (both in Boy Scouts and later in USMC). They get the job done.

Another good resource is local outdoor stores that rent equipment. They usually "refresh" their stock and sell off the rental equipment. I have seen incredible deals on some great gear!

www.steepandcheap.com

If you look around, there are good deals to be had on good equipment. It is just a matter of are you willing to buy a used piece of gear (NOT recommended for anything that you will trust your life with, i.e. Climbing Gear, etc).

Or buy a tarp (shelter), wool Army blanket (warmth) and cook on a camp fire. Ultra cheap!

I have heard Good, Fast and Cheap; pick two in the business world.

I would say Good, Lite and Cheap; pick two for outdoor equipment. It can be Good and Lite but it will not be Cheap. It can be Lite and Cheap but it will not be Good. It can be Good and Cheap but it will not be Lite.


Happy Hunting!

Nathanial4
 
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...Now that I'm done ranting, why don't we start a thread based solely on gear that someone on, say, a college student's budget could obtain?...

Send me an E-mail. I have enough left-overs from the military and survival outings that I can send you some. How's about I give you a list of what I have, and you let me know what you're interested in? I just need to know where you're located and what size of clothing you wear (no use sending you a sleeping bag and knit shirt for a 6'0" man if you're 7' tall).
 
Don't be discouraged by your modest means. Choose to view it as a challenge towards acquiring the necessary gear. Do not allow yourself to be gloomy about this. Make a conscious decision to choose to be positive and upbeat. This will help not only your morale, but your performance.

Good Luck.


Oh yeah. I was in the store the other day, and watched a poor, bum-looking guy paying $7 for a single pack of smokes. Who the heck can afford that vice nowadays? Was he paying that much everyday for smokes? That's $50 wasted bucks each week.
 
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The cost decent camping equipment is absurd. Most people can't/won't go out every weekend so justifying $100 on a poncho that you can sleep under seems absurd. $200 for a bivvy? No thanks. I've been looking around this and other campin/backpacking/survival forums and some people carry over $1000 worth of gear for a weekend camping trip! I love being outdoors. Hell, I moved from Dallas, TX to the Pacific Northwest specifically for that reason. But I almost never go camping without a car because I simply cannot afford the gear.

Another thing that irks me on this and many forums is the elitism. People will only recommend the top of the line equipment and will often look down on someone for using something lesser that is in their price range. This is not the thread for that.

I know there is some equipment that should you should not cut corners on for the sake of personal safety, so that is not what I am discussing.

Now that I'm done ranting, why don't we start a thread based solely on gear that someone on, say, a college student's budget could obtain? Or better yet, things they can make from inexpensive items?

Sorry for sounding so irritated, but I just saw the price for a hammock that was over $500 and it didn't include a scantily clad woman serving you drinks with little umbrellas in them.

Wow, thats some expencive gear. There are plenty of less expencive alternatives out there. Do you need a $100,000 SUV to go camping? Heck no, so why would you need a $500 hammock when a $20 to $40 will do. There are tons of threads talking about inexpencive gear.

There is a thread on here about Teepees. The OP uses hardware store blue or brown tarps instead of the $500 to $1,000 cotton duct. My mom has some Lodge Poles in her back yard that I've claimed so I can do the same thing. Might cost me $100 for my Teepee that normally is up to or more then $1,000 just for the canvas.

An old computer Power supply can be made into a stove. Doesn't cost much if anything and weighs almost nothing. Then again an Espit stove and fuel should only set you back $10 or so.

I went backpacking last weekend with a $385 MSRP pack from Blackhawk. Cost me $225 used in the Gear For sale forum. Guy was gifted it but wanted something smaller so I got a good deal. A friend spent less then $50 on his external frame pack durring a Clearence sale at Cabelas a few weeks ago. Same with his 3 season sleeping bag.

If you need help finding good deals on good quality stuff, feel free to post asking questions or email me. A list of what you want and your price range will help. Also a list of what you are doing helps because you might be asking for the wrong stuff with out knowing it. The more information we have, the more we can help.

Heber
 
XSrcing, this is what I find great about this site. Not only do we have people from every walk of life and every experience level giving you the benefit of their experience, we have, invaiably, some who are willing to help you get outfitted on the cheap. :thumbup:

Way to go guys! :thumbup: :)
 
If you want cheap and durable, military surplus is often the best way to go.

Get a Medium ALICE pack (with or without frame), a couple of Army Wool blankets, a couple of canteen kits (canteen, cup and stove in the pouch -- can ride on a belt or on the pack).

Get some decent cutlery (for about 20 years my outdoors blades were a Buck 110, a Ka-Bar USMC, and an Estwing hatchet).

Raid your medicine cabinet for a basic first aid kit. Raid the cupboards for camp food (crusty bread like baguettes last longer in the field, peanut butter, SPAM, rice, mashed potato flakes, etc).

Raid your closet for seasonally appropriate clothing.

If you are staying overnight or longer "in the weather" a Wal-Mart tarp. some 550 cord or even clothesline, or a surplus pup tent work.

Some strike anywhere matches, Bic lighter and cotton balls or dryer lint make a good fire kit.

Cook with your canteen cups, or get a surplus mess kit (about the same price and won't fall apart the first time like the Wal-Mart kits), or bring the smallest pot you own.

No biggie.



Best reason to start cheap, is you may not know how you like to camp, or what you like to use. Better to dial in your preferences on cheap stuff that doesn't cost a lot and is easier to flip when the time comes to get rid of it. After some experience, you'll come up with a bunch of "It'd be nice if [piece of gear] di this, or had that feature", then you save you money while wringing things out until you find the better piece of gear that fits what YOU want it to do.

Which is a large part of why you see some of the high $ equipment here. Someone's been doing something for umpteen years and finally dropped the bank on what they really want, rather than just making do. I see no more virtue in making do with something when you can buy what you want, than I do with buying something expensive, just because it's a status thing, not because it's what you really want.

Some things you may never change. I've tried a lot of high-end stuff, but I haven't found anything that can replace my cheap-ass GI Poncho. I've tried the new-fangled cooksets and bottles and such, but when it comes down to it, I almost alwasy go with my GI canteen kits instead.

Bought a Kifaru backpack. When I got done accessorizing it and stood back to look, I said "Great, I just made a $1000 ALICE pack."

When I go light, I don't use an ultralight backpack, I use my GI web gear. I even drew up a set of custom gear I was going to make or have made. But I didn't. Why?
Because it would be a custom leather set of WEB GEAR!! :D

Some things are worth ditching. I love the quaintness of my pup tent. But since I almost always go alone, carrying the 12 pounds of it gets old, fast. A Sil Tarp is much nicer. But a polyurethane tarp would work just as well, just not be as small. And those don't have to be blue, either. Wal-Mart had a nice one that was brown with a sort of dull silver on the other side -- good for stringing up benind you to reflect the fire's warmth back at you.
 
A tarp,rope,sharp knife,water(carried or treated)sleeping bag,basic first aid kit, mess kit and whatever food(canned or otherwise)a surplus alice pack to carry it in and bushcraft skills are needed.In the past I've used this very gear backpacking and canoe camping(personal favorite) and enjoyed every minute of it.Fallknivens and Hennesy Hammocks are nice but not "needs"in my book.Personally I'm more impressed by the guy with a tarp and bag then the folks with the latest everything.
 
I started with a WW2 surplus harness and butt pack, aluminum canteen, mess kit and blanket and poncho combo. I used a SAK or a K-bar. As I got accessories, they went into ammo pouches clipped onto the belt.

Oddly, I find myself slowly paring away all the high end newfangled stuff I collected over the years and the end result is pretty much resembling the old web gear set up.

+1 for the Web Gear mentioned by Cpl Punishment!
 
Food ===> Ramen Noodles and Oatmeal. Both are just add boiling water, good energy and VERY CHEAP!

Had too many Ramen noodles in college....

+2 on the web gear. I still have the set my parents bought me (used) when I was in the 5th grade!
 
The cost decent camping equipment is absurd. Most people can't/won't go out every weekend so justifying $100 on a poncho that you can sleep under seems absurd. $200 for a bivvy? No thanks. I've been looking around this and other campin/backpacking/survival forums and some people carry over $1000 worth of gear for a weekend camping trip! I love being outdoors. Hell, I moved from Dallas, TX to the Pacific Northwest specifically for that reason. But I almost never go camping without a car because I simply cannot afford the gear.


One word for you: MILSURP! One of my most-used daypacks was a brand new Swiss military surplus rucksack that cost me $16. I have lots of military surplus camping/hiking/outdoor gear that was so inexpensive it's hard to believe it when using/enjoying the stuff. The ubiquitous "blue tarp" is cheap and extremely versatile as a shelter.

A billy can made from a coffee can with a coat-hangar wire bail and a few other choice cans/tins/containers that would normally be tossed in the trash provide all the camp cookware and kitchenware you'd ever need.

And don't forget the $10 Mora or Opinel knife!

You CAN afford all the camping gear you need. I say the notion that you can't (and the complaint of elitism here) is all in your head....

Stay sharp,
desmobob
 
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